Ritual or Love.

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
113
#1
What must happen if a person save?

Change from hatred to Lovely person, or experienced all kind of ritual, such as baptism, must be a member of certain Church etc.

[h=1]Matthew 15 King James Version (KJV)[/h]15 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;
6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:
11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?
13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.
14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.
16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?
17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?
18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.
 
Jul 25, 2013
1,329
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#2
Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and soul and mind and strength and love thy neighbor as thy self.
Was Jesus baptized? Aren't we to follow Jesus example?
Let us not forget the assembling of our selves together Heb 10:25.
Start with the Gospels and along with it the book of Acts- Now faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word. Romans 10:17
 
F

FireHeart

Guest
#3
if a person is to be saved they only need to ask but they have to really mean it. water baptism doesnt save you, if it did then Jesus sacrifice was not needed.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,196
6,539
113
#4
.....and, as many others before it, this thread will be filled with comments which confuse Salvation, Justification, and Sanctification........but that is the norm..........so........ :)
 
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#5
Jn 14:15,23:
If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.


The bible ties love to keeping commands. The bible calls obedience to God's will "doing righteousness".
 
2

2Thewaters

Guest
#6
if a person is to be saved they only need to ask but they have to really mean it. water baptism doesnt save you, if it did then Jesus sacrifice was not needed.
this is not biblical doctrine

obedience is what Jesus taught

obey and believe

give a bible text that we should NOT be water baptized

baptize means to immerse in water

the church of ENGLAND invented baptism by disobedience and it has stuck

the church of England is totally unbiblical and like catholic the baptism is not biblical

About the service
Here you will find information relating to baptism. If you want to know more please contact your local vicar.
What happens during the service?
Your child's Baptism will normally take place during the main Sunday service (usually in the morning). This is so that your child can be seen to be joining the family of the Church and be welcomed into membership. In turn the Church will promise to support and pray for you and your child.
The vicar will make sure you know where to sit and when you need to move. Some parts of the service will be for everyone to join in with, some will be for you and the godparents.
Part of the service will normally take place at the front of the church, but for the Baptism itself, parents and godparents, sometimes family and friends too, will usually be asked by the vicar to gather around the font. (The font is a large basin on a pedestal, containing the water for baptism.)
The vicar will ask the parents and godparents to make declarations on behalf of the child
Making decisions and promises
When you bring your child for Baptism, you will be asked to declare publicly on behalf of your child that you believe in God and that you will bring your child up to follow Jesus.
You will be asked to answer, on your child's behalf, that you have decided to turn away from everything which is evil or sinful and instead to turn towards Christ.
The declarations made by you and the child's godparents will be made in front of the church congregation; the local Christian community will promise to support you and pray for you and your child.
Symbols and actions used during the service
A number of important symbols and actions will be used during the service itself:

  • The sign of the cross - the vicar will make the sign of the cross on your child's forehead. This is like an invisible badge to show that Christians are united with Christ and must not be ashamed to stand up for their faith in him.
The vicar says:
Christ claims you for his own.
Receive the sign of his cross.
Do not be ashamed to confess the faith of Christ crucified.
The vicar may also invite you and the godparents to sign the cross on your child's forehead after he or she has done so.

  • Water - the vicar will pour water on your child's head. Water is a sign of washing and cleansing. In baptism it is a sign of being washed free from sin and beginning a new life with God.
Water is a sign of life, but also a symbol of death. When we are baptized, it is as though our old life is buried in the waters (like drowning) and we are raised to new life with Christ.

  • Anointing - after baptism in water, the minister may put the christening robe on the child and anoint him or her with oil. This is a sign of the outpouring of God's Holy Spirit.
The priest says:
May God, who has received you by baptism into his Church,
pour upon you the riches of his grace,
that within the company of Christ's pilgrim people
you may daily be renewed by his anointing Spirit,
and come to the inheritance of the saints in glory.

  • The welcome - the church congregation will say some formal words of welcome to acknowledge that you child has joined the Church and to show how pleased they are to have you among them.
  • Candles - Jesus is the Light of the World. A large candle may be lit in the church and you may also be given a lighted candle at the end of the service as a reminder of the light which has come into your child's life.

anything but the Bible

children cannt confess sin and are not old enough to be baptized.
 
2

2Thewaters

Guest
#7
Mat_15:9
But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Mar_7:7
Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
 
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
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0
#8
Everything can to carried to excess, even love. If a man takes food from his dependents life in order to love and care for people who are dead in their sins, he is sinning in the name of love.

It is true that a ritual may remind people of a spiritual truth, as it was meant to do in the first place, but outside of that it has no place in our life. Now we have prayer and the Holy Spirit for that. But to hold ritual, something that came from God in the first place, in absolute distain in going to extremes.

I use a prayer scarf. That scarf does not pray for me, any more than a bible in the hand does to show us God, we have to read it. Yet, from the tassels on the corner like touching them that the woman did to Jesus' tassels when she needed healing, to the closing out of the world when it is over my head, it has taught me much.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
113
#9
1 Corinthians 13 King James Version (KJV)

13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.


3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

can we conclude,

Though I give my body to baptize, immerse 100 feet below the sea level, without love, it nothing.