SHOW DOWN AT HIGH NOON LAW VERSES THE CROSS!!!

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
I have not received any answer on these points., if you could please address the points raised concerning

1. Jesus saying the law will not be abolished until the heavens disappear and

2. Jesus told his followers to learn the law from the Pharisees and practice it just before he ascended into heaven.


3. When Jesus told the apostles to go preach to the Gentiles, he did not tell them the law no longer applied because the rock of his church was still referring to meat being unclean long after he ascended.

Quoting contradicting verses is not helpful for your argument.
These threads will go on forever if people keep their minds closed.
  1. Whether the law is abolished or not is irrelevant. Believers are dead to the law, so it exerts no authority over them.
  2. Jesus told the people to listen to the Pharisees because they were under the old covenant. The new covenant did not exist. So this was a right and expected thing to do.
  3. This point is not even worth addressing.
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
Again the question remains unanswered: Did He nullify His teachings on the cross? I'm not talking about the law here but rather HIS OWN TEACHINGS.
Many could only see the significance of love in His teachings. What about His other teachings such as Matt 5:21-32? Are they nullified and nailed to the cross?
Matt 5:21-32 looks like love to me.
 
Oct 14, 2013
4,750
21
0
  1. Whether the law is abolished or not is irrelevant. Believers are dead to the law, so it exerts no authority over them.
  2. Jesus told the people to listen to the Pharisees because they were under the old covenant. The new covenant did not exist. So this was a right and expected thing to do.
  3. This point is not even worth addressing.

please shew what law are believers dead to ?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
14,842
80
48
I have not received any answer on these points., if you could please address the points raised concerning

1. Jesus saying the law will not be abolished until the heavens disappear and

2. Jesus told his followers to learn the law from the Pharisees and practice it just before he ascended into heaven.


3. When Jesus told the apostles to go preach to the Gentiles, he did not tell them the law no longer applied because the rock of his church was still referring to meat being unclean long after he ascended.

Quoting contradicting verses is not helpful for your argument.
These threads will go on forever if people keep their minds closed.
1. Jesus saying the law will not be abolished until the heavens disappear and

He came to fulfill, it in the one's that believe. No one could ever fulfill it the Laws of Moses, not even Moses.
Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

Not all have come to believe this or see this that they can't fulfill the Law as in ever being perfect, ever.
Just sin once and you are guilty.
what is left for the Law to do is lead the rest to new life, to serve its purpose in showing us that we are the one's weak, our flesh nature that is, not the laws of God.

2. Jesus told his followers to learn the law from the Pharisees and practice it just before he ascended into heaven.
But to not do as they did, taking it for granted to use it against others.
Before one can see they need to want to see, and the start to see is to want to serve God and God only.
Born of the flesh, then born of the Spirit of God
If you do not desire to know God, how will you ever discover the freedom found in and through Christ at the cross of?

3. When Jesus told the apostles to go preach to the Gentiles, he did not tell them the law no longer applied because the rock of his church was still referring to meat being unclean long after he ascended
And Peter had three dreams in that God told him to kill and eat, and Peter refused to eat anything unclean and God said to not call anything unclean that God has (past tense) cleaned. and Peter went and preached to the Gentiles and they received by belief not any rituals and Peter remembered what God had Said about Baptism. Acts 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. Acts 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

What are the Laws today? Are they the Ten commandments and or the 613 others in the Ten?
Or are they the Laws of Love? Does not the Love of God fulfill all Law?



The new commands are these.
1.Believe in Jesus Christ (I John 3:23)
2.Hope in God’s promises (1 John 3:1-3)
3.Love God and people. (John 13:33-34, Romans 5:5)

Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

And as I see it there you go, praying we both grow in this amazing salvation that I personally have no desire to take for granted, and you?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
14,842
80
48
Again the question remains unanswered: Did He nullify His teachings on the cross? I'm not talking about the law here but rather HIS OWN TEACHINGS.
Many could only see the significance of love in His teachings. What about His other teachings such as Matt 5:21-32? Are they nullified and nailed to the cross?
As said before all Law and Prophets are fulfilled in him. One being in him are also fulfilled by him in them with the Laws of Love
Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

what are these new Laws through Christ after the cross?
[h=3]1 Corinthians 13:13[/h]Living Bible (TLB)


[SUP]13 [/SUP]There are three things that remain—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
No flesh could ever fill the Law of Levites, not even those priests.

Oh and maybe think on this wise, is there a before and after the cross?

So before under Law of Moses yes, Levitical Priesthood? Does that not show our inability to be perfect and in need of new life? Being of the flesh nature.
So now after the cross, the resurrection and ascension, are we under the curse of the flesh still or are we offered the gift from Father to be made alive in Father's spirit to be led in Father's love to all?
Ephesians 1:13
in whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.




 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
14,842
80
48
Of course not; he nullified the law of Moses.
Actually Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses and Prophets that testified of his coming for every believer, not all that are going to come to belief is filled yet, so the Law is still, in place for the Law breakers to be led to trust Christ alone for salvation unto Father and there is no other way
John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
 
C

chubbena

Guest
As said before all Law and Prophets are fulfilled in him. One being in him are also fulfilled by him in them with the Laws of Love
Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

what are these new Laws through Christ after the cross?
1 Corinthians 13:13

Living Bible (TLB)


[SUP]13 [/SUP]There are three things that remain—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
No flesh could ever fill the Law of Levites, not even those priests.

Oh and maybe think on this wise, is there a before and after the cross?

So before under Law of Moses yes, Levitical Priesthood? Does that not show our inability to be perfect and in need of new life? Being of the flesh nature.
So now after the cross, the resurrection and ascension, are we under the curse of the flesh still or are we offered the gift from Father to be made alive in Father's spirit to be led in Father's love to all?
Ephesians 1:13
in whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.




My question was directed to those who believe the law that comes thru Moses is nullified but I guess you answered well in post #132.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
14,842
80
48
My question was directed to those who believe the law that comes thru Moses is nullified but I guess you answered well in post #132.
I see this if we would all listen to each others story, being wise as serpents and harmless as doves, there is much to be learned from each other
Thanks I have learned as you might have too. either way we are like Apples on a tree that when first born we are born perfect and I am speaking in the Spirit, just not yet mature and need maturing as in Heb. 5:10-6:6 really important to me to grow, even though I am saved, do not believe in taking it for granted
 
C

chubbena

Guest
I see this if we would all listen to each others story, being wise as serpents and harmless as doves, there is much to be learned from each other
Thanks I have learned as you might have too. either way we are like Apples on a tree that when first born we are born perfect and I am speaking in the Spirit, just not yet mature and need maturing as in Heb. 5:10-6:6 really important to me to grow, even though I am saved, do not believe in taking it for granted
Unfortunately some being serpent and harmful when it comes to discussions on our differences. I hope it's just the process to maturity.
With trembling and fear.
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
Unfortunately some being serpent and harmful when it comes to discussions on our differences. I hope it's just the process to maturity.
With trembling and fear.
You certainly are a hypocritical person. Accusing others of ad hominem attacks while you participate in such:

That's the best you could come up with?
Your slip is showing.
 
Last edited:

Drett

Senior Member
Feb 16, 2013
1,663
38
48
  1. Whether the law is abolished or not is irrelevant. Believers are dead to the law, so it exerts no authority over them.
  2. Jesus told the people to listen to the Pharisees because they were under the old covenant. The new covenant did not exist. So this was a right and expected thing to do.
  3. This point is not even worth addressing.
1. Stuck on point 1 so ignoring it I guess.

2. At least you made some attempt. Jesus told his followers, who were to spread his message to the gentiles, to learn from those in the seat of Moses. They were still following the law while preaching.

Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: [SUP]2 [/SUP]“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. [SUP]3 [/SUP]So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. [SUP]4 [/SUP]They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

3. Stuck on point 3 so ignoring it I guess. This thread will go on forever. :)
 
Last edited:

Drett

Senior Member
Feb 16, 2013
1,663
38
48
If the cheerleaders can step now from the debate so we have some chance to complete this thread. :)
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
1. Stuck on point 1 so ignoring it I guess.

2. At least you made some attempt. Jesus told his followers, who were to spread his message to the gentiles, to learn from those in the seat of Moses. They were still following the law while preaching.

Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: [SUP]2 [/SUP]“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. [SUP]3 [/SUP]So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. [SUP]4 [/SUP]They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

3. Stuck on point 3 so ignoring it I guess. This thread will go on forever. :)
Sure it will go on forever (at least until the lord returns) as long as you are in denial that believers are dead to the law. Never hear a peep out of anyone about this.

Point 2, you didn't offer any rebuttal, just quoted scripture. What's the point. My point addressed that scripture.
Point 3 is worthy to be ignored.