Another requirement for salvation; Not that simple

[stillness]

Bronson, remember what I said about those who thought you, would say to them, "who are you to judge another mans servant, to His own master he stands or falls." Thief who believed represents believer's, the one who mocked and asked for proof unbelievers. Fortunately we are not judged by man's judgment, we stole our life from God and went our own way. "Shall a man rob God."

 

[Bronson]

What a silly comment this is.
He was nailed to a cross, remember?
Thankfully Jesus could notice things you don't and has justice you seem to not understand.

The Cross is a pagan symbol used by Christendom, Jesus was nailed to a stake or a tree as was the system in those days.

One of the most sacrilegious scene that I can think of is seeing an effigy of Jesus, nails through the hands or wrists, crown of thorns on his head and blood from his tortured body in almost every church in Christendom.

Imagine: Mother takes her children to a church, they look in fright at the effigy and mother says, "There is your God Kiddies, He will save you"

 

[loveme1]

*Notice "reward" (not eternal life) is connected with "according as his work shall be." Now read 1 Corinthians 3:13 - each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is. 14 If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; (of reward) but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

"Do His commandments" does not earn us eternal life, but it is evidence that we have been granted eternal life through faith and are born of God. Some translations read, "Blessed are those who wash their robes," which symbolizes those who have been forgiven of their sins through the blood of the Lamb (Romans 3:24-26). *Also see Revelation 7:14.

Those who by faith that have trusted in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation have received Christ's imputed righteousness (Romans 4:4-6; Philippians 3:9). Unbelievers are all in the same boat with those in Revelation 22:15.

I have shared much with you and preacher and you continue to be Spiritual blind preferring to fill yourself with false hope... All is left for others to read and recieve or refuse...


You fill in many blanks rather than recieve what is written for us... you can not perceive... and I can not boast because I was once blind like you but now see By His Majesties love and grace.

Take it up with Heavenly Father and our Lord and Saviour. I'm simply sharing the message as taught to.

 

[stonesoffire]

If anything is required, it's not from a heart of love.

We love Him because He first loved us. Just sit at His feet, and the serving comes naturally.

 

[mailmandan]

I have shared much with you and preacher and you continue to be Spiritual blind preferring to fill yourself with false hope... All is left for others to read and recieve or refuse...

It's you who is spiritually blind and is filled with false hope that you will be saved by works. My hope is in the truth of the gospel (Colossians 1:10; Romans 1:16) and not in a "works based" false gospel. The gospel is hid to those who DON'T BELIEVE (2 Corinthians 4:3,4).

You fill in many blanks rather than recieve what is written for us... you can not perceive... and I can not boast because I was once blind like you but now see By His Majesties love and grace.

You are still blind.

Take it up with Heavenly Father and our Lord and Saviour. I'm simply sharing the message as taught to.

You need to take it up with the Father and my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. All you have shared with me is a perverted gospel and you are not fooling me for one second. I know that I believe in the name of the Son of God and I know that I have eternal life (1 John 5:13). Praise God!

 

[loveme1]

It's you who is spiritually blind and is filled with false hope that you will be saved by works. My hope is in the truth of the gospel (Colossians 1:10; Romans 1:16) and not in a "works based" false gospel. The gospel is hid to those who DON'T BELIEVE (2 Corinthians 4:3,4).

You are still blind.

You need to take it up with the Father and my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. All you have shared with me is a perverted gospel and you are not fooling me for one second. I know that I believe in the name of the Son of God and I know that I have eternal life (1 John 5:13). Praise God!

You are not filled with the Holy Spirit and can not recieve the Truth until you Repent and Believe.

Imputed righteousness... you will not hear that the Lord can spew you out... or tell you to depart.. you will not hear that you may not be given a reward based on your works.. and all this is written.

The Messiah overcome what we could not to save us... but He will not give the His reward to those who do not work.. You are to be perfect and righteous according to His Testament but you say no... I need not be to the Redeemer... I believe and set my heart to His commands.. and then will be counted worthy of His reward or not.

By offering Himself as the Lamb without sin He can give you the right to the Tree of life... but be not haughty... and refuse His instruction.. because you will not be counted Faithful.

The gate is narrow and sheep will be permitted in by the Good Shepherds authority.. if they followed Him on the path of Righteousness.

Dont turn up at the gate and expect to tell the Good Shepherd you deserve to get in by the imputed righteousness card... you have work to do.. so set you heart and Labour in love.

 

[mailmandan]

You are not filled with the Holy Spirit and can not recieve the Truth until you Repent and Believe.

I received the truth several years ago when I came to repent and believe the gospel. Perverting the gospel is not the fruit of being filled with the Holy Spirit. You still need to repent and believe the gospel.

Imputed righteousness... you will not hear that the Lord can spew you out... or tell you to depart.. you will not hear that you may not be given a reward based on your works.. and all this is written.

So you reject imputed righteousness? I'm not surprised. The Lord does not tell genuine believers to depart, but unbelievers. Rewards are based on works. Salvation is based on faith.

The Messiah overcome what we could not to save us... but He will not give the His reward to those who do not work.. You are to be perfect and righteous according to His Testament but you say no... I need not be to the Redeemer... I believe and set my heart to His commands.. and then will be counted worthy of His reward or not.

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

Believers are accounted as righteous through faith, but you say no. It's one thing to be perfect "mature, complete" and another thing to be absolutely perfect - sinless, without fault or defect, flawless 100% of the time. Without faith it's impossible to please God no matter how many of His commands that you set out to externally obey. Eternal life is a gift not a reward.

By offering Himself as the Lamb without sin He can give you the right to the Tree of life... but be not haughty... and refuse His instruction.. because you will not be counted Faithful.

Only genuine believers will be counted faithful.

The gate is narrow and sheep will be permitted in by the Good Shepherds authority.. if they followed Him on the path of Righteousness.

There are many deceived goats who thought they were sheep (Matthew 7:22-23).

Dont turn up at the gate and expect to tell the Good Shepherd you deserve to get in by the imputed righteousness card... you have work to do.. so set you heart and Labour in love.

Imputed righteousness card? So you reject Romans 4:5-6? Don't turn up at the gate and expect to tell Jesus Christ you deserve to get in based on the merits of your works. You will hear the same response from Him that these many people in Matthew 7:22-23 will hear.

 

[Grace777x70]

Looks like it is time for "scripture" again in the area of righteousness. Why do people fight so much against the work of Christ and instead live by their own humanistic thoughts? Why don't we believe in Christ? Why are we continually denying Him?

I can give what the scriptures say about righteousness and believers that are "in Christ" now because of Christ Himself. Everyone can believe what they want too.

The understanding of the new creation in Christ and the new identity of the believer is paramount to living the true Christian life.


Here it says our spirit ( the inner person that is a new creation in Christ ) is alive because of righteousness that it is it.

Romans 8:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin,yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.

Here righteousness is a gift - you don't earn it.

Romans 5:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

We have grace reigning in our lives because of righteousness in us.

Romans 5:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21[/SUP] That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Here righteousness comes by faith.

Romans 9:30 (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

Here when we believe - we are righteousness.

Romans 10:10 (KJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

We are in the kingdom of God.

Romans 14:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17[/SUP] For the kingdom of God ( Jesus said that the kingdom of God is within you..He might know a thing or two ) is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

Here it says that God made us righteousness in Christ.

1 Corinthians 1:30 (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

This says we have become the righteousness of Christ ( this is called a dependent clause in the greek - it is determined as fulfilled because Christ became sin )

2 Corinthians 5:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Believers are called righteousness.

2 Corinthians 6:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


Here it is saying that "righteousness comes by Christ".

Galatians 2:21 (NASB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] "I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."

Here we have the breastplate of righteousness - which is the armor of God that we are to be strong in.

Ephesians 6:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, andhaving on the breastplate of righteousness;

This talks about the new man in Christ - the new creation.

Ephesians 4:24 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] and put on the new self, which in the likeness of God has been created in righteousness and holiness of the truth.

Ok..that's enough..there are tons more....

 

[Grace777x70]

It was prophetically spoken of in the OT as well. The proper understanding of righteousness is needed in order to walk out of "babyhood" in the Christian life.

Christians have both imputed righteousness and "imparted" righteousness. We have the very righteousness of God Himself.

We that are in Christ have the Lord's righteousness now in our inner man that is in Christ.

Isaiah 45:24-25 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] "They will say of Me, 'Only in the LORD are righteousness and strength.' Men will come to Him, And all who were angry at Him will be put to shame.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] "In the LORD all the offspring of Israel Will be justified and will glory."

Here is one more from the OT - Isaiah 54: 17 of the Lord telling what the believer would have because of what Christ did in Isaiah 53 when He died on the cross to take away our sin and make us righteous in Him.

Isaiah 54:17

[SUP]17 [/SUP] "No weapon that is formed against you will prosper; And every tongue that accuses you in judgment you will condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, And their righteousness is from Me," declares the LORD.

Folks we have a great salvation in our Lord Jesus Christ!

Ephesians 3:8 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] To me, the very least of all saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unfathomable riches of Christ,

 

[loveme1]

I received the truth several years ago when I came to repent and believe the gospel. Perverting the gospel is not the fruit of being filled with the Holy Spirit. You still need to repent and believe the gospel.

So you reject imputed righteousness? I'm not surprised. The Lord does not tell genuine believers to depart, but unbelievers. Rewards are based on works. Salvation is based on faith.

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

Believers are accounted as righteous through faith, but you say no. It's one thing to be perfect "mature, complete" and another thing to be absolutely perfect - sinless, without fault or defect, flawless 100% of the time. Without faith it's impossible to please God no matter how many of His commands that you set out to externally obey. Eternal life is a gift not a reward.

Only genuine believers will be counted faithful.

There are many deceived goats who thought they were sheep (Matthew 7:22-23).

Imputed righteousness card? So you reject Romans 4:5-6? Don't turn up at the gate and expect to tell Jesus Christ you deserve to get in based on the merits of your works. You will hear the same response from Him that these many people in Matthew 7:22-23 will hear.

It is that I understand those verses.. not that I reject...

It is the obedient heart that sets about to obey.... not someone who is directly against His Testimony and does not see it.. I did not write Revelation... I did not say it was a reward.. or that it will be given according to works... yet you state things as if I wrote them.. I believe it and relay it....

If I'm told to depart then I will know it is deserved by a Just GOD and serve whatever comes.

I will not exalt myself to judge myself worthy but strive to be counted Faithful.

Running the race set before me....

 

[mailmandan]

It is that I understand those verses.. not that I reject...

You have demonstrated otherwise.

I will not exalt myself to judge myself worthy but strive to be counted Faithful.

Through FAITH, believers are "accounted as worthy" (Luke 20:35) and "accounted as righteous" because we believe in Him/trust in Christ alone for salvation and not in works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9), but apart from the blood of Christ, we are not worthy and righteous "in of ourselves" (Romans 3:23-26).

 

[loveme1]

Romans 6

6 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.






Will you yield yourselves as servants of the Lord? Will you obey Him from the heart?

obedience unto righteousness...

Will you be rewarded with the gift of eternal life through the Messiah by Keeping His Testimony?

what doctrine did they set their heart to before this was written?


For if your heart is set on this and not the doctrine delivered first you are not on good foundation... The Testimony of the Messiah... build your house there and then you will be safe.

 

[loveme1]

Just to let you know I love you all and that is why I will share the Truth even if we are at odds.

 

[Jackson123]

Romans 6

6 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.






Will you yield yourselves as servants of the Lord? Will you obey Him from the heart?

obedience unto righteousness...

Will you be rewarded with the gift of eternal life through the Messiah by Keeping His Testimony?

what doctrine did they set their heart to before this was written?


For if your heart is set on this and not the doctrine delivered first you are not on good foundation... The Testimony of the Messiah... build your house there and then you will be safe.

basically Jesus want us to be like Him, Jesus do not love sin. He patiently molded us and teach us to hate sin.

 

[FranC]

The Cross is a pagan symbol used by Christendom, Jesus was nailed to a stake or a tree as was the system in those days.

One of the most sacrilegious scene that I can think of is seeing an effigy of Jesus, nails through the hands or wrists, crown of thorns on his head and blood from his tortured body in almost every church in Christendom.

Imagine: Mother takes her children to a church, they look in fright at the effigy and mother says, "There is your God Kiddies, He will save you"

My kids have seen many churches.
I NEVER said that to them.

So the very Death of Jesus that SAVED you is now a sacrilegious scene?
I can't agree and I don't really understand it, but it's a personal opinion and one that I must respect.

And how do you figure Jesus was nailed to a tree?
Sometimes a tree was used, but most times it was a cross.
That's why it was called a crucifixion.
Because it made a cross.
Oh. Sometimes it was even shaped like an x.

The power of Jesus is in the resurrection.
There are many paintings and scenes of that too.

But if the Death didn't occur, neither would the sacrifice have occured.

(you need both, really)

 

[Meggido]

The Cross is a pagan symbol used by Christendom, Jesus was nailed to a stake or a tree as was the system in those days.

One of the most sacrilegious scene that I can think of is seeing an effigy of Jesus, nails through the hands or wrists, crown of thorns on his head and blood from his tortured body in almost every church in Christendom.

Imagine: Mother takes her children to a church, they look in fright at the effigy and mother says, "There is your God Kiddies, He will save you"

Why should we have an effigy of a cross with Jesus still on it? He is not on the cross or in the tomb, he is risen!

 

[FranC]

You have demonstrated otherwise.

Through FAITH, believers are "accounted as worthy" (Luke 20:35) and "accounted as righteous" because we believe in Him/trust in Christ alone for salvation and not in works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9), but apart from the blood of Christ, we are not worthy and righteous "in of ourselves" (Romans 3:23-26).

Loveme1 is right MMD.

There are many here who would agree with both her and me.
If you'd read through the New Testament without your preconceived notions, you'd come to know that
YOU don't get to make doctrine.

JESUS already did that.
JESUS explained to us all we have to do in all 4 of the gospels.
JESUS explained to us exactly HOW we are to enter into the Kingdom and how we are to REMAIN there.

You like the easy way to believism.
Just depen on Jesus to do everything for you while you preach that we don't HAVE to do anything but believe.

That terrible word, BELIEVE. yeah. IF you believed JESUS, you wouldn't be AFRAID to say that you MUST follow Him.

Apparently you've accepted Him as your Savior,
But not yet as Lord.
You are not as yet a member of the Kingdom or a disciple.

When you truly understand, maybe you will be.

Those who are ashamed of Jesus' words and do not heed them, will be thrown out into the dark.
John 5:28-29

Read it a few times.

And please don't talk to me about the Catholic Church.
You don't even have to answer.
This isn't really for you.

 

[FranC]

Why should we have an effigy of a cross with Jesus still on it? He is not on the cross or in the tomb, he is risen!

Well, but he's right. The cross is seen in every Church you go to visit, in Europe, for instance.
In paintings, etc.

 

[FranC]

You have demonstrated otherwise.

Through FAITH, believers are "accounted as worthy" (Luke 20:35) and "accounted as righteous" because we believe in Him/trust in Christ alone for salvation and not in works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9), but apart from the blood of Christ, we are not worthy and righteous "in of ourselves" (Romans 3:23-26).

If you're not against works,
WHY DOES IT SOUND LIKE YOU ARE.

if it walks like a duck
talks like a duck.....
maybe it IS a duck.

So why does the word WORKS scare you???

 

[mailmandan]

Loveme1 is right MMD.

There are many here who would agree with both her and me.
If you'd read through the New Testament without your preconceived notions, you'd come to know that
YOU don't get to make doctrine.

JESUS already did that.
JESUS explained to us all we have to do in all 4 of the gospels.
JESUS explained to us exactly HOW we are to enter into the Kingdom and how we are to REMAIN there.

You like the easy way to believism.
Just depen on Jesus to do everything for you while you preach that we don't HAVE to do anything but believe.

That terrible word, BELIEVE. yeah. IF you believed JESUS, you wouldn't be AFRAID to say that you MUST follow Him.

Apparently you've accepted Him as your Savior,
But not yet as Lord.
You are not as yet a member of the Kingdom or a disciple.

When you truly understand, maybe you will be.

Those who are ashamed of Jesus' words and do not heed them, will be thrown out into the dark.
John 5:28-29

Read it a few times.

And please don't talk to me about the Catholic Church.
You don't even have to answer.
This isn't really for you.

Loveme1 is not right and neither are you. Also, take your STRAW MAN ARGUMENTS somewhere else.