So your opinions and feelings are more important than what God wants?

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blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
#61
Glad for all your thinking. You didn't even think it all the way through, yet here you go on and on. Too bad it's all your thinking, instead of seeking God.

I've got what? Two more days before God strikes me down for your say so? We shall see God's will on that one.

Why do you keep harping on what people did or said WRONG to her? Everyone of us on that thread gave her scripture as to why she should NOT have the abortion. She's trying to use grace as justification to have an abortion for a baby that she HAS been wanting. And you're here defending that? WOW. I see MANY posts of YOURS on different forums that are not well-thought out, so stop pointing the finger at us and take a look at yourself. You respond with impatient, snide, sarcastic comments, which gets you absolutely nowhere. Then you KEEP ranting about it for days and weeks afterward. Stop acting so self-righteously. There is only ONE High and Mighty, and His name is NOT atwhatcost.

And the last sentence in your OP is "and let the endless and useless debates start here," so apparently you're just looking for ANY chance to argue with and attack people whose answers and opinions don't match up with yours. Not everyone here is going to offer the same exact advice that you do. We are all different, so we all have differing advice and opinions, and feelings on certain topics, especially on strong topics like abortion, rape or divorce..
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#62
My prayer is she seeks God. Amazing the right answers he gives his kids at the right place and the right time through his word that utterly defies the question asked, if we look it up in a topical study, a word study, or a commentary.

When hubby was married the first time, she cheated on him. He ran to God's word and it gave him an answer -- keep going. Stick with her.

She did it again. He did it again. Same God. Same Bible, but God clearly told him to divorce her.

I was in so much pain, (literal pain), I couldn't think straight. Well, actually I had one thought, OUCH! (Bigger thought than that, but it just doesn't seem right to post on a Christian forum. lol) I asked, "What can possibly come from this?" He answered. Romans 8:28. My verse ever since.

Three years later, hubby got terribly sick, went through chemo and because of the chemo, no one caught the diabetes or the other signs something else was wrong. He became disabled. I was so royally ticked off at God, there are no words I can post -- for a non-christian or Christian forum -- that covers my anger. No one around, yet somehow he got me to buy a book. When God Weeps. It answered from God's word. Perfect answer for me -- then and now.

When I came back to him, I asked the next obvious question: "How can you possibly put up with someone like me, once more love me?" Now, you have to know -- hubby was a voracious Bible studier. He used to put in four hours a night studying it, back in the days before anyone heard of this thing called "The Internet." We still have the proof -- seven bookcases crammed into one small room and out of those seven bookcases six-and-a-half were his books he used to study the Bible. He's got books almost thick enough to use as a table. He has sets of books that take over a full shelf. He's got fat books, thin books, reference books, commentaries, even some Watchman Nee and a few other authors he tells me no one should read. And in all that collection of books, kinda of toward the right of center for his Wycliffe commentaries was one that looked like all the rest. Yet it kept sticking in my line of sight as if it had Las Vegas 1950's lights hawking it. A commentary on the Book of Jonah. I was compelled to read that one then.

Honestly. There are no scriptures on abortion or on who gets first rights when having a baby could cost the mother her life. There are plenty of scriptures, and possibly even a book in the Bible that will speak to her, if she seeks God. AND when God answers her, it will be HER answer, not OUR answer.

My prayer is she seeks God. In God I trust. In my opinion, I do not.

You and I are not going to see eye to eye on this issue.I just cant agree with abortion.So that aside have you ever read the book "God Is Not Your Problem"? cant recall who wrote it.I leant the book to my sister and i'll never see it again Im sure. Just wondered if you'd read it.
 

Pres19

Senior Member
Nov 27, 2013
779
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#63
You and I are not going to see eye to eye on this issue.I just cant agree with abortion.So that aside have you ever read the book "God Is Not Your Problem"? cant recall who wrote it.I leant the book to my sister and i'll never see it again Im sure. Just wondered if you'd read it.
I know you didn't ask me but..
What's it about? I love reading lol
I'm always looking for new books to read.
 
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BarlyGurl

Guest
#64
The problem is... some of us agree with God.... and some don't.

I have absolutely NO intention of even trying to bridge the human relations gap caused by the incongruence. Agree with God, and You and I will be in agreement... WHoop Whoop... problem solved. :D
 
May 3, 2013
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#65
Just trying to figure things out... The One who said "Do not murder", later on, Didn´t He sent his ppl to kill those He saw as His enemies?

Whom don´t I have to kill? and, in case of war, Do I have permission to kill and defend the country I am in but, in case some attacked me, Don´t I have such INDIVIDUAL right to defend and kill?

Double standars?


God´s laws and War laws?

Collective or national rights invalidated at war but, when I acted as an individual, those rights are void?

I know my answers but, just trying to think.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#66
I know you didn't ask me but..
What's it about? I love reading lol
I'm always looking for new books to read.

Sorry, been too busy to respond. :) The book is basically how some people think that every bad thing that happens to us,every sickness that somehow God is trying to make us better Christians.But the author believes that it is the devil that is trying to destroy us and our relationship with God. Its a very interesting read and its on Amazon.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#67
Just trying to figure things out... The One who said "Do not murder", later on, Didn´t He sent his ppl to kill those He saw as His enemies?

Whom don´t I have to kill? and, in case of war, Do I have permission to kill and defend the country I am in but, in case some attacked me, Don´t I have such INDIVIDUAL right to defend and kill?

Double standars?


God´s laws and War laws?

Collective or national rights invalidated at war but, when I acted as an individual, those rights are void?

I know my answers but, just trying to think.

God gave people a chance to change.In cases of war these tribes were picking off the old and the young,killing them.God let this go on a long time before he told the Jews to go and kill them.Defending yourself is different then murdering a helpless unborn child.Vastly different.
 
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atwhatcost

Guest
#68
This thread isn't about her, huh? That's why your first two paragraphs in your OP mention her. :rolleyes: If you didn't want people to comment on here about her, then you shouldn't have mentioned her in your OP. YOU made this thread "about her" simply by giving her situation as an example. When someone gives specific examples, OF COURSE others are going to comment on it...
It's about you (and some others.) Feel better? At least you know where my focus is now.

Now, want to make it all about you? Go for it. It sure beats incessantly picking on a woman with enough problems in her life already.

Want to make it all about me? Also not a problem for the very same reason. Since you believe you are the perfect counselor, feel free to have at it. On me!!! Not on people who have enough problems on their plates.

And yes, since you were lurking on my other post, this is me after praying about this and praying for you. This is me with patience and grace. I did learn the difference between good manners and what God wants. So have at it. Just stop hurting people who are already hurting with your constant judgement based on personal experience only.

Want to know what I prayed for for you? I prayed God would overwhelm you with love to help wash away some of those festering wounds you have. I really do get you're hurting. Not physically, although you and I both know our physical pain drives us toward lashing out too often. (I am no better than you.) I really do get the emotional pain is worse. I've been rejected, cast off from family and friends simply because they had no idea how to act around me at my lowest and no words of comfort from their non-connect with God to give. And it wasn't really rejection, but it feels the same.

I really do get that pain. I've had God wash me with his love a few times. My deep down anger makes it not stick... or maybe it's back to "give us this day our daily bread" while I'm busy thinking he should stock pile me with enough bread for a week. (Probably that. That frigging patience thingy jabbing at me, ya know. lol) But I honestly see you in me. I've read that the people that drive us most up the walls are people with the same bad habits we have. That goes all the way to why some parents have one particular child that drives them up the wall, not because there's anything wrong with the child, but the child is most like that parent. I suspect there is much of that in our relationship, so I am sincerely praying for all good things for you.

Meanwhile, take it out on people strong enough to take it, instead of those with a plate overstuffed. Take it out on me. Maybe that in itself will remind me I need food on my plate every day, instead of one time to last the week. Maybe that will punch me right back to talking to our Dad.

(Kind of scary what patience and grace looks like on me, isn't it? lol)
 
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atwhatcost

Guest
#69
You and I are not going to see eye to eye on this issue.I just cant agree with abortion.So that aside have you ever read the book "God Is Not Your Problem"? cant recall who wrote it.I leant the book to my sister and i'll never see it again Im sure. Just wondered if you'd read it.
I love how you think I'm telling someone to get an abortion still. It really does say something about how you perceive a problem, or maybe just your opinion.

Here's the link to the book, (so you know the name of the author to see what I'm about to say.) I've read the reviews, and no thanks, wrong god. When people start giving excuses for God on the bad things that happen, they change who God is to make it easier on them.

My heart wants to do that. My spirit will not do that. "All things" means all things in Rom. 8:28. God works out all thing for his peeps. Not the same thing as everything that happens that is bad isn't God's fault. I recommend When God Weeps by Joni Eareckson Tada. That shows God is working through all-all things. I don't want to excuse God. I want to love and serve him even knowing he's the one who caused me to become disabled, and then caused hubby to be disabled. That God!
 
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atwhatcost

Guest
#70
God gave people a chance to change.In cases of war these tribes were picking off the old and the young,killing them.God let this go on a long time before he told the Jews to go and kill them.Defending yourself is different then murdering a helpless unborn child.Vastly different.
God is, so nothing is left to chance. You're the one waiting to see what chance does.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
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#71
OK, first of all, it is NOT about me, or any of the others who posted. It is about her. I saw you wanted private pm's with her. I hope you are/were able to help her. :) Don't you mean you are LEARNING what patience is and grace are? Because alot of your posts come off as impatient and hurriedly written.

Two, I do NOT think I'm "the perfect counselor". YOU are saying that. Nowhere in ANY of my posts on ANY thread have I said I think I'm any sort of counselor. So THAT is just assumption on your part.

Three, I do not "lurk" on threads. I read posts, answer some, then leave. I don't sit there for hours to see what people's replies are..

Four, for "love to wash over me"? Seriously? Honey I have the BEST love of all: GOD'S and my family's. :) And I don't have any "festering wounds" causing me pain. I let go of all that DECADES ago. So again, please stop assuming, and stop making this about me. Or kaylagrl or pres19 or whoever else's posts that you reply to that you don't like. I DO, however have a sore tongue where I accidently bit it a few days ago. :rolleyes:

Whatever that woman does is on her, and up to her. That's between her and God. Not her and me, or her and you. And btw, I haven't posted on her thread in at least 1 or 2 days. And I don't plan to again. I'm done with her.

Once again, stop making this about me and the others. Don't try using our past experiences as the motivation why YOU think we responded as we did.

If you agree to tone down the sarcasm and assumption on your end, then I agree to try and turn up the grace on my end. Deal? I hope so, cuz I'm getting sick of explaining and defending my replies. I'm sure kayla and pres19 and any others are, also. :)

So you work on the sarcasm and assumption, and I'll work on grace.. :)
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#72
God is, so nothing is left to chance. You're the one waiting to see what chance does.
Atwhatcost you and I have never had an issue before.Lets agree to disagree on this subject and move on.I dont come here to make bad friends with anyone.We have a different view and we're both entitled to our views.You know mine and I know yours.Now lets move on to things we agree on.
 
S

Standing

Guest
#73
God already knows the future for this woman and her child beloved.
We have sent our prayers up to God, in faith, as she did :)
The outcome is all Gods will.
Thankyou Father.
 
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atwhatcost

Guest
#74
OK, first of all, it is NOT about me, or any of the others who posted. It is about her. I saw you wanted private pm's with her. I hope you are/were able to help her. :) Don't you mean you are LEARNING what patience is and grace are? Because alot of your posts come off as impatient and hurriedly written.

Two, I do NOT think I'm "the perfect counselor". YOU are saying that. Nowhere in ANY of my posts on ANY thread have I said I think I'm any sort of counselor. So THAT is just assumption on your part.

Three, I do not "lurk" on threads. I read posts, answer some, then leave. I don't sit there for hours to see what people's replies are..

Four, for "love to wash over me"? Seriously? Honey I have the BEST love of all: GOD'S and my family's. :) And I don't have any "festering wounds" causing me pain. I let go of all that DECADES ago. So again, please stop assuming, and stop making this about me. Or kaylagrl or pres19 or whoever else's posts that you reply to that you don't like. I DO, however have a sore tongue where I accidently bit it a few days ago. :rolleyes:

Whatever that woman does is on her, and up to her. That's between her and God. Not her and me, or her and you. And btw, I haven't posted on her thread in at least 1 or 2 days. And I don't plan to again. I'm done with her.

Once again, stop making this about me and the others. Don't try using our past experiences as the motivation why YOU think we responded as we did.

If you agree to tone down the sarcasm and assumption on your end, then I agree to try and turn up the grace on my end. Deal? I hope so, cuz I'm getting sick of explaining and defending my replies. I'm sure kayla and pres19 and any others are, also. :)

So you work on the sarcasm and assumption, and I'll work on grace.. :)
1. Look at the title of this post. Are you sure it's about her? Because, got to tell you, really not. She's not "your."

2. When you counsel people to do something in particular, there has to be an assumption of perfect counseling... at least righteous counsel. Might just be me, but I tend to put perfect and righteous in the same boat. I lean toward thinking they're synonyms, if not in each other's definition. (And honest. That really just might be me. I could be wrong. Too lazy to look. lol)

3. Absolutely nothing wrong with lurking. Or, if there is, then I'm doing a lot of wrong. I've seen every single thread on this forum, even if I haven't responded. Two reasons: I hope I can help. I'm straight-up nosy. Got to know what's going on. So I lurk. You should see me when there's a group of guy talking -- especially Christian guys -- and no women nearby. I go out of my way to find out what they're talking about when women aren't around. So, no. Lurking isn't a bad word. Do you mind there are lurkers on here all the time? I don't.

4. If love flows into you, why isn't it passing out of you? You've told people to divorce immediately. Not person -- people. Most of the time you're first answer is to divorce. You told someone traumatized by sexual abuse to report it to the cops even before finding out the whole story. You told someone that her husband should drop helping a single mother and four kids countries away because the mother is hitting on him. Even now, "I'm done with her." Your advice always is basically retreat and hide from the world. It's what you promote and what you do. Isolation isn't love.

Now you're working on grace? How about you work on all your assumptions too? As for sarcasm? I can learn how to do that better from you, and I'm good at it. You retreat into it though. You're doing it now. You've been doing this ever since I posted this.

I'll continue to pray, because I know all your going to do is keep coming back with more "buts," "you know whats," "do me a favors," and "I'm right." You're hurting. I just wish you'd stop hurting others too.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
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#75
atwhatcost, there you go again. Now you're solely blaming me. As to the woman with the husband who was ministering to the family, her husband ON HIS OWN, without her asking, turned off his FB so that woman couldn't contact him anymore. I never suggested NOT to help them, just to cut down the contact somewhat. The woman was sending him skimpy pics of herself to the guy, and his wife had every right to be upset. Fortunately that situation has now resolved itself. :)

Sorry, but there's no such thing as PERFECT counseling. Even the best counselors in the world aren't perfect at it..lol.. so there you go again, ASSUMING.

Once again, I do not lurk. Do I return to threads sometimes? Yes, of course, we all do. YOU however have stated "I make it my business to lurk." Why? What do you hope to catch the guys on here saying? Something you can use against in a later post, as you ARE doing with me and some others right now? I could care less if people lurk on threads.

BTW, alot of these cases you're presenting, those OP's HAVE contacted me via PM. So stop ASSUMING that YOU know the full story, when obviously you don't know that I know the fully stories. Gotta work hard on those assumptions, Lynn. :)

I believe God can do anything. ANYTHING. But I also think that he USES divorce as a tool to introduce something better into those couple's lives. :) If there is no love or trust or fidelity in marriage, then it's not a marriage that God intended it to be. Yes, I agree sometimes I do tell them to divorce, and thats not always a bad thing. YOU act like it's a mortal sin to tell someone to divorce-- it isn't. Divorce is often God's way of saying "this isn't for you anymore. I have something better." And if someone wants a divorce because their partner is beating them, then what should I say? Something like "just stay long enough so he can bash your head in and kill you"? YOU WOULD TELL HER TO LEAVE HER ABUSER.

Sarcasm begets sarcasm, Lynn. YOU are sarcastic in ALL of your posts, from the day you joined here. I am sure I could dig up countless examples. As for me, I'm only sarcastic when presented specifically with it.

You keep saying "I'm hurting." Please tell me, specifically, WHAT you think I'm hurting from? It's not from any past nor present experiences, because I've let those all go long time ago. So what ASSUMED hurt do you think I'm suffering from?

Are you angry or frustrated that not everyone has the same opinions that you do? We ARE all different, you know. No one is going to agree with everything that anyone says. and if you expect everyone to be in line with YOUR answers, you're sorely mistaken.

I get where your coming from. But you just wont let it go. I have tried making peace with you, kayla and pres19 have tried. And still all YOU do is ATTACK us, and make up some crazy reason why we must be "hurting" and that's why we answer these people the way we do. Stop attacking us, we're not the enemy.. really we aren't.

I have seen people call you snarky, rude, vindictive and self-righteous. You go wayyyy beyond any of that. lol..

Lessons for YOU to learn: stop assuming all the time, stop being sarcastic in EVERY post, stop being snarky, snide and rude.

Lessons for ME to learn: start putting grace and assumptions into practice, stop replying to posts that I clearly don't agree with, and accept that there will be others who disagree with my opinions, WITHOUT attacking them for their own opinions.

You're in contact with the one who wants the abortion. Why don't you tell us what she's deciding and how she's doing, instead of railing against us every chance you get about how horrible our responses to her were? She hasn't responded in over a week. Surely she can't be sleeping all this time, as she said she was before..

So stop beaching at us. Take a look at your own self and stop attacking us for what YOU think is making us react the way we do. I could easily be on your case all the time, leaving constant replies to how rude and sarcastic you are. But I don't, because I don't stalk people through the forums. I don't sit on threads for hours, refreshing the page every five minutes so I can see what the men on here are talking about when women aren't around. So if you think they can't see you, you're wrong. All they have to do is look at the bottom of the page and see your name..lol

If love flows into me, why doesn't it pass through? It does, but even Jesus was harsh and sarcastic sometimes. Several felt nothing but rebukal by him. If I'm harsh and whatnot sometimes, then I'm only displaying that side of Jesus. And yes, being more loving is something I will work on as well.

Hopefully I wont get another, judgemental, self-righteous, accusatory, indignant reply from you. Although I'm sure I probably will..lol.. I'm trying to resolve this back and forth bickering, Lynn but you gotta put in your own peacemaking too. As kayla said, let's agree to disagree and move on. :) Okay?
 
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BarlyGurl

Guest
#76
atwhatcost, there you go again. Now you're solely blaming me. As to the woman with the husband who was ministering to the family, her husband ON HIS OWN, without her asking, turned off his FB so that woman couldn't contact him anymore. I never suggested NOT to help them, just to cut down the contact somewhat. The woman was sending him skimpy pics of herself to the guy, and his wife had every right to be upset. Fortunately that situation has now resolved itself. :)

Sorry, but there's no such thing as PERFECT counseling. Even the best counselors in the world aren't perfect at it..lol.. so there you go again, ASSUMING.

Once again, I do not lurk. Do I return to threads sometimes? Yes, of course, we all do. YOU however have stated "I make it my business to lurk." Why? What do you hope to catch the guys on here saying? Something you can use against in a later post, as you ARE doing with me and some others right now? I could care less if people lurk on threads.

BTW, alot of these cases you're presenting, those OP's HAVE contacted me via PM. So stop ASSUMING that YOU know the full story, when obviously you don't know that I know the fully stories. Gotta work hard on those assumptions, Lynn. :)

I believe God can do anything. ANYTHING. But I also think that he USES divorce as a tool to introduce something better into those couple's lives. :) If there is no love or trust or fidelity in marriage, then it's not a marriage that God intended it to be. Yes, I agree sometimes I do tell them to divorce, and thats not always a bad thing. YOU act like it's a mortal sin to tell someone to divorce-- it isn't. Divorce is often God's way of saying "this isn't for you anymore. I have something better." And if someone wants a divorce because their partner is beating them, then what should I say? Something like "just stay long enough so he can bash your head in and kill you"? YOU WOULD TELL HER TO LEAVE HER ABUSER.

Sarcasm begets sarcasm, Lynn. YOU are sarcastic in ALL of your posts, from the day you joined here. I am sure I could dig up countless examples. As for me, I'm only sarcastic when presented specifically with it.

You keep saying "I'm hurting." Please tell me, specifically, WHAT you think I'm hurting from? It's not from any past nor present experiences, because I've let those all go long time ago. So what ASSUMED hurt do you think I'm suffering from?

Are you angry or frustrated that not everyone has the same opinions that you do? We ARE all different, you know. No one is going to agree with everything that anyone says. and if you expect everyone to be in line with YOUR answers, you're sorely mistaken.

I get where your coming from. But you just wont let it go. I have tried making peace with you, kayla and pres19 have tried. And still all YOU do is ATTACK us, and make up some crazy reason why we must be "hurting" and that's why we answer these people the way we do. Stop attacking us, we're not the enemy.. really we aren't.

I have seen people call you snarky, rude, vindictive and self-righteous. You go wayyyy beyond any of that. lol..

Lessons for YOU to learn: stop assuming all the time, stop being sarcastic in EVERY post, stop being snarky, snide and rude.

Lessons for ME to learn: start putting grace and assumptions into practice, stop replying to posts that I clearly don't agree with, and accept that there will be others who disagree with my opinions, WITHOUT attacking them for their own opinions.

You're in contact with the one who wants the abortion. Why don't you tell us what she's deciding and how she's doing, instead of railing against us every chance you get about how horrible our responses to her were? She hasn't responded in over a week. Surely she can't be sleeping all this time, as she said she was before..

So stop beaching at us. Take a look at your own self and stop attacking us for what YOU think is making us react the way we do. I could easily be on your case all the time, leaving constant replies to how rude and sarcastic you are. But I don't, because I don't stalk people through the forums. I don't sit on threads for hours, refreshing the page every five minutes so I can see what the men on here are talking about when women aren't around. So if you think they can't see you, you're wrong. All they have to do is look at the bottom of the page and see your name..lol

If love flows into me, why doesn't it pass through? It does, but even Jesus was harsh and sarcastic sometimes. Several felt nothing but rebukal by him. If I'm harsh and whatnot sometimes, then I'm only displaying that side of Jesus. And yes, being more loving is something I will work on as well.

Hopefully I wont get another, judgemental, self-righteous, accusatory, indignant reply from you. Although I'm sure I probably will..lol.. I'm trying to resolve this back and forth bickering, Lynn but you gotta put in your own peacemaking too. As kayla said, let's agree to disagree and move on. :) Okay?
I am commenting because there is no "mostly like" button.

I hafta take issue with the "divorce position" it is not in harmony with the scriptures.. but your supposition is proper counsel.

Proverbs 10:19When there are many words, transgression is unavoidable, But he who restrains his lips is wise.

I encourage you blue, to not get caught in the trap of self defense when the issues are broad and based on ASSUMPTIONS.