50 First Dates

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RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#1
Well, it was cute in the Adam Sandler-Drew Barrymore movie but...

My wife has always had memory issues. We can spend an entire day discussing an issue, and come to a mutual conclusion on that subject. But the next morning she will roll out of bed with absolutely no recollection of the discussion or its conclusion (leading her to no longer support the conclusion). On other occasions, I’ve seen her walk into a room, make a statement, and not 3 minutes later ask a question for which her statement was the answer, and have absolutely no remembrance of having made any statement mere minutes earlier. She also flip flops like a Republican candidate after a midterm primary. There is absolutely no consistency in her direction on any matter.

So last year I took her to a Psychiatrist for cognitive testing. 17 tests given over two 6 hour days later, the results were disturbing. Her highest score (in math) was 35%. The average of all her scores was only 18%. Her IQ tested out at 86 – keeping in mind that at 85 they start to label you as retarded. The woman is (and please forgive me for the use of this term, I know it sounds unloving but I find no other way to accurately describe the situation) a certified village idiot.

This has made our relationship extremely problematic. For one, I spend a huge amount of every single day at my desk and on the phone. I have to take care of my stuff, our stuff, her stuff, and the most energy and time consuming of all, the stuff she thought she would take care of but only made worse. Secondly, our relationship has absolutely no hope of ever growing or advancing, since every day is an exercise is rehashing what we went over the day before – and the day before that, and the day before that, and… There’s no way to make forward progress when all our efforts go to revisiting the past. Too, she blows like a flag in the wind. We make a decision to pursue an action, but the next day she turns a total 180 and wants something different. There is absolutely no consistency in her wants and directions.

It brings me to the place where, if we are to make any progress at all, I have to leave her out of the decision making process and unilaterally make dictatorial decisions for the both of us. I’m sure you can see the problems that causes.

I have reason to believe that God has charged me with being a “caregiver to a caregiver”, a position I’m not entirely against given that she takes care of her invalid mother and sister. But the position I find myself in goes far beyond that – I find my position to be that of personal maid-servant to the village idiot. And honestly I just don’t have it in me to do that on a full time basis. I’m stressed and depleted and running on empty from the effort.

The Dr. said that her scores should come up with some kind of study/schooling program, but admittedly they will not rise by much. And I had her on the Lumosity thing for a while (the scores arising out of that effort were eerily close to those generated by the cognitive testing) but she abandoned that after it produced no real progress in her condition.

What do I do? Where do we go? I love her for her heart of gold, but detest the fact that her brains are pure mush and that it falls on me to carry her piggy-back each and every single day. There’s a reason I chose not to have children, yet I find that I am saddled with the biggest child possible. It’s a load that is breaking me, and yet one I cannot find a way out from under. Is there any hope?
 

santuzza

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2013
1,609
38
48
#2
Well, I guess my first question is this: has she been like this all the time you've known her? If not, then she seriously needs medical care and further testing because something is quite wrong. And if she has always been like this, my next question would be why did you marry her? Could you not tell there were cognitive issues from the get-go?
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
#3
Sounds like maybe she's getting Alzheimers disease.. Has she had any illnesses or trauma to her head or brain?
 
S

ServantStrike

Guest
#4
Yeah, I'm curious too as to whether she was always a bit off, or if this is a new thing.

If it's new, then it's probably disease related, maybe curable, maybe not, but the biblical answer is you're going to have to make it work.


Have you considered having her write down the things you two talk about in her own handwriting? Seriously, when she's changed her mind the next day, pull out a piece of paper with her own handwriting on it showing her that's not how she felt the day before. If that doesn't work, use an audio recording device. If she's really that far down on the cognitive spectrum and her memory is that bad, then it could really help.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#5
She has always had issues but we never knew how bad it was until the testing. The doctors can find no physical cause for these problems. I have tried recording her, and then playing it back once she waffles, but she seems to give that no credence. When reminded what she said yesterday, she gives no place to it today.

Here's a recent issue: I made plans (airfare and hotels) to go back to Minnesota next month based upon her assurances that it would not conflict with anything. Yesterday she tells me I can't go because she made previous plans. We keep a calendar but she can't be bothered to enter things into it.

Again, the only answer seems to be my becoming the family dictator, and omitting her participation from any planning activities.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,313
16,301
113
69
Tennessee
#6
Is she still taking care of her mother and sister? Speaking from my own experience I believe that I have an understanding of what you are going through as my own back was breaking. Yes, there is hope- if you are willing to go down this path. I could say that I have said a prayer for you, and I have, but I am sure that brings little or no comfort to you. You need answered prayer - you need deliverance.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#7
Your prayer does bring comfort, thank you. I always figure the more people lifting an issue to God the better it's going to turn out. And I don't see any option to going down this path. She is my wife, for richer or poorer, sickness and health, smart or not so much ;). I'm just not comfortable with doing things without her input... while the reality is I'm going to have to if we're ever going to get anywhere in life.

In God's eyes I'm supposed to be a leader, not a dictator. And yet dictatorship seems to be the only way forward.
 

JC3

Junior Member
Feb 20, 2015
11
0
1
#8
I am very very sorry to read this. It mirrors experiences I had with my wife starting in 2005, and in 2011 she was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. I hope that's not your situation, but you should get it checked out for a few reasons. Apropos this thread -- Once my wife and I digested the news, we got back on the same side and the tensions abated. The memory problems don't go away, so you'll still have situations like you describe, but you'll learn to just let them slide.

If it does turn out to be AD, drop me a line. Lots of other thoughts I could share.
 
P

psychomom

Guest
#9
Rick, i'm so sorry to hear of this. :(

i will be praying, but i wonder, assuming you didn't marry last year,
has something brought this issue to a head recently?
is there some additional stressor possibly affecting one or both of you?

you needn't answer, of course. :)
the care of family members and the travel sound stressful enough, certainly.

really, truly praying. ♥
-ellie
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,943
113
#10
What they said, and sorry you are in this situation.

I agree, what has triggered this right now? And perhaps caregiving is stressing her out? Memory might be a problem, but add to it the stress of caring for two people, and you have your 50 dates.

Praying God will give you some answers to ease your pain and burden.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#11
What brought it to a head is years of my being worn down by it, and our attempt to leave LA for greener pastures. Trying to find a place to settle, and property to settle in, is really tough when your partner is forever flip flopping in her ways. And yes having both her mother and favorite sister incapacitated doesn't help the situation for her. We are trying to accommodate both of them in our new property, but again that's hard to do when today this looks perfect, but tomorrow it doesn't.

Thank you all for your prayers. This is most helpful.
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
271
83
#12
You are to love her as Christ loves the church -and to serve her as He serves us. It sounds like you are doing just that. And it isn't easy. I know my husband would have a difficult time with this and he has a servant's heart.

You ARE able to do this and through all the endurance you have shown there is a payoff. Romans 5 says that you are developing strength of character (not that it helps to know this when there are problems right in front of you) - but you are.

Lord,
Send Ricky all the help he needs for the care of his wife. May he be given comfort when it begins to overwhelm him. May he be given all wisdom when it comes to making decisions. May you help his wife to think more clearly and remember more easily. May she be able to come alongside of him more often and be a partner in this marriage. Amen
 
G

GaryA

Guest
#13
Ricky:

"I am so sorry that you are having to deal with this situation. There is a lot of it in the world today. You are not alone."

That is all I will say at this time.

I will pray for all four of you...

:)
 

sandtigeress

Senior Member
Apr 29, 2013
526
16
18
#14
It is very difficult to live in an everchanging reality and a partner that changes his views all the time.
Prayers go out to you.
 

DiscipleDave

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2012
3,095
69
48
#15
Well, it was cute in the Adam Sandler-Drew Barrymore movie but...

My wife has always had memory issues. We can spend an entire day discussing an issue, and come to a mutual conclusion on that subject. But the next morning she will roll out of bed with absolutely no recollection of the discussion or its conclusion (leading her to no longer support the conclusion). On other occasions, I’ve seen her walk into a room, make a statement, and not 3 minutes later ask a question for which her statement was the answer, and have absolutely no remembrance of having made any statement mere minutes earlier. She also flip flops like a Republican candidate after a midterm primary. There is absolutely no consistency in her direction on any matter.

So last year I took her to a Psychiatrist for cognitive testing. 17 tests given over two 6 hour days later, the results were disturbing. Her highest score (in math) was 35%. The average of all her scores was only 18%. Her IQ tested out at 86 – keeping in mind that at 85 they start to label you as retarded. The woman is (and please forgive me for the use of this term, I know it sounds unloving but I find no other way to accurately describe the situation) a certified village idiot.

This has made our relationship extremely problematic. For one, I spend a huge amount of every single day at my desk and on the phone. I have to take care of my stuff, our stuff, her stuff, and the most energy and time consuming of all, the stuff she thought she would take care of but only made worse. Secondly, our relationship has absolutely no hope of ever growing or advancing, since every day is an exercise is rehashing what we went over the day before – and the day before that, and the day before that, and… There’s no way to make forward progress when all our efforts go to revisiting the past. Too, she blows like a flag in the wind. We make a decision to pursue an action, but the next day she turns a total 180 and wants something different. There is absolutely no consistency in her wants and directions.

It brings me to the place where, if we are to make any progress at all, I have to leave her out of the decision making process and unilaterally make dictatorial decisions for the both of us. I’m sure you can see the problems that causes.

I have reason to believe that God has charged me with being a “caregiver to a caregiver”, a position I’m not entirely against given that she takes care of her invalid mother and sister. But the position I find myself in goes far beyond that – I find my position to be that of personal maid-servant to the village idiot. And honestly I just don’t have it in me to do that on a full time basis. I’m stressed and depleted and running on empty from the effort.

The Dr. said that her scores should come up with some kind of study/schooling program, but admittedly they will not rise by much. And I had her on the Lumosity thing for a while (the scores arising out of that effort were eerily close to those generated by the cognitive testing) but she abandoned that after it produced no real progress in her condition.

What do I do? Where do we go? I love her for her heart of gold, but detest the fact that her brains are pure mush and that it falls on me to carry her piggy-back each and every single day. There’s a reason I chose not to have children, yet I find that I am saddled with the biggest child possible. It’s a load that is breaking me, and yet one I cannot find a way out from under. Is there any hope?
Did you agree to "For better or worse"?

Those who draw close to God, He will then draw close to them. my Prayers go out to your wife, and i will pray for you as well.

^i^ Responding to OP
 
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mystikmind

Guest
#16
On a lighter not, allot of men would like a woman who forgets their wrongdoing! But seriously, i can identify with her on certain levels, my brain simply refuses to remember numbers, it is quite incredible, i have been working in the same office for 10 years, same phone number i use every day, and every day i have to look at the card to remember the number. My mobile, i have had that for over five years, no chance of remembering that number!

It is embarrassing and i feel like a fool when my boss at work sees that i don't remember the office number after working there 10 years!

And it is not just numbers, i have a much harder time than most remembering peoples names, and important dates, and every day things as well. If i have to buy milk on the way home from work, it won't happen!

On the other hand, conversations is one thing i do remember well, i can remember something someone said 20 years ago and then know immediately when they say something hypocritical. I can remember sights and sounds and objects almost as if i had a photographic memory.... literally 'photographic' lol, but i cannot play mix and match, or tests to remember five objects ... i can remember 1 or 2, and i can remember them in great detail, but for the rest, it's just a black hole
 
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soccermom19

Guest
#17
I am truly sorry you are going through this.
Just a thought, but have you ever considered letting someone else care for her mother and sister? Such as another relative, an in home care provider, or maybe even a facility like a nursing home?
If you are interested in the in home care, you could get financial assistance for it, if that is a problem. The care provider could help lessen the daily load on both you and your wife. Just suggestions though, it is completely up to you.
Dont feel like a dictator. It sounds like your wife is much like a child and may need to be lead or dictated to. (No offense intended). You are doing your best to care for her. Get some help. Medical help for her and help in the home. Talk decisions over with your wife and then stick to the original plan even if she disagrees later on.
I have prayed for your family. God Bless you!
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#18
I did agree to better or worse. Does that mean we can't try to find a way to make the worse better?

And no, the one thing she can seem to remember are my stumbles. Funny how that works lol.

I'm not good with numbers (in my head at least) and have a form of name dyslexia. For example, her cousin Stan and Jean... I'm constantly calling them Stean and Jan. Kinda like Tammis and Denny (Dennis and Tammy).

Her mom does have 24 hour caregivers, but anyone with experience knows how lacking that can be. And actually the caregiving is what she is called to, it's the one thing she does seem to have a handle on. And I support that.

But today was a perfect example. We've discussed the parameters of where we need to be, including with her mother; we've invested 6 months time and money in a foot in the door relocation, we've involved others in the search for a more permanent stay... and this morning she rolls out of bed wanting to abandon all that and look somewhere else that doesn't match any of the criteria we established. Seriously, it wasn't a whim. It took several hours of going over (for the millionth time) what we had agreed on before (a million times) before she got that crazy idea out of her head. And that's the issue for me, it's really tough to make any forward progress when a huge amount of your time and energy is spent rehashing endlessly what in the past has got us here. Some people describe their lives as 2 steps forward one back, our is 2 steps forward, 20 in place.

Another example: She's known her sisters husband for 20 years, and every single day of that time he's been a giant butthead. And yet to this day it just surprises and tweaks her to no end to find out he did something buttheadish today. That's also hard, watching her constantly get knotted up over things she should have accepted and let go of decades ago. I hate to see her beating her head against that brick wall, but I'm powerless to do anything about.

Thanks all of you for your prayers and input.
 
Sep 6, 2013
4,430
117
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#19
I did agree to better or worse. Does that mean we can't try to find a way to make the worse better?

And no, the one thing she can seem to remember are my stumbles. Funny how that works lol.

I'm not good with numbers (in my head at least) and have a form of name dyslexia. For example, her cousin Stan and Jean... I'm constantly calling them Stean and Jan. Kinda like Tammis and Denny (Dennis and Tammy).

Her mom does have 24 hour caregivers, but anyone with experience knows how lacking that can be. And actually the caregiving is what she is called to, it's the one thing she does seem to have a handle on. And I support that.

But today was a perfect example. We've discussed the parameters of where we need to be, including with her mother; we've invested 6 months time and money in a foot in the door relocation, we've involved others in the search for a more permanent stay... and this morning she rolls out of bed wanting to abandon all that and look somewhere else that doesn't match any of the criteria we established. Seriously, it wasn't a whim. It took several hours of going over (for the millionth time) what we had agreed on before (a million times) before she got that crazy idea out of her head. And that's the issue for me, it's really tough to make any forward progress when a huge amount of your time and energy is spent rehashing endlessly what in the past has got us here. Some people describe their lives as 2 steps forward one back, our is 2 steps forward, 20 in place.

Another example: She's known her sisters husband for 20 years, and every single day of that time he's been a giant butthead. And yet to this day it just surprises and tweaks her to no end to find out he did something buttheadish today. That's also hard, watching her constantly get knotted up over things she should have accepted and let go of decades ago. I hate to see her beating her head against that brick wall, but I'm powerless to do anything about.

Thanks all of you for your prayers and input.
Goodness Ricky, this sounds so hard. My heart goes out to you. I think that, despite your very understandable frustrations, you are doing great with her. My thought on how to handle her... well, when dealing with mental handicaps (if that is what this is), sometimes you just have to treat the person according to their handicap. With respect and love of course. But in your situation, perhaps when she changes her mind, you need to just remind her that the decision was already made, and you can't go backward. "No honey, remember? We already decided we needed it this way. We can't change that now." And let that be the end of it. Perhaps attempting to reason with her just isn't constructive for either of you.

Does she realize that she did in fact agree to whatever decision was reached before? I know she doesn't remember it, but does she acknowledge that she did at one point agree? Does she believe you when you tell her that she agreed? This would be so difficult to deal with. I admire your patience in how you're handling this.

Some couples can operate in a blessed state of equal partnership, and then there are those cases such as yours, where you need to take more control, and lead in a more obvious way. It's probably lonely, making these decisions all alone. But you can hopefully at least reach a level of acceptance on her part once she gets used to you leading completely on matters where it's necessary. There may still be other areas where she can feel like she has more control, according to her gifts and abilities.
 
Dec 1, 2014
1,430
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#20
My wife is facing this with her mother also, who fits the same category as what you just described about your wife. Doctors concluded she has dimensia that will lead to full blown alzeheimers, just like her mother had and just like her grandmother had. The help she needs can be expensive, long bearing and frustrating. I am presently reading the entire works of John G. Lake..and his 'take' on this is based on faith that when we accept JESUS. we have full access to ALL of JESUS..and that includes HIs healing powers. GOD honors the desires of our hearts if they line up with HIS WORD..and I find expansive evidence that even mental illness can be cured and healed..in the name of JESUS. It is NOT rocket science..it is something that does not hold back. We find stories in the BIBLE that GOD even healed those who are NOT CHRISTIAN. What would be wrong with 'calling upon the elders" New Testament style, or truely seeking a Holy SPIRIT touchdown in this issue? Is it beyond GOD to heal your wife? Would it be out of line, according to your denomination? Why not start a prayer line where hundreds of other fellow BELIEVERS are speaking to GOD in one accord for your WIFE's condition to be healed? What have you got to lose?" I will start a prayer, along with others here that have already promised prayer for her. Perhaps your faith is being tested?