What is a Church?

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RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#1
I'm seeing a trend here, of people thinking you don't have to go to 'church' to be close to God. It's true that so many churches have gone astray from the will of God, but then again one is not to forsake the assembly. I guess that would be the qualifier, what is it that makes up an assembly?
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#2
Ephesians 2:19-22

"19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21 In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit."

That's the Church. Not a building made with hands.
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#3
Also, I think this is a good definition of assembly

Matthew 18:20

"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."
 
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BeanieD

Guest
#4
I don't believe this requires the attendance to an organized church, but to have fellowship with other Christians at any time and any place.
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#5
An assembly is a group of people who are your equals in their desire to follow Jesus (note I did not say in success, gifting, training or anything else, just in their desire), and with whom you are not afraid to share the ups and downs of your Christian walk. Originally such people prayed, testified, encouraged each other, and ministered together. This is what became the church, when the intimacy was lost to a reliable "program" for the sake of accomodating more people.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#6
I've noticed that Jesus never spoke to a scheduled crowd, He mostly spoke when the people gathered spontaneously. And while the early apostles and followers met regularly, I don't recall it ever being a repetitive time (ie 10 am every Sunday), but again as they were able to meet. So obviously the buildings and the time frame doesn't define it. But what else does? Does 3 friends gathering to chat do it? Or does the assembly have to have some sort of framework and leadership?

Is a Christian who never goes to any kind of church, but relies only on a gathering with friends, meeting the requirement to assemble?
 
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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#7
i love church.
it's awesome and i look forward to it every week.
gathering as a body face to face and singing and hearing the word and taking the bread and wine is a GIFT.
and God ordained we do it.

BLESSINGS!:)

when i didn't have a church i suffered because of it.

I LOVE MY CHURCH.
hopefully i'll eventually be making my way up the aisle with a walker or a wheelchair; like lots of the lifers do.
and when i die my pastor will bury me.
 
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SpaceCowboy

Guest
#8
A church is a group of people who've put their faith in Jesus Christ who gather together to worship God and have fellowship with one another.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#9
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
(Act 2:41-42)

Let me recap.
1.The Gospel preached (they that received his word)
2. Baptism
3. the saved a.k.a. saints (3000 souls)
4. Scriptural Teaching (apostles doctrine...stedfastly at that)
5. Fellowship (including bearing one another's burdens)
6. Communion (breaking of bread)
7. Prayers

....no, no bingo.
 
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NiceneCreed

Guest
#10
I'm seeing a trend here, of people thinking you don't have to go to 'church' to be close to God. It's true that so many churches have gone astray from the will of God, but then again one is not to forsake the assembly. I guess that would be the qualifier, what is it that makes up an assembly?

The Body of Christ.
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#11
I've noticed that Jesus never spoke to a scheduled crowd, He mostly spoke when the people gathered spontaneously. And while the early apostles and followers met regularly, I don't recall it ever being a repetitive time (ie 10 am every Sunday), but again as they were able to meet. So obviously the buildings and the time frame doesn't define it. But what else does? Does 3 friends gathering to chat do it? Or does the assembly have to have some sort of framework and leadership?

Is a Christian who never goes to any kind of church, but relies only on a gathering with friends, meeting the requirement to assemble?
That's not quite correct, but is mostly so. The 12,000 He fed with the loaves and fishes were gathered by the 12 and the further 70 on their apostolic mission, as you will see if you place the gospels side by side with respect to those passages. Your conclusion is correct and is based on most of his ministry, but I cannot imagine spontaneous fellowship not growing into some type of regular planned meeting. With God there, people will certainly enjoy it enough to want it to continue. The mandatory assemblies of the OT were the three pilgrimage feasts (with Hannukah added later), but the synagogue system is a well attested man-made addition, and this is the word used for "assembly" in Heb. 10:25, and modelled in I Cor. 14.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#12
I see your point, thank you. But again, the loaves and fishes assembly was spontaneous, Jesus didn't put out commercials for two weeks before the event screaming "Sunday Sunday Sunday". No, it was hey go get some people together, kinda like that parable of the Kings feast where he sent the call out to any who were immediately willing to come. I would imagine the Church schedule thing is just that, a way for humans to all agree to meet at a certain place and time. But with churches being hijacked from the truth more and more these days, the question becomes what is an acceptable alternative? I like Crossnote's list, even if you did these things only among a couple people I would consider that the assembly. I don't think it's so much the size of the gathering, but it's agenda.

Nicene, since you're part of the Body of Christ every where you go, does that mean you're meeting the assembly command everywhere you go? There's nothing more you need to do than just exist as part of the Body?
 
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Abiding

Guest
#13
how can you spontaneously disciple anyone?
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#14
But again, the loaves and fishes assembly was spontaneous, Jesus didn't put out commercials for two weeks before the event screaming "Sunday Sunday Sunday".

the question becomes what is an acceptable alternative?
I think that's exactly what He did. Walk it through in your head. There are 82 people (41 pairs) going between villages of maybe 60-100 people each. There was no modern communication, and they were under Roman oppression. One does not get 12,000 people in one place (out too far from a restaurant) under those conditions without a plan.

Acceptable alternative in my mind is a little group you start yourself or join when someone else starts it that is networked with other little groups.
 
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Nancyer

Guest
#15
A hymn we sing quite often is I Am The Church.

I am the church, you are the church, we are the church, together.
All who follow Jesus, all around the world, Yes, we're the church together.
The church is not a building, the church is not a steeple, the church is not a resting place,
The church is a people.
(repeat first 2 lines)
We're many kinds of people, with many kinds of faces,
All colors and all ages, from all different places.

Very true. Short, but sweet.
 
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Nancyer

Guest
#16
I see your point, thank you. But again, the loaves and fishes assembly was spontaneous, Jesus didn't put out commercials for two weeks before the event screaming "Sunday Sunday Sunday". No, it was hey go get some people together, kinda like that parable of the Kings feast where he sent the call out to any who were immediately willing to come. I would imagine the Church schedule thing is just that, a way for humans to all agree to meet at a certain place and time. But with churches being hijacked from the truth more and more these days, the question becomes what is an acceptable alternative? I like Crossnote's list, even if you did these things only among a couple people I would consider that the assembly. I don't think it's so much the size of the gathering, but it's agenda.
This has been one of the things that makes me go WOW! How Jesus's messages were spread, how He managed to teach to crowds (I always picture the Loaves & Fishes crowd, how Jesus's words reached the outskirts of people) and how they knew He was coming, knew He was there. Information had to travel at a snail's pace by today's standards, although I'm sure Jesus's messages spread faster than other messages. To me this makes Christianity all the more amazing, that it could spread as far as it has, and that it sustained the original messages.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#17
I think that's exactly what He did. Walk it through in your head. There are 82 people (41 pairs) going between villages of maybe 60-100 people each. There was no modern communication, and they were under Roman oppression. One does not get 12,000 people in one place (out too far from a restaurant) under those conditions without a plan.

Acceptable alternative in my mind is a little group you start yourself or join when someone else starts it that is networked with other little groups.
Well, I looked it up again and found this:

Mark 6:30: And the apostles gathered themselves together unto Jesus, and told him all things, both what they had done, and what they had taught. 31And he said unto them, Come ye yourselves apart into a desert place, and rest a while: for there were many coming and going, and they had no leisure so much as to eat. 32And they departedinto a desert place by ship privately.33And the people saw them departing, and many knew him, and ran afoot thither out of all cities, and outwent them, and came together unto him (KJV)



So the gathering WAS spontaneous, Jesus didn't even send the disciples out to attract them. The crowd gathered on it's own.
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
586
113
#18
...what is a church?
Matt 18v20: "For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them."

Acts 2v46 (with Rom 16v3,5): "...and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart."
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#19
Well, I looked it up again and found this:

Mark 6:30: And the apostles gathered themselves together unto Jesus, and told him all things, both what they had done, and what they had taught. 31And he said unto them, Come ye yourselves apart into a desert place, and rest a while: for there were many coming and going, and they had no leisure so much as to eat. 32And they departedinto a desert place by ship privately.33And the people saw them departing, and many knew him, and ran afoot thither out of all cities, and outwent them, and came together unto him (KJV)



So the gathering WAS spontaneous, Jesus didn't even send the disciples out to attract them. The crowd gathered on it's own.
Yes, I started a thread to discuss this, and the gathering was spontaneous. In the context of Mark and Luke, I'm sure sending the 12 out raised awareness. All four gospels report Herod's realization of how bad a problem Jesus' ministry was becoming for him, around this time also. The correct version appears to be a spontaneous gathering, but aided by these two events.