Attack of the Judaizers

danschance · Jan 5, 2014

Recently I have noticed a greater influence of modern day Judaizers here at CC. A Modern Judaizer is that believes another gospel. They believe and post another gospel of Christ plus a portion of mosaic law. Paul wrote the book of Galatians to counter Judaizers of his day.

Paul wrote:

The false gospel of the Judaizers never leads one to salvation. They teach a contradiction of grace plus law. The Galation Judaizers taught that one must follow Christ and be circumcised. Today the modern Judaizers teach "Christ plus sabbath observance" or "Christ plus Kosher foods", etc. What they do not realize is that any gospel message of Christ plus anything is a false Gospel. A little leaven leavens the whole dough.

This is why Paul wrote:

This false gospel severs a person from salvation. They are not fit for the kingdom and those who follow them are at risk of being cut off from Christ.

I never wish to get into a debate over denominational theology because some things do not cause a loss of salvation. On the other hand, I feel compelled to warn Judaizers in hopes they turn from the false gospel to the true gospel which saves.

just-me · Jan 5, 2014

danschance said:

Do you think they are going to hell, and have no faith, and distort the law as the Pharisees did? Not to debate, just wanting to know. You gave good warning if they are destined for eternal death.

1 Samuel 16:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart.

John 7:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

Josh321 · Jan 5, 2014

danschance said:

great effort brother, but we have no control over this, it's suppose to happen in the last days [h=3]1 Timothy 4[/h]King James Version (KJV)

4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:

is this not the fulfillment before your eyes?

Josh321 · Jan 5, 2014

i don't see much people here preaching the grace of God, they've completely forgotten about the holy spirit and the baptism of the holy spirit, i don't people even know what the holy spirit is now, the world is so far gone, if someone can tell me... joshua we need to keep the sabbath to the saved well then you know the time is at hand and soon most of the denomination system will be doing the same thing that is when God is going to come on the scene but it will be too late for them... don't be the foolish virgins be the wise ones and receive the baptism of the holy spirit, then the spirit will bare record to you what is the correct thing

1still_waters · Jan 5, 2014

Yup some of them are very coy, and hard to spot right away.
They'll even qualify their statements with, "No no, everything rests on Jesus. We're not justified by doing this stuff."

It reminds me of movies/tv shows that have a kidnapper nemesis.
The nemesis says, "Don't worry I don't want to harm you, you'll be ok."
Then at the end of the story, the victim is less than fine.

Theologically speaking...

"No no, everything rests on Jesus. We're not justified by doing this stuff." = "Don't worry I don't want to harm you, you'll be ok."

The end result is the same..The victim isn't in a good place.

The Judaizers slowly leak out their true intent.
Instead of every promise being yes in Christ, every promise looks back into reliance on some OT festival, feast, ritual, etc.

Instead of the focus being on Jesus, the focus slowly leaks toward focus on the shadows.

Col 2

Hebrews 10

These people eventually leak enough, that you realize they're pointing you toward the shadows and not Jesus.
They point toward promises not finding their yes in Jesus, but rather finding their yes in the shadows.

Josh321 · Jan 5, 2014

i don't understand though.. maybe someone can help me understand if this could be true.. could it be possible that because some of these people rejected the holy spirit sometime back and God hardened their hearts so they can't see the light? because how can you plainly see something... example ( the cat jump in the chair ) how can you see that plainly written and get this from it ( today is a rainy day ) ? i just don't understand i've tried months God knows... trying to show people that christ is the real deal, but every single time it was in vain, i'm now convinced that i believe their hearts have been hardened because God is the one that calls us to repentance... and this whatever it is.. just hindering themselves from that happening

danschance · Jan 5, 2014

just-me said:

I believe the bible is saying that a person who believes "Christ plus any portion of Mosiac law has lost their salvation unless they repent. The two verses I posted state this.

KJV1611 · Jan 5, 2014

Excellent posts everyone!

LT · Jan 5, 2014

Good points guys!

I have seen some of the same things on here in the past months.

There are also a few on CC who accidentally say phrases that can be taken as 'legalistic' because they are trying to counter the opposite extreme, which is 'licence' to continue in sin.

Don't be too hasty in forming individual judgements, because sometimes those sounding like Judaizers are really just defending our Christian call to follow Christ, and to push on toward the goal of holiness.

We are not saved by works, but once saved we are called to go and do good work (prepared in advance for us to do).

I'm just saying that there is a balance.

LT · Jan 5, 2014

danschance said:

i have to disagree on your wording. Salvation cannot be lost. If they have their faith in their works for salvation, then they have not yet put their faith and trust in the work of Christ, and have not yet received a salvation to lose.

The product is the same: they are not saved
But the process is different, because salvation is assured, to the believer.

danschance · Jan 5, 2014

Josh321 said:

I can't say why they do this and I bet there is a different reason for each person who believers, teaches or preaches "Christ plus Mosiac law". Jesus was fairly clear when He said you can not put a new patch on old cloth or vice versa. If you blend anything in with the gospel you end up with a false gospel. Paul had to even contend with Peter on this as Peter even taught Christ plus Circumcision but in the end Peter repented.

Satan does not sell ugly lies. He packages them up in an attractive way and adds a persuasive lie to make it seem appealing, holy and God pleasing but the end result is you go to Hell.

danschance · Jan 5, 2014

LT said:

Good points guys!

I have seen some of the same things on here in the past months.

There are also a few on CC who accidentally say phrases that can be taken as 'legalistic' because they are trying to counter the opposite extreme, which is 'licence' to continue in sin.

Don't be too hasty in forming individual judgements, because sometimes those sounding like Judaizers are really just defending our Christian call to follow Christ, and to push on toward the goal of holiness.

We are not saved by works, but once saved we are called to go and do good work (prepared in advance for us to do).

I'm just saying that there is a balance.

Legalism is the cousin to Judaism. Christians ought to be fully aware of these things to avoid them.

just-me · Jan 5, 2014

danschance said:

What's your take on these four scripture references? Does the Mosaic Law cause one to disbelieve Jesus' words, and does the spiritual aspects of the law cause one to revert back to a carnal mind?

John 5:46-47 (KJV)
[SUP]46 [/SUP]For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
[SUP]47 [/SUP]But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Romans 7:12 (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 7:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP]For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Romans 7:22 (KJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP]For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

Romans 8:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

1still_waters · Jan 5, 2014

Technically speaking, I think we should avoid the use of Judaizer as a coverall word for folks who point us to trust in the shadows. Isn't Judaizer something more specific, related to circumcision? Or does the scope of the term cover all things related to trusting in the shadows?

LT · Jan 5, 2014

1still_waters said:

There was a specific sect, called The Circumcision, that was also dealt with in Scripture.
But the term Judaizer refers to anyone who preaches faith + Mosaic Law for salvation.

the laws of circumcision and the Sabbath are the 2 laws that the NT writers use to represent the whole Law of Moses. They are the representative laws, just as Elijah and/or Jeremiah are used to represent all the prophets.

1still_waters · Jan 5, 2014

just-me said:

Because the writings point to Jesus, thus it's good.

It's holy just and good, because it shows us God's perfection and our imperfection. We see our imperfection when gazing into the law. Noticing that drives us to the one who is perfect, so we can become perfect in God's sight.

Romans 7:14 (KJV)

Click to expand...

The law is very spiritual. It's our carnal nature that is the problem. We can't live up to the spiritual perfect standards of the law, hence our need of Jesus.

When contrasted with the context, he's saying he sees the law as good, and is pleased, but his carnal nature keeps him from achieving it, thus the need for the one who will rescue him from the body of death.

The carnal fallen nature can't submit to God. That's why we need the Spirit and the one who can rescue us from the carnal body of death.

danschance · Jan 5, 2014

1still_waters said:

That is debatable. The Judaizers wanted the gentiles to cut their foreskins according to the Mosaic law. "Neo-Judaizers" are generally not concerned with Circumcision. They are for Sabbath observance, eating kosher foods and/or observing the Jewish festivals. I see it as exactly the same thing, "Christ plus a portion of Mosaic law" as being a false gospel message that leads one to hell.

We should never call people names or cast aspersions but I use the term Judaizer as a label and do not seek to be pejorative.

just-me · Jan 5, 2014

1still_waters said:

There are some who use this term that say that the Mosaic law causes one revert to being justified by works without faith like the Pharisees, not realizing that the Pharisees distorted the law to their own liking. They are concerned, to a great extent, that these so called Judaizers and legalizers have lost there faith, or have never had it because of esteeming the Mosaic Law as valuable to their Christian walk. I think we have conversed about this in length previously. God Bless you

just-me · Jan 5, 2014

1still_waters said:

Because the writings point to Jesus, thus it's good.

It's holy just and good, because it shows us God's perfection and our imperfection. We see our imperfection when gazing into the law. Noticing that drives us to the one who is perfect, so we can become perfect in God's sight.

The law is very spiritual. It's our carnal nature that is the problem. We can't live up to the spiritual perfect standards of the law, hence our need of Jesus.

When contrasted with the context, he's saying he sees the law as good, and is pleased, but his carnal nature keeps him from achieving it, thus the need for the one who will rescue him from the body of death.

The carnal fallen nature can't submit to God. That's why we need the Spirit and the one who can rescue us from the carnal body of death.

Very well spoken. You hit the nail right on the head. I see it the same way. I love the Mosaic Law. It's a substantial part of God's divine Word.

1still_waters · Jan 5, 2014

danschance said:

Yeah it's just that I've heard the shadow trusters scoff at being called Judaizers, simply because they themselves aren't preaching circumcision. So if the scope of Judaizer is confined to just circumcision, then possibly a better word needs to be used. *shrugs*

Attack of the Judaizers

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