1 John 3:8-10 No one who is born of God will continue to sin ...

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

1 John 3:8-10
Children of God
…8the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil. 9No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

Lets look at this please and lets not turn this into number 1 i am claiming to with out sin number 2 i am mocking people can not stop sinning,, or number 3 im claiming to be holier than thou, number 4 it is impossible for a person to stop sinning. please,,

Let us all chat with respect towards one another on this subject and let us learn wth-out any mocking or cursing in this one thread please, basically for this one thread lets us put all future threads behind us and start a fresh please.

First things first the human-bean is split into 3 parts Mind body and sole,

now how does one become born again, ? we ask the holy with a sincere heart to wash away all are past inequities (repent) at this point i would like to show the blood of Jesus that does this,,

Matthew 26:26-30

New International Version (NIV)

[SUP]26 [/SUP]While they were eating, Jesus took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it and gave it to his disciples, saying, “Take and eat; this is my body.”
[SUP]27 [/SUP]Then he took a cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. [SUP]28 [/SUP]This is my blood of the[SUP][a][/SUP] covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. [SUP]29 [/SUP]I tell you, I will not drink from this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.”

Ok so now the repenter and born again spirit has the Blood of Jesus being pored into you spiritually ? this means you ask Jesus with a sincere heart for forgiveness and you tell him you don't want to sin anymore,, most people who repent also do not want to do it again this is becoming born again.
(
Now this,, Jesus says he will send you a helper which is the spirit,, which also has the blood of Jesus, (spiritually) who appeared to destroy the works of the devil as in the first chapter of this page 1 John 3:8-10 ,, as he did destroy the devil .. Jesus in the flesh beat sin.

So now we have a born again spirit Jesus after his resurrection who can not sin, who is sending his comforter to be with you,,,ie his born again spirit who has defeated the devil, to wash away all your sins, in the hope that you don't sin anymore.

so you now have the born again spirit that Jesus had after his resurrection , your clean, from this moment your mind is still the same and so is you body but your born again spirit is cleansed. Jesus-es born again spirit now resides in you,,

now the mind at this point can still see sin and try to tell the body to actual do that sin,, such as thieving something nice like a nice pair of shoes you see or a 100 dollar bill in the street on the floor

at this point the born a gain spirit JESUS tells the mind NO don't do it. so you pick the money up and take it to the police station,, or you say no to the shoes too you say ill save up and buy them when i have the money. it is better to dream than to sin.

Now it is the same thing for hating,, lets say someone needs helps like a homeless person,, at this point your old mind remembers the homeless bum who was rude to you or said i do this for living,, or what ever,, so at this point when the homeless person asks for help the born again spirit Jesus says if you have something to give,, give something) if not be nice and walk away. now you say im sorry i have nothing i can give you but i will pray for you,,

so the homeless person is rude after you say this ?? so now the born again spirit Jesus says don't mind him turn the other cheek,, just say sorry you feal that way and walk away.

this is the the holy spirit with Jesus-es born again spirit helping you to keep the commandments and keeping the weeds out of the heart.

Now should the mind make the body steal the shoes then the sole has sinned,, you have now just crucified Jesus again.

Now can you still have the spirit after this or did you have the spirit to begin with.

Well as we see from the top the born again spirit does not continue to sin.

And · Apr 23, 2014

If you are born of God you will keep the Sabbath

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

those born of God will NOT transgress the law

the wabbath is paw number 4

also

to not sin
you have to WORK on sunday-friday

so if you are NOT working on Sunday you are sinning.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

And said:

Isaiah 58:13-14

New International Version - UK (NIVUK)

[SUP]13 [/SUP]‘If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath
and from doing as you please on my holy day,
if you call the Sabbath a delight
and the Lord’s holy day honourable,
and if you honour it by not going your own way
and not doing as you please or speaking idle words,
[SUP]14 [/SUP]then you will find your joy in the Lord,
and I will cause you to ride in triumph on the heights of the land
and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.’
For the mouth of the Lord has spoken.

This is the sabbath and please can you respect my wishes not to turn this thread into a debate about the sabbath..

Jesus is quite clear in the bible (works of necessity are needed on a Saturday)... so if you help someone on a Saturday are you sinning ? no your not,, now please i have had every thread more or less that i have started derailed so could you please not turn this thread into an argument about the sabbath please

Least · Apr 23, 2014

Zinzerio said:

Hi Zinzerio, good subject! I'm still in the process of studying these things out, but I can offer some scriptures for consideration.

Verse 10 in the passage that you shared speaks of the "practice," of righteousness.

In Acts 24, Paul gives an example of practicing righteousness.

Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void to offence toward God, and toward men.

He also speaks in Galatians of Christ being formed in us.

Galatians 4:18 But it is good to be zealously affected always in a good thing, and not only when I am present with you.
Galatians 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

To me, from among these passages including the scriptures that speak of the carnal mind. (Paul did address carnality among believers,) it is a process. We also have to consider maturing, going from the milk to the meat of the word and being doers and not hearers only.

Psalms 119:9 Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.

Vaudeville · Apr 23, 2014

Zinzerio said:

oh my goodness. well, Zinzerio, i don't know who taught you this heresy. but since your OP is about repenting, you need to. right away.

Jesus was not "born again". he was not "born again after his resurrection".

did you learn that here?:

Was Jesus Christ Born Again?

By Herbert W. Armstrong

But how many realize that Jesus Christ, Himself, was born again-and in the same manner in which He said WE "must be born again?"

Vaudeville · Apr 23, 2014

Colossians 1:15-18
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything."

firstborn
prototokos

Jesus is "preeminent" (4416 /prōtótokos) – the unequivocal Sovereign overall creation (Col 1:16).
[4416 (prōtótokos) refers to "the first among others (who follow)" – as with the preeminent, glorified Christ, the eternal Logos who possesses self-existent life (Jn 5:26).]

john832 · Apr 23, 2014

Vaudeville said:

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Invisible are we?

Vaudeville · Apr 23, 2014

john832 said:

yes i know you're an armstrongite. just didn't know about the other fellow.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

Vaudeville said:

the holy scrolls in heaven where not opened until Jesus had defeated the evil one on the cross. so something was born a new was it not ?

please stop calling people heretics,, slanderers don't inherit the kingdom of heaven,, and you will do well to remember this,, so please leave my thread if all your going to do is be insulting. disruptive behavior is not of God,,( wash rinse repeat) you wasting your time trying to get me to respond to you and i will not even give you an explanation, for you call me a heretic and argue with you.. so you can call me every name under the sun,, if you like )youve been on my ignore list for 2 weeks so please stop following me around if you don't mind.

you see what happens here when you ask people not to be bad mannered at the beginning of my post..they do the exact oppersite..

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

Just for the record for anyone here interested the born again spirit you receive is Jesus es spirit,, it is a born again spirit sent from heaven and from Jesus ,,the born again spirit was not released until Jesus went to heaven, and it could only have come from jesus because it did not come until after his resurrection, so if i say Jesus-es born again spirit does that mean im saying Jesus was born again ? what i am learning i am passing on. God bless,, i think what the previous member is suggesting that i am saying Jesus sinned and received the born again spirit,, can anyone else see his attempted slander,, or is it just me

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

Least said:

i agree that the carnal mind is not renewed unless you seek the spirit that dwells in you before you sin,, Now a person who is mature in Christ must surely know what sin is. a person who is mature in Christ must surley know to seek the lord be-for sinning. ? surley if the heart is sincere the spirit will be given,, and surly this next scriture applys,,
[h=3]1 John 2:27[/h]GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)

[SUP]27 [/SUP]The anointing you received from Christ lives in you. You don’t need anyone to teach you something else. Instead, Christ’s anointing teaches you about everything. His anointing is true and contains no lie. So live in Christ as he taught you to do.

Now paul we know was speaking mostly to people who believed the old way. the old testament. the carnal mind in the old testament was the mind that tried to keep the law without the help of the spirit. the born again spirit..

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

Jesus Has the Keys of Hell and Death

I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death. Revelations 1:18 )

Jesus overcame all sin and death by his resurrection: behold, I am alive for evermore. Consequently he has complete and full authority over hell: who will go there, and who will be saved from having to go there. Later in Revelations the second and final death is described where the soul is lost forever in hell.

And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. ( Revelations 21:6-8 )

But through Jesus Christ’s victory over both hell and death, we can have mercy to be saved from the power of sin and hell, and the final death of eternal torment. Additionally, Jesus is the one given all power in heaven and earth by the Father for the Father has committed all judgement to the Son.

“For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. ( John 5:22-29 )

And Jesus can, and does, give the keys to the kingdom (the Word of God) to his ministry to deliver to the people:

And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. ( Matt 16:19 )

To those who reject the Word of God, it becomes to them as the keys of hell and of death because their rejection of the opportunity to serve God in this life closes their opportunity of making heaven. When Jesus opens the opportunity to heaven with the keys of the Word of God, no man can close off that opportunity for a soul to be saved. But after too many times of rejecting the opportunity, when Jesus closes the door, the opportunity is gone, no man can reopen that opportunity.
And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open. ( Isaiah 22:22 )
And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth; I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name. ( Rev 3:7-8 )

Kerry · Apr 23, 2014

To the OP, Bull Hockey, and that's all I have to say. One thought will derail that doctrine.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

Kerry said:

what doctrin is that and what are you not in agreement with as i wrote quite alot.

kennethcadwell · Apr 23, 2014

You first have to know the context of what is being said by John in this scripture, because in other scriptures he says that born again Christians do still sin. Does this mean he contradicts himself....no. He like I mentioned before was speaking of willful sin that some do commit, and what is hard for some to comprehend is what the bible speaks of as willful sin. Because some here that and first thing they do is say, " well everybody willfully sins. "

The thing is that the one who willfully sins as the bible speaks of, and John is talking about here is one who sins with out remorse, conviction, regret, and do not repent because they feel they are doing nothing wrong. This is the willful sinner.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

kennethcadwell said:

You first have to know the context of what is being said by John in this scripture, because in other scriptures he says that born again Christians do still sin. Does this mean he contradicts himself....no. He like I mentioned before was speaking of willful sin that some do commit, and what is hard for some to comprehend is what the bible speaks of as willful sin. Because some here that and first thing they do is say, " well everybody willfully sins. "

The thing is that the one who willfully sins as the bible speaks of, and John is talking about here is one who sins with out remorse, conviction, regret, and do not repent because they feel they are doing nothing wrong. This is the willful sinner.

show me the scripture where it says people born of god still sin in john please. now maybe they do but is that knowingly or defiantly ?

RedTent · Apr 23, 2014

I don't think we are supposed to pull these simple ideas all apart, we are just to humbly listen to what scripture says, all of it.

Scripture says that we all have sinned and come short. From that, we know that to expect ourselves to be perfect is to expect the impossible.

Scripture says we are to put on Christ, and that Christ is perfect. What we do in Christ is not sinful.

We are told to die to self every day, and live in Christ. That our spirit is willing and our flesh is weak. We know we are in the flesh.

All of these things are so, one truth does not cancel other truths. So we put on the perfection of Christ, and we still are sinful, we need repentance, and we need Christ.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

oh well just carry on sinning then hell doesn't exist is that better for every here ?

kennethcadwell · Apr 23, 2014

1 John 1:8-10 talks about those being of Lord. If you walk around saying you have no sin or you are without sin the truth and His word is not in you. Plus he mentioned to confess your sins and you will be forgiven. Now to put it into perspective if you have no sin there would be no need to confess, but John here says you still will.

You have to study the meaning behind the scripture from the author, and not just take it as what you read in black and white because people write stuff the way they comprehend and not how we do. Which is why study is so important, and not just scripture for scripture but also the traditions that were back then and how the writer looks at things.

Zinzerio · Apr 23, 2014

kennethcadwell said:

1 John 1:8-10

Good News Translation (GNT)

[SUP]8 [/SUP]If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and there is no truth in us. [SUP]9 [/SUP]But if we confess our sins to God, he will keep his promise and do what is right: he will forgive us our sins and purify us from all our wrongdoing. [SUP]10 [/SUP]If we say that we have not sinned, we make a liar out of God, and his word is not in us.

sorry but once again you bring up the befor not the after this is befor you become born again..

1 John 3:8-10 No one who is born of God will continue to sin ...

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