To Be Clear...........Arminianism

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p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
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#1
Free-Will or Human Ability
Although human nature was seriously affected by the fall, man has not been left in a state of total spiritual helplessness. God graciously enables every sinner to repent and believe, but He does not interfere with man's freedom. Each sinner possesses a free will, and his eternal destiny depends on how he uses it. Man's freedom consists of his ability to choose good over evil in spiritual matters; his will is not enslaved to his sinful nature. The sinner has the power to either cooperate with God's Spirit and be regenerated or resist God's grace and perish. The lost sinner needs the Spirit's assistance, but he does not have to be regenerated by the Spirit before he can believe, for faith is man's act and precedes the new birth. Faith is the sinner's gift to God; it is man's contribution to salvation.

Conditional Election
God's choice of certain individuals unto salvation before the foundation of the world was based upon His foreseeing that they would respond to His call. He selected only those whom He knew would of themselves freely believe the gospel. Election therefore was determined by or conditioned upon what man would do. The faith which God foresaw and upon which He based His choice was not given to the sinner by God (it was not created by the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit) but resulted solely from man's will. It was left entirely up to man as to who would believe and therefore as to who would be elected unto salvation. God chose those whom He knew would, of their own free will, choose Christ. Thus the sinner's choice of Christ, not God's choice of the sinner, is the ultimate cause of salvation.

Universal Redemption or General Atonement
Christ's redeeming work made it possible for everyone to be saved but did not actually secure the salvation of anyone. Although Christ died for all men and for every man, only those who believe on Him are saved. His death enabled God to pardon sinners on the condition that they believe, but it did not actually put away anyone's sins. Christ's redemption becomes effective only if man chooses to accept it.

The Holy Spirit Can Be Effectually Resisted

The Spirit calls inwardly all those who are called outwardly by the gospel invitation; He does all that He can to bring every sinner to salvation. But inasmuch as man is free, he can successfully resist the Spirit's call. The Spirit cannot regenerate the sinner until he believes; faith (which is man's contribution) precedes and makes possible the new birth. Thus, man's free will limits the Spirit in the application of Christ's saving work. The Holy Spirit can only draw to Christ those who allow Him to have His way with them. Until the sinner responds, the Spirit cannot give life. God's grace, therefore, is not invincible; it can be, and often is, resisted and thwarted by man.

Falling from Grace
Those who believe and are truly saved can lose their salvation by failing to keep up their faith, etc. All Arminians have not been agreed on this point; some have held that believers are eternally secure in Christ - that once a sinner is regenerated, he can never be lost.


According to Arminianism:
Salvation is accomplished through the combined efforts of God (who takes the initiative) and man (who must respond) - man's response being the determining factor. God has provided salvation for everyone, but His provision becomes effective only for those who, of their own free will, "choose" to cooperate with Him and accept His offer of grace. At the crucial point, man's will plays a decisive role; thus man, not God, determines who will be recipients of the gift of salvation.[FONT=Arial,Geneva] [/FONT]


 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
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#2
Synergism...pure and simple...no thanks.
We don't keep our faith since it is not ours to keep...

1 Peter 1:3-4 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
1 Peter 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#3
the last point in their doctrine is heresy,

if salvation can be lost, that means it must be earned (by whatever means it requires to keep) thus it is a works based gospel, even if they got most of the other points spot on.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
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#4
the last point in their doctrine is heresy,

if salvation can be lost, that means it must be earned (by whatever means it requires to keep) thus it is a works based gospel, even if they got most of the other points spot on.
I think most the points are wrong but what do I know, I also think that elephant is a troll in disguise...LOL.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
6,479
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#5
So, say I agree with you both.............now what? I mean given this:

Overlooking the need for Sanctification isn’t a good idea in my opinion……….

Matthew 24:10) And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 .) And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 .) And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 .) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

John 14: 15 .) If ye love me, keep my commandments.

James 2:14) What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 .) If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 .) And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 .) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 .) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 .) Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 .) But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 .) Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 .) Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 .) And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 .) Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 .) Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 .) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Romans 2:2) But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.
3 .) And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?
4 .) Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5 .) But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 .) Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 .) To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 .) But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 .) Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 .) But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 .) For there is no respect of persons with God.

Revelation 21:6) And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 .) He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 .) But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Matthew 16:27) For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

 
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1still_waters

Guest
#6

According to Arminianism:
Salvation is accomplished through the combined efforts of God (who takes the initiative) and man (who must respond) - man's response being the determining factor. God has provided salvation for everyone, but His provision becomes effective only for those who, of their own free will, "choose" to cooperate with Him and accept His offer of grace. At the crucial point, man's will plays a decisive role; thus man, not God, determines who will be recipients of the gift of salvation.


But the Bible says it is of God, not of man.
Ephesians 2
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
6,479
113
#7
Ephesians 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 .) Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 .) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever BELIEVETH in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.......


According to Arminianism:
Salvation is accomplished through the combined efforts of God (who takes the initiative) and man (who must respond) - man's response being the determining factor. God has provided salvation for everyone, but His provision becomes effective only for those who, of their own free will, "choose" to cooperate with Him and accept His offer of grace. At the crucial point, man's will plays a decisive role; thus man, not God, determines who will be recipients of the gift of salvation.

IF a man has FAITH in and BELIEVES in Jesus Christ, he is FREELY GIVEN THE GIFT OF GRACE UNTO SALVAITON......(capitalized for emphasis only....)

IF a man DENYS Jesus Christ.............is he FREELY GIVEN THE GIFT OF GRACE UNTO SALVAITON?

(I don't see a conflict between the two statements you posted........... :) )
 
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1still_waters

Guest
#8
Ephesians 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 .) Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 .) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever BELIEVETH in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.......


According to Arminianism:
Salvation is accomplished through the combined efforts of God (who takes the initiative) and man (who must respond) - man's response being the determining factor. God has provided salvation for everyone, but His provision becomes effective only for those who, of their own free will, "choose" to cooperate with Him and accept His offer of grace. At the crucial point, man's will plays a decisive role; thus man, not God, determines who will be recipients of the gift of salvation.

IF a man has FAITH in and BELIEVES in Jesus Christ, he is FREELY GIVEN THE GIFT OF GRACE UNTO SALVAITON......(capitalized for emphasis only....)

IF a man DENYS Jesus Christ.............is he FREELY GIVEN THE GIFT OF GRACE UNTO SALVAITON?

(I don't see a conflict between the two statements you posted........... :) )
Faith itself is a gift.

Romans 12
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 
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1still_waters

Guest
#9
When Paul says not of ourselves, he means NONE of it is of OURSELVES.

Faith is a gift.
Jesus is a gift.
Salvation is a gift.

It's all a gift.

It's not of ourselves.
 
Jul 27, 2011
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#10
The Commandments are also a gift, but some choose not to see them in that way.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
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#11
thanks for the easy-to-read explanation, i guess. now i can't say i don't know what 'arminianism' is any more, but as per your intent, it's more clear :)


Conditional Election
The faith which God foresaw and upon which He based His choice was not given to the sinner by God​


but..

Every good giving, and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the lights
(James 1:17)

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
(John 1:3)

?

does this theology say i'm wrong to thank God for what faith i find in myself?
i thought it was by His grace i had power to believe (even to be).


For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing
(Romans 7:18)

BTW:
i don't care what 'calvinism' says about this. i'd be happy if no one told me, ever. more truth, less -ism :D
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
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#12
Faith itself is a gift.

Romans 12
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

yes, this haha -- is exactly the verse that didn't come to mind while i wrote post above :)

amen! God provides.
 
May 18, 2010
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#13
It is interesting though the freewill matter, our will to know what is good from evil (could've been from eating of the tree of knowledge of good & evil). Also our will to accept what is freely given, since our freewill also determines our falling away. Though I can't get caught up in all of that, I know my will is for pure evil to overtake me in every way (as to say of the Lutheran way, our will is by no means any good). The Spiritual gifts of God's Love, Grace, and our measured faith those which save us, are from God alone, and Christ alone can save us.
Leading into more interest, the saving prayer i just noticed implies an act on our part, accepting Christ as our Savior. What do we say of this?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#14
The Commandments are also a gift, but some choose not to see them in that way.

they are. To prove we are in dire straights, And in need of salvation. So when Christ comes, we have the ability to chose or reject him.
 
W

weakness

Guest
#15
Faith itself is a gift.

Romans 12
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

A little out of context!! 12;4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same OFFICE :12:6 Having then GIFTS, differing according to the grace that is given us, whether prophesy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith; Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teaches, on teaching; or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: or him that giveth , let him do it with simplicity. These verses are about gifts given us, not about salvation
 
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1still_waters

Guest
#16
A little out of context!! 12;4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same OFFICE :12:6 Having then GIFTS, differing according to the grace that is given us, whether prophesy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith; Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teaches, on teaching; or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: or him that giveth , let him do it with simplicity. These verses are about gifts given us, not about salvation
You can't split that hair.
Gifts are part of the faith God has granted us.
Hence God grants a measure of faith.
He's the one who grants.
 
W

weakness

Guest
#17
Im waiting for someone to say thanking and praising god is unacceptable works of the flesh. Strive to enter into that rest.
 
W

weakness

Guest
#18
You can't split that hair.
Gifts are part of the faith God has granted us.
Hence God grants a measure of faith.
He's the one who grants.
Faith is the means God has chosen to enter in to christ. I think paul,here is not talking about salvation, which is a gift too, entered into by our choice, he is talking about the measure of christ given each of us to fulfill his and our miniseries, which can also be obtained by our choice to let them work in and out of us. We are created in Gods image , from which we have fallen far, but still free will is apart of Gods Image. If we did not freely give our love to him, it would be a sick kind of love . One that would not be satisfying to God or us. I thank God for his plan that includes salvation, and I choose to love him for who he is and all the goodness and love he has shown to me.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
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#19
And having gifts, different according to the grace that was given to us
(Romans 12:6)

what grace?

For I say, through the grace that was given to me, to every one who is among you, not to think above what it behoveth to think; but to think so as to think wisely, as to each God did deal a measure of faith, for as in one body we have many members, and all the members have not the same office, so we, the many, one body are in Christ, and members each one of one another.
(Romans 12:3-5)

the gifts are given according to measure, as that of faith, which is also given.
that no one may boast in himself.


 
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Nov 26, 2011
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#20
the last point in their doctrine is heresy,

if salvation can be lost, that means it must be earned (by whatever means it requires to keep) thus it is a works based gospel, even if they got most of the other points spot on.
Did Adam earn a dwelling place in the garden in the beginning?