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Thread: The politics of Gay rights.

  1. #821
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    It teaches an attitude of hate, even if they 'meant well' with what they say. It is hard to picture though, that there is no spite in what they say. It is like telling someone they are ugly, and then saying you are telling them they are ugly so they might be able to see their beauty. Aww that's such a kind thing to do.

    Loving people, they include others. They don't sit on the other side of the wall telling everyone who the enemy is. Maybe the enemy is the one who spends time calling out the enemies. You might notice slander coming from some towards me. Of course they excuse that part of the Bible, they believe they have every right to slander me, they have overruled the word which they use to justify their own thoughts on other things.

    This is why there are many Christian groups being taken down online for inciting hatred. It's like those people who go round with picket signs telling everyone they are going to hell 'unless'.

    If people are blind to how it incites hatred, maybe they are the ones inciting hatred. Often those who do, have some passionate belief that it is the right thing they are doing, that they are fighting a holy battle.

    But it is not love. It just isn't.

    You won't see groups who encourage love and kindness taken down. Maybe God has more patience for those who encourage a more including attitude?

    If you are against homosexuality, and you genuinely want to convert them, how exactly are 'you' going to do that by inciting hatred? Not just towards them, but from them towards you? How can you ever dream of converting someone who you inspire lack of love 'towards you'?

    Every single person on this planet, is a human being, a living conscious creation of God. Try putting yourself in front of them and imagining you are saying what you are saying in front of them. What would be revealed is a coward, and if not a coward, someone two faced.

    And before someone says it is not inciting hatred, no, it is not you proudly making a hate speech. It is but a subtle seed of hate.

    When it comes to religiously motivated indirect phobia, do you ever really hear kindness or love towards the phobia?

    It comes from fear, it does not come from love.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anne_81 View Post
    But what does it imply for them. Some people say it is an illness, some say it is a sin: does that tell us how we should treat those people?

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    It implies that everyone who is not gay has no sin sickness, just the gays.
    No Anne thats not what it means, Mj took it upon himself to field a question that was not asked of him,he decided to butt in to put words in my mouth,again. What it means is that sin is a choice,for everyone. You choose who you will serve,thats what the Bible says.

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    It teaches an attitude of hate, even if they 'meant well' with what they say. It is hard to picture though, that there is no spite in what they say. It is like telling someone they are ugly, and then saying you are telling them they are ugly so they might be able to see their beauty. Aww that's such a kind thing to do.

    Loving people, they include others. They don't sit on the other side of the wall telling everyone who the enemy is. Maybe the enemy is the one who spends time calling out the enemies. You might notice slander coming from some towards me. Of course they excuse that part of the Bible, they believe they have every right to slander me, they have overruled the word which they use to justify their own thoughts on other things.

    This is why there are many Christian groups being taken down online for inciting hatred. It's like those people who go round with picket signs telling everyone they are going to hell 'unless'.

    If people are blind to how it incites hatred, maybe they are the ones inciting hatred. Often those who do, have some passionate belief that it is the right thing they are doing, that they are fighting a holy battle.

    But it is not love. It just isn't.

    You won't see groups who encourage love and kindness taken down. Maybe God has more patience for those who encourage a more including attitude?

    If you are against homosexuality, and you genuinely want to convert them, how exactly are 'you' going to do that by inciting hatred? Not just towards them, but from them towards you? How can you ever dream of converting someone who you inspire lack of love 'towards you'?

    Every single person on this planet, is a human being, a living conscious creation of God. Try putting yourself in front of them and imagining you are saying what you are saying in front of them. What would be revealed is a coward, and if not a coward, someone two faced.

    And before someone says it is not inciting hatred, no, it is not you proudly making a hate speech. It is but a subtle seed of hate.

    When it comes to religiously motivated indirect phobia, do you ever really hear kindness or love towards the phobia?

    It comes from fear, it does not come from love.

    Mj how many people have you personally led to Christ? Do you talk to people about their need for God? You have a whole lot to say Im just wondering if you try to lead people to Christ. Im assuming that you do. So when you bring them to church and the preacher preaches about sin,any sin,what will you do then? What does the word conviction mean to you?


    Ive mentioned before how a young man in a service we held came to know the Lord. My father spoke about homosexuality and how it displeased God and it was sin. He wasn't offended,he came to the alter,got saved and told us later he had not know that homosexuality was offensive to God. The truth never returns void according to the Word. But how can people know the truth if you refuse to tell them.

    We did another service in Toronto at the Salvation Army in the middle of the city. At the alter call many came with all different issues and came to the Lord.The pastor said we have pimps,prostitutes,drug addicts,all kinds that will come tonight. They came and heard the truth and received the Lord.

    I know you like to think everyone but you is a hypocrite. I know you like to jump in and try to insult and stir up trouble. But honestly have you lead anyone to the Lord? And if you have do you think your way is the only way to reach people? There are a lot of ministries out there reaching a lot of different people. Surely you're not immature enough to think you know all. When you go out on the street,into public places and preach the Word then come back to me and we'll talk about it.

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Hello mj007,

    You are going too far when you said:
    "If you are against homosexuality, and you genuinely want to convert them, how exactly are 'you' going to do that by inciting hatred? Not just towards them, but from them towards you? How can you ever dream of converting someone who you inspire lack of love 'towards you'?
    Every single person on this planet, is a human being, a living conscious creation of God. Try putting yourself in front of them and imagining you are saying what you are saying in front of them. What would be revealed is a coward, and if not a coward, someone two faced."


    We are not inciting hate when we tell the gays they are sinning. They usually retort back that they are fine and they have no choice but to be gay. God did not make you that way, your choices did. I will say that to your face, so I am no coward. I do not wish to convert you but I would like you back in the closet.

    Yours,

    Deade
    Romans 8:28: “And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God,
    to them who are the called according to His purpose.”

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anne_81 View Post
    Do you think that being gay is a mental illness? I am sincerely wondering. I am no expert of psychology or medicine...
    More like a disease.
    M & M's melt in your mouth and not in your hands.

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Whatever it might be to many people, one thing is for sure , it is not of God, and anything that is not of God is of the devil. clear as a bell, loud as a whistle. If we want to know where we stand with God, we must learn what is from him, and what is from the devil, and then decide and choose where you want to be.

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    'fence straddlers' will always be set apart from Jesus - no one can make-up their 'own-rules',
    and expect to get by with them in Jesus' Reality, for our Lord tells us plainly
    that He will not accept them...

  8. #828
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    That's self will, know as human will and not Godly will. Even Jesus said when he was praying to his Father. let your will and not my will be done. If Jesus had done it his way, he would have walked away from the cross. These are the same decisions we face every day. self will and Godly will. How do we Go/

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    you are greatly 'mistaken', Jesus would NEVER walk away from the Cross, for this was His destiny,
    in order to be The Saviour of mankind,...

    but we, humans, on the other hand, most of us will throw Him under the bus, every chance we can get,
    in order to 'get our own ways'...

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    @mjoo7
    Where does wishy washy liberal theology end up?

    You end up with Eva Brunne, the lesbian bishop, of the
    Lutheran Church in Sweden
    who is in a 'committed' relationship with another lesbian cleric
    and they are raising a "son" together




    She is so political correct that she wants to removes crosses from
    church buildings -
    "The Bishop of Stockholm has proposed a church in her diocese remove all
    signs of the cross and put down markings showing the direction to Mecca
    for the benefit of Muslim worshippers."

    The Left and the Marxists all love her.
    But does Jesus love her?
    In the end this is what counts as important.
    Any fool can deceive themselves.
    for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!
    1Corinthians 9:16

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    Senior Member Waggles's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    LGBT IN THE EPISCOPL CHURCH

    https://www.episcopalchurch.org/page/lgbt-church

    In 1976, the General Convention of the Episcopal Church declared that
    “homosexual persons are children of God who have a full and equal claim with
    all other persons upon the love, acceptance, and pastoral concern and care
    of the Church."
    To our lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender brothers and sisters:
    “The Episcopal Church welcomes you!”


    Why do you think that this world is going to burn?
    Why are we forewarned that the wrath and judgment of God is
    coming upon this world?
    Why will the wicked be reduced to ash?


    And I will punish the world for their evil, and the
    wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy
    of the proud to cease, and I will lay low the haughtiness
    of the terrible.

    Isaiah 13:11

    1: For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud,
    yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall
    burn them up, says the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root
    nor branch.
    3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of
    your feet in the day that I shall do this, says the LORD of hosts.

    Malachi 4:
    willfollowsGod likes this.
    for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!
    1Corinthians 9:16

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Taking down crosses, putting down markers for Muslims; Can you please tell me how that affects your life, or how it would affect your life if you lived closer? Do you need crosses to be a Christian? Do you need other religions out of sight for you to be a Christian? Do we need to use crosses more than ourselves, to inspire others to become Christian?

    As for the whole 'ooh its a liberal', well it just shows that you are a finger pointer, you label people easily. Give them a label, and you can objectify them with 'apathy'. It's not good really to practice apathy. Do you get that? Are you able to press the stop button and look at what you say, or do you fear ever going back on your own words for loss of pride? I'll tell you something, doing something courageous like that, shows humility, it doesn't make you bad for letting go of your pride. While someone like me going back on my words, you might jump at the chance to see fault. But if you or any of the people who practice apathy did that, it would just be nice to see, a good thing. Do you get that? Or really not??

    Do you think Jesus was apathetic, or was he empathetic?

    Would you let a prostitute wash your feet, or would you label her in a way that she wasn't allowed near your feet?

    Just food for thought before you think I'm looking for an answer from you for every question.

    Quote Originally Posted by Waggles View Post
    @mjoo7
    Where does wishy washy liberal theology end up?

    You end up with Eva Brunne, the lesbian bishop, of the
    Lutheran Church in Sweden
    who is in a 'committed' relationship with another lesbian cleric
    and they are raising a "son" together




    She is so political correct that she wants to removes crosses from
    church buildings -
    "The Bishop of Stockholm has proposed a church in her diocese remove all
    signs of the cross and put down markings showing the direction to Mecca
    for the benefit of Muslim worshippers."

    The Left and the Marxists all love her.
    But does Jesus love her?
    In the end this is what counts as important.
    Any fool can deceive themselves.

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Ok, so what are you going to do about it? What's your plan to change things, or are you just being pessimistic about the future? Or maybe it is the truth, but it's still a glum perspective, lets all just think about the bad, the end of the world - or basically, lets just watch the news.

    Imagine you are in WW2, Jews dying in the millions in gas camps. Are you saying things have got worse because gays are more free and accepted now? Is that worse than what happened in WW2? I suppose in the year 4000 you will still be that person saying the end is nigh.

    Is it bad to be optimistic about people and the future, even if it's the future in the time that I live? I'm pretty sure I will still be around, and any end of world scenario won't happen in my time. But people have a fascination with 'the end', like they do with the news, and with conspiracy. It's all interconnected.

    Quote Originally Posted by Waggles View Post
    LGBT IN THE EPISCOPL CHURCH

    https://www.episcopalchurch.org/page/lgbt-church

    In 1976, the General Convention of the Episcopal Church declared that
    “homosexual persons are children of God who have a full and equal claim with
    all other persons upon the love, acceptance, and pastoral concern and care
    of the Church."
    To our lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender brothers and sisters:
    “The Episcopal Church welcomes you!”


    Why do you think that this world is going to burn?
    Why are we forewarned that the wrath and judgment of God is
    coming upon this world?
    Why will the wicked be reduced to ash?


    And I will punish the world for their evil, and the
    wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy
    of the proud to cease, and I will lay low the haughtiness
    of the terrible.

    Isaiah 13:11

    1: For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud,
    yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall
    burn them up, says the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root
    nor branch.
    3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of
    your feet in the day that I shall do this, says the LORD of hosts.

    Malachi 4:

  14. #834
    Senior Member Dude653's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by shrimp View Post
    We take gun rights away.
    Because it's a public safety issue
    We're all Negan

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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dude653 View Post
    Because it's a public safety issue
    I choose personal safety over public safety.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    The bible is a mirror not a magnifying glass
    use it to examine yourself not others.

  16. #836
    Senior Member kaylagrl's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Taking down crosses, putting down markers for Muslims; Can you please tell me how that affects your life, or how it would affect your life if you lived closer? Do you need crosses to be a Christian? Do you need other religions out of sight for you to be a Christian? Do we need to use crosses more than ourselves, to inspire others to become Christian?

    As for the whole 'ooh its a liberal', well it just shows that you are a finger pointer, you label people easily. Give them a label, and you can objectify them with 'apathy'. It's not good really to practice apathy. Do you get that? Are you able to press the stop button and look at what you say, or do you fear ever going back on your own words for loss of pride? I'll tell you something, doing something courageous like that, shows humility, it doesn't make you bad for letting go of your pride. While someone like me going back on my words, you might jump at the chance to see fault. But if you or any of the people who practice apathy did that, it would just be nice to see, a good thing. Do you get that? Or really not??

    Do you think Jesus was apathetic, or was he empathetic?

    Would you let a prostitute wash your feet, or would you label her in a way that she wasn't allowed near your feet?

    Just food for thought before you think I'm looking for an answer from you for every question.




    Interesting that you chose not to answer my questions to you in post 823. I'll wait and see if you choose to answer.



    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Taking down crosses, putting down markers for Muslims; Can you please tell me how that affects your life, or how it would affect your life if you lived closer? Do you need crosses to be a Christian? Do you need other religions out of sight for you to be a Christian? Do we need to use crosses more than ourselves, to inspire others to become Christian?


    Can you explain to my why anyone would want to take the cross off a church? Or make sure people know which way Mecca is? Why would a bishop want to do that? Explain that to me please. Im more concerned about the latter than the former but either way why would a bishop want to do that?



    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Do you think Jesus was apathetic, or was he empathetic?

    Matt.-And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.

    What do you think his reaction would be to a gay priest who wants to tear down crosses and point people to Mecca,a holy city to Islam,a religion that denies who He is? Do you think he'd be cool with that or that he would have something to say about it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Would you let a prostitute wash your feet, or would you label her in a way that she wasn't allowed near your feet?



    16 Jesus saith unto her, Go, call thy husband, and come hither.
    17 The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband:
    18 For thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidst thou truly....


    28 The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men,
    29 Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ?

    Jesus has no issue talking to people about their sin,then He told them He was the answer. Then He said "go thy way and sin no more". Jesus realized that sin was a problem and He knew He was the solution to sin. That didn't make Jesus a hater or apathetic. Jesus showed people they were lost and then showed them He was the way.




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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Ok, so what are you going to do about it? What's your plan to change things, or are you just being pessimistic about the future? Or maybe it is the truth, but it's still a glum perspective, lets all just think about the bad, the end of the world - or basically, lets just watch the news.

    Imagine you are in WW2, Jews dying in the millions in gas camps. Are you saying things have got worse because gays are more free and accepted now? Is that worse than what happened in WW2? I suppose in the year 4000 you will still be that person saying the end is nigh.

    Is it bad to be optimistic about people and the future, even if it's the future in the time that I live? I'm pretty sure I will still be around, and any end of world scenario won't happen in my time. But people have a fascination with 'the end', like they do with the news, and with conspiracy. It's all interconnected.


    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Ok, so what are you going to do about it? What's your plan to change things, or are you just being pessimistic about the future? Or maybe it is the truth, but it's still a glum perspective, lets all just think about the bad, the end of the world - or basically, lets just watch the news.
    We can do nothing about it except point people to the truth.Thats our job. Jesus told us to be ready,to be watching to be doing and preparing for His return. There are a lot of people out there that need to be reached. Yes,we are to be thinking about the end of the world.The Bible makes that clear.



    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post

    Imagine you are in WW2, Jews dying in the millions in gas camps. Are you saying things have got worse because gays are more free and accepted now? Is that worse than what happened in WW2? I suppose in the year 4000 you will still be that person saying the end is nigh.

    2 Tim.-But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

    We are told things will get worse and worse as we come closer to His coming.That is why its important to share the truth while there is time left.



    Quote Originally Posted by mj007 View Post
    Is it bad to be optimistic about people and the future, even if it's the future in the time that I live? I'm pretty sure I will still be around, and any end of world scenario won't happen in my time. But people have a fascination with 'the end', like they do with the news, and with conspiracy. It's all interconnected.

    If your optimism has to do with leading the lost to Christ,no thats not wrong.But we are to be ready to go.The Bible talks about the foolish and the wise virgins.The wise virgins were ready for the bridgeroom.We need to be ready and help others be ready. You don't know when the end will happen,it may happen today or 20yrs from now but we are told to "watch and wait" Thats the Bible,thats not conspiracy.


    willfollowsGod and Angela_s like this.

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    Senior Member Dude653's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Christian churches are being demolished in China right now... I mean literally demolished.. that's not a metaphor..
    but Christians in America think they're being persecuted because gay people are getting married
    Zi likes this.
    We're all Negan

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    Senior Member kaylagrl's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dude653 View Post
    Christian churches are being demolished in China right now... I mean literally demolished.. that's not a metaphor..
    but Christians in America think they're being persecuted because gay people are getting married
    Every society that lost its religious freedom had a starting point.Wake up.

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    Senior Member willfollowsGod's Avatar
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    Default Re: The politics of Gay rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dude653 View Post
    Christian churches are being demolished in China right now... I mean literally demolished.. that's not a metaphor..
    but Christians in America think they're being persecuted because gay people are getting married
    First of all, you are wrong. Christians are being persecuted because they are being forced to do their business according to what the world wants them to do it on instead of Christian principles. Sadly, persecution in China is increasing as well. Say what you said to the face of Barronelle Stutzman, Jack Philips, the Kleins, Kim Davis, etc and you will get the same response I am trying to say. The Kleins as well as Jack Philips, would offer cookies, other cakes, etc but they would not make a wedding cake for a homosexual ceremony. You misunderstand my position on this issue and others and deliberately misrepresent it. Being sued, put in jail, etc all because you decided in your heart and conscience according to the authority that God has given you to not make the cake, do the flowers, take the picture of a homosexual couple or their union, etc, is discrimination and is wrong. The homosexual couple could go to another bakery for their wedding cake, another florist for the flowers for the ceremony, another photographer for their event, etc. Why target the Christian man or woman trying to operate their business on Christian principles? Also, you don't seem to understand what that side wants. They want you to accept that they are ''gay'' or else, they want you celebrate it like they do in their gay pride parades (no other sin is usually celebrated in that way), they will take no for an answer, etc. This is not rocket science. Also to be understood, that some Christians would make the cake, give the flowers, etc. and would not have a conscience issue about that decision but not all Christians are like that. What I want and others want is the choice and the freedom to express oneself in the public and not just the private sphere. Please try to understand our position. Thanks. God bless.

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