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I put this in the category of "Christian performance." I know that if I were in the audience, I wouldn't have felt that I, personally, was worshipping. If you notice, most of the folks in the audience (notice I said audience and NOT congregation) are not singing along -- they are enjoying the performance.
Nothing wrong with Christian performance -- it's entertainment, and not a bad thing to be entertained by! Put it in the same category as Christian movies, or Christian novels, etc.
Nothing wrong with Christian performance -- it's entertainment, and not a bad thing to be entertained by! Put it in the same category as Christian movies, or Christian novels, etc.
L
I guess I always judge by " the inner man". If I am 'moved', if it quickens my inner man, and not just the soulish man( which this one always DOES) Some songs and hymns are quickened and anointed from the beginning by God and remain so for decades , years, etc...some are just ' not'. They are okay, and as has already been said..still good...and much better than listening to something that does nothing good.
Yep...I would say...Worship, from the heart.
I thought this rendition pretty awesome!!! Love it!! I'll probably be singing it all day now.
Yep...I would say...Worship, from the heart.
I thought this rendition pretty awesome!!! Love it!! I'll probably be singing it all day now.
That's a very good question to ask..... more people should ask it.
When a "worship leader" "pumps up" the crowd, It's hype all the way. Let me explain. Many such people think/believe just because they're a professional/gifted/spiritual singer they have the ability to "lead" the crowd any direction they want. Worldly singers do exactly that..... for a worldly reaction.
In leading worship, that's not biblical. No christian, regardless of their gifting/talent, has the ability to do so, because we are to be led by the Spirit, not the other way around. We don't "control" the gift. When worship leaders do this, the crowd/congregation usually doesn't realize they're being hyped, manipulated, & misled..... yep I said it, MISLED. He/she who leads a crowd/congregation in a direction away from God's intended plan is every bit as bad as the false prophet/teacher. ANYONE who leads you away from God's direction is not His.
Much of what we see on TV ministry today is misled hype. How can I prove this? What same direction is the "leader" pushing for? Does God lead in the same direction every time? How come modern worship, for example, rarely leads to repentance? Doesn't today's problems in the church demand repentance, whether in worship, preaching, or alter call?
What does TV ministry push? All positive hype, excitement, & self-exaltation. It's called me-worship.
What about Judy Jacobs? Investigate for yourself who she runs with..... Any decent preacher should know who the fakes are, for the Spirit bears witness with them. Remember, birds of a feather flock together.
Keep asking those questions, Oneoff..... your spirit is being stirred & you're being led in the right direction.
When a "worship leader" "pumps up" the crowd, It's hype all the way. Let me explain. Many such people think/believe just because they're a professional/gifted/spiritual singer they have the ability to "lead" the crowd any direction they want. Worldly singers do exactly that..... for a worldly reaction.
In leading worship, that's not biblical. No christian, regardless of their gifting/talent, has the ability to do so, because we are to be led by the Spirit, not the other way around. We don't "control" the gift. When worship leaders do this, the crowd/congregation usually doesn't realize they're being hyped, manipulated, & misled..... yep I said it, MISLED. He/she who leads a crowd/congregation in a direction away from God's intended plan is every bit as bad as the false prophet/teacher. ANYONE who leads you away from God's direction is not His.
Much of what we see on TV ministry today is misled hype. How can I prove this? What same direction is the "leader" pushing for? Does God lead in the same direction every time? How come modern worship, for example, rarely leads to repentance? Doesn't today's problems in the church demand repentance, whether in worship, preaching, or alter call?
What does TV ministry push? All positive hype, excitement, & self-exaltation. It's called me-worship.
What about Judy Jacobs? Investigate for yourself who she runs with..... Any decent preacher should know who the fakes are, for the Spirit bears witness with them. Remember, birds of a feather flock together.
Keep asking those questions, Oneoff..... your spirit is being stirred & you're being led in the right direction.
K
santuzza....
Spoken like someone who has not been part of a real holy spirit touchdown during a real worship service. What you are telling us is that, witnessing what you only see in the video, is meer entertainment only. Nothing that would invoke the Holy Spirit's presence. Of course, you were not there in person and have only this to observe and make your conclusions upon. Real worship...includes all the senses that GOD gives us. Sight, sound, touch, smell (yes, there were reasons GOD set up the original temple arrangements, including incense and fragrances), praises, and much more are and should be part of the total package. Sometimes, just holding hands, raising hands, being part of a group that is seeking GOD's touch, unified in the same accord, can bring down blessings that the video camera failed to capture. I've been part of song services where healings occured during the songs, dancing occured in the SPIRIT that made demons run! The Holy Spirit doesn't often appear in videos to confirm His presence to you, personally. I was singing in a tent revival one time...and I felt like I needed to talk to this student behind me about JESUS..and I Did...later, I found out that he had a knife and was going to commit suicide that night but was lured by the Holy Spirit to slip into the back row. Video would not have captured that event..but the singer on stage would never have known it...but the performance, if from the heart, was not done in vain. The fact remains...the Holy Spirit can and does make an appearance...even though others may sit and criticize the singer or the preacher on stage.
Spoken like someone who has not been part of a real holy spirit touchdown during a real worship service. What you are telling us is that, witnessing what you only see in the video, is meer entertainment only. Nothing that would invoke the Holy Spirit's presence. Of course, you were not there in person and have only this to observe and make your conclusions upon. Real worship...includes all the senses that GOD gives us. Sight, sound, touch, smell (yes, there were reasons GOD set up the original temple arrangements, including incense and fragrances), praises, and much more are and should be part of the total package. Sometimes, just holding hands, raising hands, being part of a group that is seeking GOD's touch, unified in the same accord, can bring down blessings that the video camera failed to capture. I've been part of song services where healings occured during the songs, dancing occured in the SPIRIT that made demons run! The Holy Spirit doesn't often appear in videos to confirm His presence to you, personally. I was singing in a tent revival one time...and I felt like I needed to talk to this student behind me about JESUS..and I Did...later, I found out that he had a knife and was going to commit suicide that night but was lured by the Holy Spirit to slip into the back row. Video would not have captured that event..but the singer on stage would never have known it...but the performance, if from the heart, was not done in vain. The fact remains...the Holy Spirit can and does make an appearance...even though others may sit and criticize the singer or the preacher on stage.
pwrnJC,
Wow, that's quite a judgment on your part!
No where did I say the Holy Spirit/God could not/did not work through a presentation like that. Just as the HS works through movies, novels, etc. A presentation like this piece is more of a performance than a corporate act of worship. That is my opinion.
But for you to surmise that I've never been part of a "real Holy Spirit touchdown" is really quite amazing. Do you even know me? Have you ever worshipped with me? Have you been at every worship experience I've had?
Some people would look at this video and say the singer was being self-aggrandizing, and I could see why they would say that. But I don't believe that to be the case. Just because I don't believe it is corporate worship doesn't mean the HS does not work through this type of medium -- just as He works through other performance-based media.
Wow, that's quite a judgment on your part!
No where did I say the Holy Spirit/God could not/did not work through a presentation like that. Just as the HS works through movies, novels, etc. A presentation like this piece is more of a performance than a corporate act of worship. That is my opinion.
But for you to surmise that I've never been part of a "real Holy Spirit touchdown" is really quite amazing. Do you even know me? Have you ever worshipped with me? Have you been at every worship experience I've had?
Some people would look at this video and say the singer was being self-aggrandizing, and I could see why they would say that. But I don't believe that to be the case. Just because I don't believe it is corporate worship doesn't mean the HS does not work through this type of medium -- just as He works through other performance-based media.
That's a very good question to ask..... more people should ask it.
When a "worship leader" "pumps up" the crowd, It's hype all the way. Let me explain. Many such people think/believe just because they're a professional/gifted/spiritual singer they have the ability to "lead" the crowd any direction they want. Worldly singers do exactly that..... for a worldly reaction.
In leading worship, that's not biblical. No christian, regardless of their gifting/talent, has the ability to do so, because we are to be led by the Spirit, not the other way around. We don't "control" the gift. When worship leaders do this, the crowd/congregation usually doesn't realize they're being hyped, manipulated, & misled..... yep I said it, MISLED. He/she who leads a crowd/congregation in a direction away from God's intended plan is every bit as bad as the false prophet/teacher. ANYONE who leads you away from God's direction is not His.
Much of what we see on TV ministry today is misled hype. How can I prove this? What same direction is the "leader" pushing for? Does God lead in the same direction every time? How come modern worship, for example, rarely leads to repentance? Doesn't today's problems in the church demand repentance, whether in worship, preaching, or alter call?
What does TV ministry push? All positive hype, excitement, & self-exaltation. It's called me-worship.
What about Judy Jacobs? Investigate for yourself who she runs with..... Any decent preacher should know who the fakes are, for the Spirit bears witness with them. Remember, birds of a feather flock together.
Keep asking those questions, Oneoff..... your spirit is being stirred & you're being led in the right direction.
When a "worship leader" "pumps up" the crowd, It's hype all the way. Let me explain. Many such people think/believe just because they're a professional/gifted/spiritual singer they have the ability to "lead" the crowd any direction they want. Worldly singers do exactly that..... for a worldly reaction.
In leading worship, that's not biblical. No christian, regardless of their gifting/talent, has the ability to do so, because we are to be led by the Spirit, not the other way around. We don't "control" the gift. When worship leaders do this, the crowd/congregation usually doesn't realize they're being hyped, manipulated, & misled..... yep I said it, MISLED. He/she who leads a crowd/congregation in a direction away from God's intended plan is every bit as bad as the false prophet/teacher. ANYONE who leads you away from God's direction is not His.
Much of what we see on TV ministry today is misled hype. How can I prove this? What same direction is the "leader" pushing for? Does God lead in the same direction every time? How come modern worship, for example, rarely leads to repentance? Doesn't today's problems in the church demand repentance, whether in worship, preaching, or alter call?
What does TV ministry push? All positive hype, excitement, & self-exaltation. It's called me-worship.
What about Judy Jacobs? Investigate for yourself who she runs with..... Any decent preacher should know who the fakes are, for the Spirit bears witness with them. Remember, birds of a feather flock together.
Keep asking those questions, Oneoff..... your spirit is being stirred & you're being led in the right direction.
Brother, you missed the point..... when I said who she "runs with", I meant regular, personal relationships. Yes, Jesus sat down with publicans & sinners..... for opportunity of ministry. But the people He ran with were His disciples & friends..... like Mary, Martha, & Lazarus..... believers.
Who ministers run with says a lot about them. If they seem spiritually clean, yet run with infamous, highly questionable people, their lives automatically come into question because everyone is known by their fruits. A person's inner circle says volumes about them when nothing else does.
For instance, an innocent, righteous minister might be on one of Benny Hinn's programs, yet before then has never met the man before. After one meeting, said minister quickly realizes that wasn't a good idea..... so he never sees him or shows with him again.
But..... someone much the same as Hinn would admire him, respect him, & hope to work with Hinn many times, being photographed, starring on his show, do conferences together, etc.. Birds of the same feather will flock together.
Who ministers run with says a lot about them. If they seem spiritually clean, yet run with infamous, highly questionable people, their lives automatically come into question because everyone is known by their fruits. A person's inner circle says volumes about them when nothing else does.
For instance, an innocent, righteous minister might be on one of Benny Hinn's programs, yet before then has never met the man before. After one meeting, said minister quickly realizes that wasn't a good idea..... so he never sees him or shows with him again.
But..... someone much the same as Hinn would admire him, respect him, & hope to work with Hinn many times, being photographed, starring on his show, do conferences together, etc.. Birds of the same feather will flock together.
Amen, sister..I am so glad you really do incorporate various expressions of worship, inviting the holy spirit to attend, while praising, dancing, praying, shouting, rejoicing is going on! Wow..we are just getting a little glimpse of what heaven will be like...At least you did tell us that 'this is just my opinion". I am not sure I understand what you are labeling as 'performance based media"...but I also know that you and I are not the "WORSHIP police". IT is not our duty or job to label what is, who is and how it is to be done.....all we need to do is continue to worship JESUS CHRIST, via the Holy Spirit and go on with our lives as His blessing come raining down...Who needs our unasked opinions?
Oookkk..... let's look in da Book, for the truth is there:
Matthew 7:15-20 (KJV) [SUP]15 [/SUP]Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. [SUP]16[/SUP]Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? [SUP]17 [/SUP]Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. [SUP]18 [/SUP]A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [SUP]20 [/SUP]Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Ephesians 5:11 (ESV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (GW) Have nothing to do with the useless works that darkness produces. Instead, expose them for what they are.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (HCSB) Don’t participate in the fruitless works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (ISV) and have nothing to do with the unfruitful works of darkness. Instead, expose them for what they are.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NAB) Take no part in the fruitless works of darkness; rather expose them,
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NASB) Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them;
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NIV) Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NKJV) And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NLT) Take no part in the worthless deeds of evil and darkness; instead, expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NRSV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (RSV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (TLB) Take no part in the worthless pleasures of evil and darkness, but instead, rebuke and expose them.
We hafta know in order to expose, yes? We are commanded to expose these things, yes? We then must ask in order to receive, yes?
It IS our duty when the Book says so.
Matthew 7:15-20 (KJV) [SUP]15 [/SUP]Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. [SUP]16[/SUP]Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? [SUP]17 [/SUP]Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. [SUP]18 [/SUP]A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [SUP]20 [/SUP]Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Ephesians 5:11 (ESV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (GW) Have nothing to do with the useless works that darkness produces. Instead, expose them for what they are.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (HCSB) Don’t participate in the fruitless works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (ISV) and have nothing to do with the unfruitful works of darkness. Instead, expose them for what they are.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NAB) Take no part in the fruitless works of darkness; rather expose them,
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NASB) Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them;
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NIV) Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NKJV) And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NLT) Take no part in the worthless deeds of evil and darkness; instead, expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (NRSV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (RSV) Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.
[HR][/HR]Ephesians 5:11 (TLB) Take no part in the worthless pleasures of evil and darkness, but instead, rebuke and expose them.
We hafta know in order to expose, yes? We are commanded to expose these things, yes? We then must ask in order to receive, yes?
It IS our duty when the Book says so.
