Is Antichrist from Rome or Islam?

[dcontroversal]

As you are led friend, as you are led! As for me I will use the definitions Scripture itself provides to understand the figurative language of prophecy. If you prefer to lean on the private interpretations of man that changes those definitions so be it.
2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

Well that again proves error on your part as I study everything to the (tenth degree) while studying EVER WORD from the original languages so....like I said...what ever! Time will tell for sure who is right and who is wrong....and your use of John. Malachi and Hebrews have nothing to do with the things I have posted in this thread, it is equally OBVIOUS that the BEAST OF REVELATION is the MAN of SIN and the LITTLE HORN of DANIEL...A.K.A Anti-Christ (so called).....SO your point seems to be moot not to mention that the mark of THE BEAST is the NUMBER OF A MAN! So, again, you seem to be in error and I would recommend a re-evaluation of your stance...JUST saying that is!

 

[Jackson123]

or from the Mormon church?

Mormon doctrine is that they alone are the inheritors of the priesthood and the true church, and prophesy that a Mormon will come on a white horse to save the USA and unite the world.
the Mormon church builds Judaic temples and teaches that the final, true temple of God will be built in Missouri, where a Mormon high priest will re-instate the true sacrificial system and from the throne in this temple rule the entire world.

Mormon theology is that God was once a mortal man, and that good Mormons can become gods, even ascending higher than the God of Israel and usurping His throne.
the LDS-prophesied leader of the Mormon church to come will do exactly that - build an abominable temple in MO, USA, sit on the throne there over the whole earth, and declare himself higher than the God of Israel.

Back to brother JesusIsAll question. Can anybody see Mormon united the world?

Mormon is small religion, compare with Catholic or Islam or Hindu.

 

[doulos]

Well that again proves error on your part as I study everything to the (tenth degree) while studying EVER WORD from the original languages so....like I said...what ever! Time will tell for sure who is right and who is wrong....and your use of John. Malachi and Hebrews have nothing to do with the things I have posted in this thread, it is equally OBVIOUS that the BEAST OF REVELATION is the MAN of SIN and the LITTLE HORN of DANIEL...A.K.A Anti-Christ (so called).....SO your point seems to be moot not to mention that the mark of THE BEAST is the NUMBER OF A MAN! So, again, you seem to be in error and I would recommend a re-evaluation of your stance...JUST saying that is!

If it is obvious that the beast is the man of sin and the little horn of Daniel then you should be able to show us where Scripture says this. You should be able to show where Scripture says the man of sin is a world leader. Can you? Book, chapter and verse please? On the other hand when I say beasts as used in the figurative language of prophecy are kingdoms I can show Scripture that says this (Dan7:23) and history proves those definitions true with Daniels lion being Babylon, the bear being Medo-Persia, and the leopard being Greece. My use of John1:1 shows the Word was God. If God does not change (Mal3:6 and Heb13:8) then neither does the Word so if a beast was a kingdom in Daniel it will still be a kingdom in Revelation. If God changed that definition of a beast that would mean God/Word changes and we know that can't happen or Mal3:6 and Hebrews13:8 would be in error. So are the Scriptures in error or could it be your doctrine is in error? As for as the number of the beast being the number of a man, that does not prove the beast is a man. It only demonstrates that the beast and a man share the same number. To say they are the same because they share the same number iis faulty logic. If I were to use your same method of logic then I would have to say my dog Zeke is a man because he shares the name of a man. We both know that would not be true, it would be using faulty logic. Don't reply in haste take some time, prayerfully take it to God then consider what has been shown to you in these posts, read the Scriptures used to support the view a beast is a kingdom. No matter how many years we have studied none of us know it all and if we allow ourselves to have a closed mind no matter how much we study we will not find the truth. None of us have perfect understanding but if we use the definitions Scripture provides we can at least get a more accurate understanding of what the prophecies say.

 

[Jackson123]

[SUP] rev 13 : Characteristic of second beast
1. Had 2 horn, like a lamb but speak like a dragon / Lamb is Jesus. like a lamb is like a Jesus.

Dragon is Lucifer, speak like a dragon is speak like a Lucifer.

2. exercise the power like first beast. Is first beast still in power when second beast come?

3. Do great wonder.

4. cause people worship the first beast/ it may the first beast still in power when the second beast show up.

5. cause people receive the mark of the beast.


Is it a kingdom or a man?


Rev 13

11 [/SUP]And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

[SUP]14 [/SUP]And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

[SUP]15 [/SUP]And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

 

[psalm6819]

The eastern leg of the Roman empire is often referred to as the Byzantine empire, why do people not recognize it as part of the Roman empire??? Are we that ego/eurocentric that we dismiss it without consideration? The Antichrist is also referred to as "the Assyrian".

 

[JesusIsAll]

The eastern leg of the Roman empire is often referred to as the Byzantine empire, why do people not recognize it as part of the Roman empire??? Are we that ego/eurocentric that we dismiss it without consideration? The Antichrist is also referred to as "the Assyrian".

Yes, and the great image of Daniel 2 had legs of iron, that is, two legs, and many Bible scholars believe those iron legs to be the Roman Empire, West and East, the feet mixed with clay the end times incarnation of that empire, but not as the ancient Roman empire with one emperor and united as such, but a looser empire that crops up, where ten leaders give control over to the beast to form a revived Rome. This is as valid a view as any. Note the people of the beast to come destroyed the temple in 70 AD. (Daniel 9:26)

Revelation 17:12-13 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

 

[Jackson123]

Yes, and the great image of Daniel 2 had legs of iron, that is, two legs, and many Bible scholars believe those iron legs to be the Roman Empire, West and East, the feet mixed with clay the end times incarnation of that empire, but not as the ancient Roman empire with one emperor and united as such, but a looser empire that crops up, where ten leaders give control over to the beast to form a revived Rome. This is as valid a view as any. Note the people of the beast to come destroyed the temple in 70 AD. (Daniel 9:26)

Revelation 17:12-13 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

So the beast receive power as a kings.

Mean the beast is a human not a kingdom.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Mean the beast is a human not a kingdom.

Pretty safe to say the "man of sin" is a human, at least until somebody comes around and allegorizes it into the name of an Old Testament race horse or something.

 

[Jackson123]

Beast/Little Horn a.k.a. anti-Christ (so-called) is the 12 IMAM of Islam
False Prophet/Beast NUMBER 2 is the LAST POPE of a UNITED ROMAN Catholic/Greek Orthodox Pseudo Religion

My view.....!

[SUP]11 [/SUP]And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.


Let assume First beast is Islam/Isis. And second beast is Pope.

The second beast that cause people worship the first beast.

Mean Pope behind the ISIS.

 

[Jackson123]

Pretty safe to say the "man of sin" is a human, at least until somebody comes around and allegorizes it into the name of an Old Testament race horse or something.

In Letter, Man Is human./ Male human

Man of sin is Human that have a lot of sin.

 

[crossnote]

Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

The 'people of the prince' that destroyed the city (70ad) were Romans, therefore the 'prince' (antichrist) will be from Rome.

 

[doulos]

Sad very sad God is not the author of confusion. according to Scripture beasts are kngdoms, therefore both beasts in Revelation are 2 individual kingdoms! The method of interpreting the figurative language of prophecy requires that we be consistent in our definitions for the terms used. If beasts were kingdoms in Daniel they are still kingdoms in Revelation. Don't let the doctrines you have been taught blind you to the fact that almost all of the prophecies given in Revelation have unfolded right before our eyes over the last 1900+years. When it comes to our core doctrines most Christians believe the reformers got it right. Yet when it comes to prophecy most want to follow the false beliefs derived from anti-reformation writers like the Jesuit priests Ribera and Alcazar. Why?
1Co 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
Where are you people getting your definition for a beast from? The unchanging God/Word positively states that beasts are kingdoms (Dan7:23). Yet some people insist on changing that definition. So let me get this straight according to some of you in Daniel beasts are kingdoms, in Rev13:1-2 a beast is antichrist or man of sin, but then that definition changes again in Rev13:11 to false prophet? Please show from Scripture where the unchanging God/Word changed those definitions. Could it be the traditionally taught doctrines concerning eschatology are in error?

 

[Bookends]

Let's play pin the tale on the anti-christ.

 

[Kerry]

The Antichrist will be a Jew. The bible plainly states that he will reject the God of his fathers. Most likely a Syrian Jew. With out writing a book this is my conclusion along with many theologians.

 

[Revelator7]

The Antichrist will be a Jew. The bible plainly states that he will reject the God of his fathers. Most likely a Syrian Jew. With out writing a book this is my conclusion along with many theologians.

Food for thought: What if he could be a Christian? "Father" or "Pater" in the Greek Biblically can mean literal or figurative. The God of his fathers... Those fathers could be Christian. The same God of gentile christians is the same God of the messianic jews.

 

[Kerry]

Food for thought: What if he could be a Christian? "Father" or "Pater" in the Greek Biblically can mean literal or figurative. The God of his fathers... Those fathers could be Christian. The same God of gentile christians is the same God of the messianic jews.

The father of every Christians is Abraham. Which is not Jewish. He may pretend to be Christian, but most likely not as he will kill Christians and make it illegal. He will want to be worshiped as God and try to kill those who do not. He can only convince Israel to sit own the mercy seat if he is a Jew. The Jews will not accept a savoir that is not Jewish.

 

[Jackson123]

The Antichrist will be a Jew. The bible plainly states that he will reject the God of his fathers. Most likely a Syrian Jew. With out writing a book this is my conclusion along with many theologians.

Can you provide with the verse?

Jew can be Muslim Jew, Catholic Jew, or can be anything Jew.

 

[dcontroversal]

If it is obvious that the beast is the man of sin and the little horn of Daniel then you should be able to show us where Scripture says this. You should be able to show where Scripture says the man of sin is a world leader. Can you? Book, chapter and verse please? On the other hand when I say beasts as used in the figurative language of prophecy are kingdoms I can show Scripture that says this (Dan7:23) and history proves those definitions true with Daniels lion being Babylon, the bear being Medo-Persia, and the leopard being Greece. My use of John1:1 shows the Word was God. If God does not change (Mal3:6 and Heb13:8) then neither does the Word so if a beast was a kingdom in Daniel it will still be a kingdom in Revelation. If God changed that definition of a beast that would mean God/Word changes and we know that can't happen or Mal3:6 and Hebrews13:8 would be in error. So are the Scriptures in error or could it be your doctrine is in error? As for as the number of the beast being the number of a man, that does not prove the beast is a man. It only demonstrates that the beast and a man share the same number. To say they are the same because they share the same number iis faulty logic. If I were to use your same method of logic then I would have to say my dog Zeke is a man because he shares the name of a man. We both know that would not be true, it would be using faulty logic. Don't reply in haste take some time, prayerfully take it to God then consider what has been shown to you in these posts, read the Scriptures used to support the view a beast is a kingdom. No matter how many years we have studied none of us know it all and if we allow ourselves to have a closed mind no matter how much we study we will not find the truth. None of us have perfect understanding but if we use the definitions Scripture provides we can at least get a more accurate understanding of what the prophecies say.

Keep studying as you are missing a few things..like study the fall of the DAUGHTER OF BABYLON the HINDERMOST of the NATIONS and the 80 or so characteristics that identify HER and HER NATIONAL SYMBOLS....HER FUTURE DESTRUCTION and HOW SHE IS DESTROTED in Jeremiah 50 and 51 and re-evaluate your misapplication of the 1st BEAST of CHAPTER 7 to BABYLON B.C. and BABYLON is FALLEN..IS FALLEN...then look to DANIEL and the night it fell and the double USES OF MENE and the PLURAL/SINGULAR USE of UPHARSIN and then UNDERSTAND that GOD BLENDS past and future CONTEXT into one.

Again...OBVIOUS that the BEAST/LITTLE HORN/MAN of SIN one and the same who RULES over the ENTIRE WORLD...LIKE I said...KEEP studying and maybe you will get it...not going to argue with you...so like you said....you will feel led to believe what you hammer out on your own anvil as most do!

THE BEAST makes war against the saints and prevails against them
THE LITTLE HORN wears out the saints and overcomes them
THE man of SIN is the BEAST/LITTLE HORN of REVELATION and DANIEL

AND ALL THE WORLD wondered after the BEAST and said....WHO IS ABLE TO MAKE WAR WITH HIM<--YOU do understand a personal pronoun!

ONE WORD a PERSONAL PRONOUN blows your theory out of the water!

 

[dcontroversal]

Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

The 'people of the prince' that destroyed the city (70ad) were Romans, therefore the 'prince' (antichrist) will be from Rome.

I always viewed it like the flowing...

1. He will come from what Rome conquered and then was conquered by Alexander the Great and then divided between his four Generals...
2. The wars between the Kings of the North and Kings of the South Ptolemys and Selucids <--spelling on both? and out of the SYRIAN area King of the NORTH he would come. Daniel 10-11....

I view the false prophet BEAST with two horns ONE higher than the other as the false prophet from a united Roman Catholic and Greek Orthodox blending under the Roman Pope<---current Pope

Not arguing, just throwing out my view here...!

 

[Kerry]

Can you provide with the verse?

Jew can be Muslim Jew, Catholic Jew, or can be anything Jew.

A Jew is a descendant of Judah or Benjamin. The religious order of Israel will accept nothing else and he must be a descendant of David. Now can he falsify these credentials? that is an argument among theologians. I don't think so. The Messiah was and is a son of David and the false own must be as well.

2 Kings

22 And he forsook the Lord God of his fathers, and walked not in the way of the Lord.

Daniel 11

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
37Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.