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Thread: are there 2 groups of 144,000

  1. #1
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    Default are there 2 groups of 144,000

    144,000 of Israel-Rev. 7:2 With the seal of the living God :3 till we have sealed the servant's of our God upon their foreheads :4 # sealed 144,000 out of the 12 tribes of Israel
    Rev 21:12 and on the gates the names of the 12 tribes of the sons of Israel were inscribed

    THE LAMB AND THE 144,000
    Rev 14:1 who had His name AND His Fathers name on their foreheads :3 they sing a new song only they can learn
    14:4 these redeemed from the earth
    John 17:9 I am praying for them not the world
    rev 14:4 they have not been defiled by woman they are chaste , these follow the Lamb everywhere he goes
    Galatians 3:28 there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female you are all one in Christ
    John 17: 19 and for their sake I have consecrated myself that they may also be consecrated in truth
    rev 9:8 their hair was like woman's hair (false prophets/leaders)
    rev 14:4 these have been redeemed from mankind (not 12 tribes) as first fruits for God and the Lamb
    john 17:10 All mine are thine, and all thine are mine, and I am glorified in them
    rev 14:5 in their mouth no lie is found, they are spotless
    john 17:7 sanctify them in truth, thy word is truth
    But Galatians 3:29 if you are Christ's, then you are Abrahams offspring , heirs according to promise

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    Quote Originally Posted by adsd View Post
    144,000 of Israel-Rev. 7:2 With the seal of the living God :3 till we have sealed the servant's of our God upon their foreheads :4 # sealed 144,000 out of the 12 tribes of Israel
    Rev 21:12 and on the gates the names of the 12 tribes of the sons of Israel were inscribed

    THE LAMB AND THE 144,000
    Rev 14:1 who had His name AND His Fathers name on their foreheads :3 they sing a new song only they can learn
    14:4 these redeemed from the earth
    John 17:9 I am praying for them not the world
    rev 14:4 they have not been defiled by woman they are chaste , these follow the Lamb everywhere he goes
    Galatians 3:28 there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female you are all one in Christ
    John 17: 19 and for their sake I have consecrated myself that they may also be consecrated in truth
    rev 9:8 their hair was like woman's hair (false prophets/leaders)
    rev 14:4 these have been redeemed from mankind (not 12 tribes) as first fruits for God and the Lamb
    john 17:10 All mine are thine, and all thine are mine, and I am glorified in them
    rev 14:5 in their mouth no lie is found, they are spotless
    john 17:7 sanctify them in truth, thy word is truth
    But Galatians 3:29 if you are Christ's, then you are Abrahams offspring , heirs according to promise
    144,000=144,000...The Church won't be here during the tribulation.

    Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the LORD our God.
    (Psa 20:7)






    "Sir, we wish to see Jesus."
    Jn 12:21


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    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    If you list all the facts one at a time in order you will find that there is a group of boys found within the pages of recorded, inspired biblical history that fit the bill which is overlooked by everybody when considering the stated facts when considering this group of 144,000!

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    Rev 19:10 Worship God" For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. I just happened to note , while reading Jesus prays for his disciples , how it seemed to have some answers to the Lamb and the 144,000.

    as other verses help us to understand

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    very good observation adsd,
    you will do well to keep studying.

    you have come to a concusion fro the bible itself that no religion speaks about
    since no religion talks about it, you have a very good chance of being correct!
    Since the enemy would never bring new light to us!

    I will keep my mind open as I study, if it is true and there are two groups , all the pieces will fall together by prayer
    thank you for that light.

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    Senior Member crossnote's Avatar
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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    Quote Originally Posted by dcontroversal View Post
    If you list all the facts one at a time in order you will find that there is a group of boys found within the pages of recorded, inspired biblical history that fit the bill which is overlooked by everybody when considering the stated facts when considering this group of 144,000!
    Do you mean in the OT?

    Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the LORD our God.
    (Psa 20:7)






    "Sir, we wish to see Jesus."
    Jn 12:21


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    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    Quote Originally Posted by crossnote View Post
    Do you mean in the OT?
    I mean that if you list the facts as found in Revelation that there is a group of boys who were murdered while still under the O.T. covenant that fits every fact listed.....

    Everybody or almost everybody overlooks the two physical locations listed as tied to the 144,000 and what their purpose is as the WAVE OFFERING OF THE FIRST FRUITS.

    1. BEFORE the THRONE
    2. FOLLOWING THE LORD WHITHERSOEVER HE GOES
    3. ON MOUNT ZION WHEN JESUS IS ON MOUNT ZION

    Rachael weeping for her children and her children are NOT!

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    I do not know if any of you have seen this video about the 144 000 so here it goes.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    my believe theres two and same


    myters that died by rome

    are given white robes and said wait

    there still in grave waiting for 144000 total

    in tribulation those martered by rome,

    again till all priests being killed for faith come in

    this does not apply to everyone, only sabbath keepers

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    jb
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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    are there 2 groups of 144,000
    Yes, these are 2 different groups of 144,000

    The context of each passage gives the answer to whom they are...
    adsd likes this.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    They are one group. the first in chapter 7 are before the seal the second have the seal.

    Notice:

    Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

    So these people need to be sealed in their foreheads. Then we are told the number of them who are sealed.

    Chapter 14 they are sealed and they are described in more detail.

    Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

    They now have the name of the Father written in their foreheads. The name of the Father is the seal. A persons name in the bible has to do with character. So this group have the character of God. Thus the seal is given to those who are like God in character. New creatures.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    I wonder if a person can belong to both groups, if they are mutually inclusive in some.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    They are Firstfruits. first fruits of what?

    Rev 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

    Rom_8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

    The disciples had the first fruits of the Holy Spirit.

    Jas_1:18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

    The new creature is a first fruit.

    So the question is how are the 144,000 who have the seal of God firstfuits?

    Well for one they are like God just like the disciples were when they received the Holy Spirit.

    The answer is in the outpouring of the Spirit.

    Act 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
    Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
    Act 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:



    Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

    So Peter quotes Joel and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit which we have seen made them first fruits. But when we got to Joel we learn something interesting:

    Joe 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
    Joe 2:29 And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.

    Notice what it says before this concerning this outpouring.

    Joe 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.

    There is more than one Rain. the Former we saw at Pentecost. But the latter only comes when the harvest is about ready to be harvested fully. The Former started the growth of the seed. Thus the Christian church began with the former rain the outpouring of the Spirit.

    The latter rain comes to ripen the harvest when the harvest is nearly ready.

    Notice that when the disciples received the Holy spirit they gave a message of repentance and of Jesus and the church began to grow under the former rain of the Spirit.

    Notice also that there is a message given by the 144,000 in Revelation 14.

    Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
    Rev 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
    Rev 14:8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
    Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
    Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
    Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
    Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

    This message is followed by a harvest.

    Rev 14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
    Rev 14:15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

    The 144,000 will have to be sealed first then they will give a final message of repentance to the world under the power of the latter rain of the Spirit, then Christ will harvest the earth at his coming.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    In chapter 7 there are two groups. the 144,000 and the great multitude.

    Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

    who are these and where do they come from?

    Revelation 14 there are two groups, 144,000 and the great multitude,

    Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

    The message is given to all nations kidreds and toungues and people. These are the great multitude. they hear the message given in power by the 144,000 and accept Christ. and then the harvest is ripe.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    Deu 32:1 Give ear, O ye heavens, and I will speak; and hear, O earth, the words of my mouth.
    Deu 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass:
    Deu 32:3 Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God.
    Deu 32:4 He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

    The Rain will by the doctrine of God by the Holy Spirit just as the early rain on the tender herb so also the showers of the latter rain will fall to publish the name of God.

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    john 15:19 I chose you out of the world

    Matt 19:28 you who have followed me....in the new world you will sit on 12 thrones and judge the 12 tribes of Israel

    then I wonder why the 12 tribes of Israel are marked??

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    Default Re: are there 2 groups of 144,000

    That would be really nice if there were two groups!

    that means more in the kingdom!

    I am just happy to be part of one of them!

    All praise to God.
    The power of Jesus blood is all powerful so you can stop sinning, change your life and even your desires!
    "I can do ALL THINGS THROUGH CHRIST!" even
    Jesus says "Go and sin no more!" Just like he said.
    Believe Jesus! Repent (give up sinning) by faith! because "The Blood of Jesus Christ gives power over ANY SIN FOREVER!
    Son of man, ...go to your people ... and say to them, 'This is what the Sovereign YAHWEH the Eternal Creator says!'
    Do this whether they listen to you or not." Ezekiel 3.10.




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