question about submission

GaryA · May 10, 2015

jsr1221:

At least in part - you are correct. Adam was with her. Adam ate it, too. Adam was wrong. Now what? So?

What matters is - what God hath said... ( I am not yelling - I just want to emphasize this "really well"... )

If you have a problem with that, then it is your problem -- your argument is with God.

"Sorry. It is as simple as that."

God is the One Who defines what 'submit' means -- read about it in the scriptures...

Colossians 3:

[SUP]18[/SUP] Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.

Ephesians 5:

[SUP]22[/SUP] Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. [SUP]23[/SUP] For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. [SUP]24[/SUP] Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

1 Peter 3:

[SUP]1[/SUP] Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; [SUP]2[/SUP] While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear. [SUP]3[/SUP] Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; [SUP]4[/SUP] But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. [SUP]5[/SUP] For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands: [SUP]6[/SUP] Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.

This is one of the things that God says is of great value in a woman -- "a meek and quiet spirit"...

Strong's 5293 defines 'submit' and '[ be ] in subjection' as: "to subordinate" / "to obey" / "to be under obedience"

Your rebellion against God's 'directive' to the wife to 'submit' to her husband has reached "trolling stage" -- and will not accomplish anything but trouble -- STOP the immature "nit-picking"...!!!

These verses illustrate what God wants... ( I am not yelling - I just want to emphasize this "really well"... )

Now -- I am not the least bit afraid to tell the men what God expects of them, either!

( And, the requirement is much greater! )

"Deal with it!"

( Whatever you decide will be between you and God -- and, will come again on Judgment Day -- "make it a good one"... )

"I'm not angry --- I'm just tired of the needless quibbling..."

GaryA · May 10, 2015

Elin said:

( "If I am reading this right..." )

I'm sorry, Elin --- I will be the one to "leave" -- I did not mean to 'react' - I am just tired of the childish tomfoolery...

jsr1221 · May 10, 2015

GaryA said:

jsr1221:

At least in part - you are correct. Adam was with her. Adam ate it, too. Adam was wrong. Now what? So?

What matters is - what God hath said... ( I am not yelling - I just want to emphasize this "really well"... )

If you have a problem with that, then it is your problem -- your argument is with God.

"Sorry. It is as simple as that."

God is the One Who defines what 'submit' means -- read about it in the scriptures...

Colossians 3:

[SUP]18[/SUP] Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.

Ephesians 5:

[SUP]22[/SUP] Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. [SUP]23[/SUP] For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. [SUP]24[/SUP] Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

1 Peter 3:

[SUP]1[/SUP] Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; [SUP]2[/SUP] While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear. [SUP]3[/SUP] Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; [SUP]4[/SUP] But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. [SUP]5[/SUP] For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands: [SUP]6[/SUP] Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.

This is one of the things that God says is of great value in a woman -- "a meek and quiet spirit"...

Strong's 5293 defines 'submit' and '[ be ] in subjection' as: "to subordinate" / "to obey" / "to be under obedience"

Your rebellion against God's 'directive' to the wife to 'submit' to her husband has reached "trolling stage" -- and will not accomplish anything but trouble -- STOP the immature "nit-picking"...!!!

These verses illustrate what God wants... ( I am not yelling - I just want to emphasize this "really well"... )

Now -- I am not the least bit afraid to tell the men what God expects of them, either!

( And, the requirement is much greater! )

"Deal with it!"

( Whatever you decide will be between you and God -- and, will come again on Judgment Day -- "make it a good one"... )

"I'm not angry --- I'm just tired of the needless quibbling..."

You forgot Ephesians 5:21 " Submit to ONE ANOTHER out of reverance for Christ."

jsr1221 · May 10, 2015

GaryA said:

Also forgot to post the husband's role in all this. Ephesians 5:25-28. " For husbands, this means love your wife like Christ loved the church. He gave up his life for her to make her HOLY and CLEAN, washed by the cleansing of God's word. He did this to present her to himself as a glroiuos church without a sprinkle or any other blemish. Instead, she will be HOLY and WITHOUT FAULT. In the same way, husbands ought to love their wives as if they live their bodies.. For a man who loves his wife actually shows love for himself."

While I'm at it, let me give you the rest of the passage. Verse 29. "No one hates his own body but feeds and cares for it, just as if Christ cares for the church. " Verse 30. "And WE are members of his body." And finally, verses 31-33 "As the SCRIPTURES say, A man leaves his father and mother and is joined to his wife, and the two are united into ONE. It is an illustration of the way Christ and the churches are one. So I say again, EACH MAN must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband."

It's really important to read the whole passage, and not just cherry pick them out of the Bible and post on here.

Elin · May 11, 2015

GaryA said:

Well said! . .no need to apologize. . .

Neither one of us belong in a forum with children. . .particularly children who are uninformed of the matter on which they are pontificating.

Elin · May 11, 2015

jsr1221 said:

No. . .one another is:

the church to Christ,
wives to their husbands,
children to the husbands and wives (parents),
husbands to the civic and church governing authorities,
etc., etc., etc.

All opinions are not equal. . .uninformed opinions are without merit. . .a word to the wise is sufficient.

jsr1221 · May 11, 2015

Elin said:

Both husband and wife have needs that are supposed to be met by one another. That's what the one another is referring. Husband is the head, yes, and he's supposed to be the leader, yes, and he has the final say, yes. But he also has a wife by his side every step of the way in support. If that's not the case, then the husband can spend their entire money on whatever he wants, and the wife doesn't have a say at all. There are things that the husband is good at, and there are things the wife is good at. Not every husband is the same, and not every wife is the same. Some husbands will be stay at home dads whereas the wife is a CEO. But the roles are still the same.

zoii · May 14, 2015

Elin said:

Are you saying that being nice only applies if the listener is the type of christian you approve of. .... pfft i dont need to judge u. Theres no way i could compete with your judging skills

MarcR · May 15, 2015

JFSurvivor said:

situation 1: a wife and unbelieving husband. The wife still has to submit eventhough she married an unbeliever or maybe she converted.

1 Pe 3:1-2
wives, be subject to your own husbands, so that even if some do not obey the word, they may be won without a word by the conduct of their wives—
2 when they see your respectful and pure conduct.
ESV

Situation 2: a husband and an unbelieving wife. How is he supposed to lead? Should he lead?

He should lead by love and Godly example.

iveseenworse · May 15, 2015

i think there are attitudes constantly trying to shape our thinking. i think we all need to be more empathetic and caring towards our mates. i think marriage is a marathon not a sprint, not letting your guard down or coasting. i think we need to concentrate on making our spouse the best they can be.

Elin · May 16, 2015

zoii said:

Your profile does not indicate you are a Christian.

Non-Christians are not expected to believe the Bible. . .and it's not unkind to state that when they reject Biblical teaching.

CRC · May 16, 2015

“Be in Subjection to One Another”
The home can be a haven of peace and contentment or a battleground of strife and contention. (Proverbs 21:19; 26:21) Our accepting Christ’s leadership contributes to peace and happiness in the family. Jesus’ example, in fact, is the model for family relations. The Scriptures state: “Be in subjection to one another in fear of Christ. Let wives be in subjection to their husbands as to the Lord, because a husband is head of his wife as the Christ also is head of the congregation, he being a savior of this body. . . . Husbands, continue loving your wives, just as the Christ also loved the congregation and delivered up himself for it.” (Ephesians 5:21-25) To the congregation in Colossae, the apostle Paul wrote: “You children, be obedient to your parents in everything, for this is well-pleasing in the Lord.”—Colossians 3:18-20.
Following this counsel means that the husband takes the lead in the family, his wife loyally supports him, and the children obey their parents. Man’s headship, though, results in happiness only when it is handled properly. A wise husband must learn how to exercise headship by imitating his own Head and Leader, Christ Jesus. (1 Corinthians 11:3) Even though Jesus later became “head over all things to the congregation,” he came to earth, “not to be ministered to, but to minister.” (Ephesians 1:22; Matthew 20:28) In a similar way, a Christian husband exercises his headship, not for selfish advantage, but to care for the interests of his wife and children—yes, the entire family. (1 Corinthians 13:4, 5) He seeks to imitate the godly qualities of his head, Jesus Christ. Like Jesus, he is mild-tempered and lowly in heart. (Matthew 11:28-30) Such words as “I am sorry” or “you are right” are not difficult for him to say when he is wrong. His fine example makes it easier for a wife to be a “helper,” a “complement,” and a “partner” to such a man, learning from him and working side by side with him.—Genesis 2:20; Malachi 2:14.

zoii · May 17, 2015

JFSurvivor said:

*shrug* Then I guess I'll face his judgement. I can't picture a snart God, who gave me a brain, then created me as woman and say "well you're a woman so you have to be obedient to the men in your life. No brain usage allowed." If that were the case I think he would have created me VERY different. I have a brain and I intend to use it. If I'm wrong then I will accept Gods punishement because He is just.

Good answer... massive hug 4 u

zoii · May 17, 2015

presidente said:

Generally, calling a country 'backward' is considered insulting. Calling a country poverty-stricken when one's own country ranks lower on development ratings is ironic.

I've read similar statistics about Indonesians Muslim population. What is your source that says that this is self-reported. Many Christians in Indonesia don't think the stats are accurate. One of them said he knew people in the government who shared with him that they weren't. During this conversation, they said when they'd filled out their forms for their national ID, which tells their religion, they filled out Christian but got a card back that said Muslim. They thought the number (about 8 years ago) was 70 something percent.

India would have been the country with the Lord's largest Muslim population if it hadn't lost Pakistan.

So do you think India ranks lower because it treats women worse than predominantly Muslim Indonesia?

Do you know the details of how the indices are measured, and do you know for sure that it has to do with the treatment of women? Why would the non-equality adjusted index I cited have a lower rank for India than Indonesia based on an equality issue?

Out of all the countries in the world, you chose to insult the country my wife cam efrom.

How I talk about her on the Internet? I say plenty of good things about my wife on the Internet. When the Lord did a work in her that related to submission and other issues, I asked her if she minded if I shared the testimony with others, and she was fine with it.

I don't forbid her from having an account on an Internet forum. I don't sit over her shoulder and monitor her Internet time either. She'll spend a bit of time one Facebook, but doesn't care for the idea of participating in forums like this herself.

Did your daddy give you permission to play on the Internet?

I don't think you've been to Indonesia have you, or you wouldn't be arguing these points about the country. Also the way you are speaking to Rachel is so impolite like your deliberately trying to belittle her. I just cant understand this sort of behaviour

MarcR · May 17, 2015

JFSurvivor said:

Elin said:

zoii said:

I think that is important to point out that the NT model of male leadership is not about status or worth or ability!

The sole purpose of male leadership is about accountability.

It is a matter of fact that people make mistakes. It is also a matter of fact that people are accountable to God for their choices and decisions.

In the garden, after Adam and Eve sinned, Eve tried to blame the serpent, Adam tried to blame Eve, and then he tried to blame God. NOBODY stepped up and took responsibility!

In a family, which Scripture views as a figure of God's relationship with the Church, when mistakes are made; god wants the man to step up and take the heat!

This is ALL submission to male leadership is supposed to be about.

I have no doubt that some men try to lord it over their wives and abuse their position.

This does not make God's model wrong; it only proves that some men are total jerks whether or not they have leadership responsibility.

presidente · May 18, 2015

zoii said:

On the contrary, I've spent many years in Indonesia and I've gotten adopted into one of the tribes there. Maybe that's why I defended Indonesia. It comes off as insulting and ethnocentric to call someone else's country 'backward.'

I don't see disagreeing strongly as belittling. Of course there is a history with Rachel posting and going loggerheads, so I'll take what you say under advisement and maybe I should be a little less direct. The last line had a smiley on it. I responded to her insinuation that my wife needed my permission to post online by asking if her father had given her permission online. Maybe it was a bit of a barbed question, but an attempt at humor on my part and right in line with what she'd been saying about my wife.

MidwesternStudent · Dec 8, 2015

sassylady said:

Do you care to back that up with a lexical source? You can't find that meaning anywhere.

eternallife7 · Dec 11, 2015

JFSurvivor said:

So I was reading this book and it explained how after the verses about wives submitting and husbands loving there's a verse that says, "husbands and wives must submit to one another as is fitting to the Lord." (I think I got that right.) Well this book says that husbands and wives are to submit to eacother based on that verse. Also it explained that submission is an act of free will. I never heard it explained that way. What are your thoughts on this? I don't think it's saying the man isn't the head I just think it's saying that 1) submission is not shameful and 2) submission is not just for a woman to do. Thoughts?

make sure to study the Greek because it has many different words to describe something than English does.

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question about submission

GaryA

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jsr1221

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Elin

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zoii

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CRC

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