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"I suffer not a woman to teach or have authority over a man, SHE IS TO BE QUIET."
Those FIVE words there spoken by dear brother, Apostle Paul, in 1 Timothy 2:12 DO carry 'great' meaning, fellow Christ folk
(as in 'Great is the Lord, worthy of glory. Great is the Lord, worthy of praise...now lift up your VOICE, LIFT UP....' meaning. Know the song, don't you? )
"...SHE IS TO BE QUIET."
Those are 'great' words.
What do these 'great' words really tell us through Paul ?
Paul suffers not a woman to teach or have authority over a man, she is to be quiet.
Can we assume (LOL, I told tuck to never assume ) , but, can we assume, OK, let's say it this way, can we AGREE, that this verse is in a church setting context ?
"A woman should learn in quietness and full submission." 1 Tim. 2:11
Paul is outlining women to 'learn' as 1 Tim. 2:11 states, to learn in 'quietness and full submission.'
This learning is referring to a man who is leading them in a church service, right ?
OK, that said, we move to....
"I suffer not a woman to teach (authority) or to have authority over a man, she must be quiet." 1 Tim. 2:12
Here, we are still in church, right? We are still speaking about women learning as a man, maybe, even, a husband 'man' is teaching them to learn, But, namely, the man could be, too, a 'bishop' or 'overseer' as Paul outlines in 1 Tim. 3 , those two quoted words are fancy words for 'pastor,' by the way.
In 1 Tim. 3, some like to THINK that since Paul says that an overseer or bishop is to be 'faithful to one wife,' that God can't use, or, 'call' as I say in another thread, a woman to pastor a church over men. But, as I said, there is no absolute here, just Paul states what was pretty prevalent, if not, absolute, in bible times (again, that's NO absolute), a woman just didn't do much teaching/preaching in a worship assembly with men. That's a fact. Besides Priscilla leading in churches beside husband, Aquila, it's just not said much. And, keep in mind, Paul taught Priscilla and Aquila (Acts 18) and so that's, definitely, saying that Paul SUPPORTED Priscilla teaching those in Corinth, and, later, that married couple taught God to others in Ephesus (1 Cor. 16)
OK, let's not tangent too much So, women are to NOT teach authority or be assuming authority over a man, or, 'their man,' who is a husband man, per 1 Tim. 2:12. Whew! Let's not confuse you, too, much, dudes and miladies, it's either/or, 'husband,' or, 'man.'
Good thing you learn ALL things from the Holy Spirit who is in your heart, eh ? Yes, you do, Scripture says so, too
But, that's for another lesson
God is not an author of confusion, though mighty mysterious is He and His ways, which are not our ways nor our thoughts, per Isaiah 55, for we, humans, cannot know 'God's mind,' per 1 Cor. 2
So, these two verses in 1 Timothy 2 speak directly to women who are to be quiet and learn as a man (husband or pastor) is speaking to them,teaching them things of God
I do not see anywhere in these two verses of 1 Tim., 2:11-12, that there is an absolute said by Paul that a woman can not be a pastor over men, just, Paul is saying, that the women WHO ARE LEARNING are NOT to speak over or teach over or bring themselves to authority over the MAN (pastor, husband) who is teaching them of God in a worship place
The women need to realize that the man is the one who is speaking and that she is not first in the created order, Paul goes on to say, and, the woman (Eve) was 'deceived' and she is labeled the 'sinner,' not Adam (man). Verses 13 and 14 of 1 Tim. 2 say.
So, she will be saved in 'child-bearing,' goes on verse 15.
OK, let's review:
OK, so Paul is exclusively speaking to women who are to LEARN in full submission and quietness, and, who are not to teach over (usurp, swallow up) a man (pastor, husband) who is teaching them things of God
---------
And, there are so many threads on this topic, I really want to keep this one contained to the FIVE WORDS that speakingly do say so much about what exactly Paul is ONLY referring to when he is speaking of a woman to not teach or have authority over a man, SHE IS TO BE QUIET
Those FIVE words there spoken by dear brother, Apostle Paul, in 1 Timothy 2:12 DO carry 'great' meaning, fellow Christ folk
(as in 'Great is the Lord, worthy of glory. Great is the Lord, worthy of praise...now lift up your VOICE, LIFT UP....' meaning. Know the song, don't you? )"...SHE IS TO BE QUIET."
Those are 'great' words.
What do these 'great' words really tell us through Paul ?
Paul suffers not a woman to teach or have authority over a man, she is to be quiet.
Can we assume (LOL, I told tuck to never assume
) , but, can we assume, OK, let's say it this way, can we AGREE, that this verse is in a church setting context ? "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission." 1 Tim. 2:11
Paul is outlining women to 'learn' as 1 Tim. 2:11 states, to learn in 'quietness and full submission.'
This learning is referring to a man who is leading them in a church service, right ?
OK, that said, we move to....
"I suffer not a woman to teach (authority) or to have authority over a man, she must be quiet." 1 Tim. 2:12
Here, we are still in church, right?
We are still speaking about women learning as a man, maybe, even, a husband 'man' is teaching them to learn, But, namely, the man could be, too, a 'bishop' or 'overseer' as Paul outlines in 1 Tim. 3 , those two quoted words are fancy words for 'pastor,' by the way. In 1 Tim. 3, some like to THINK that since Paul says that an overseer or bishop is to be 'faithful to one wife,' that God can't use, or, 'call' as I say in another thread, a woman to pastor a church over men. But, as I said, there is no absolute here, just Paul states what was pretty prevalent, if not, absolute, in bible times (again, that's NO absolute), a woman just didn't do much teaching/preaching in a worship assembly with men. That's a fact. Besides Priscilla leading in churches beside husband, Aquila, it's just not said much. And, keep in mind, Paul taught Priscilla and Aquila (Acts 18) and so that's, definitely, saying that Paul SUPPORTED Priscilla teaching those in Corinth, and, later, that married couple taught God to others in Ephesus (1 Cor. 16)
OK, let's not tangent too much
So, women are to NOT teach authority or be assuming authority over a man, or, 'their man,' who is a husband man, per 1 Tim. 2:12. Whew! Let's not confuse you, too, much, dudes and miladies, it's either/or, 'husband,' or, 'man.' Good thing you learn ALL things from the Holy Spirit who is in your heart, eh ? Yes, you do, Scripture says so, too
But, that's for another lesson
God is not an author of confusion, though mighty mysterious is He and His ways, which are not our ways nor our thoughts, per Isaiah 55, for we, humans, cannot know 'God's mind,' per 1 Cor. 2
So, these two verses in 1 Timothy 2 speak directly to women who are to be quiet and learn as a man (husband or pastor) is speaking to them,teaching them things of God
I do not see anywhere in these two verses of 1 Tim., 2:11-12, that there is an absolute said by Paul that a woman can not be a pastor over men, just, Paul is saying, that the women WHO ARE LEARNING are NOT to speak over or teach over or bring themselves to authority over the MAN (pastor, husband) who is teaching them of God in a worship place
The women need to realize that the man is the one who is speaking and that she is not first in the created order, Paul goes on to say, and, the woman (Eve) was 'deceived' and she is labeled the 'sinner,' not Adam (man). Verses 13 and 14 of 1 Tim. 2 say.
So, she will be saved in 'child-bearing,' goes on verse 15.
OK, let's review:
OK, so Paul is exclusively speaking to women who are to LEARN in full submission and quietness, and, who are not to teach over (usurp, swallow up) a man (pastor, husband) who is teaching them things of God
---------
And, there are so many threads on this topic, I really want to keep this one contained to the FIVE WORDS that speakingly do say so much about what exactly Paul is ONLY referring to when he is speaking of a woman to not teach or have authority over a man, SHE IS TO BE QUIET
