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S
You don't usually have to understand someone to get them to relax and open up.
Just listen for a while and people see that you're different. At which point you might be able to help someone through whatever that is. I don't advocate trying to change someone, and there are cases where it's best to bail, but still it's good to leave someone better than they were when you met them - and it's very Christ like to do.
Heh, maybe.
Though I'd recommend you figure most of that out first, before another person is involved. Dating is so messy it can confuse the heck out of people.
Just listen for a while and people see that you're different. At which point you might be able to help someone through whatever that is. I don't advocate trying to change someone, and there are cases where it's best to bail, but still it's good to leave someone better than they were when you met them - and it's very Christ like to do.
Heh, maybe.
Though I'd recommend you figure most of that out first, before another person is involved. Dating is so messy it can confuse the heck out of people.
I get what you're saying. We have to have boundaries for ourselves so we can avoid this, and all of our boundaries will be different. You might try limiting how much you interact with her in order to keep a slow pace. Don't jump into texting/calling all the time. Just a little here or there. Do this deliberately so that neither of you gets "tunnel vision". If you see that things are going well, slowly increase that amount of time at a healthy rate, using your brain to think about the situation rather than your emotions. Be careful not to speak words to her that advance the pace more quickly than is wise. You control the pace (both of you) by the words you speak, the amount of time you spend together, and the thoughts you let yourself think.
Constantly reminding yourself to GO SLOW helps too! Stop yourself and say "No, self, we aren't going to be thinking about that this early in the game. It's not time for that yet." Be honest with the woman you are seeing (this future woman) about wanting to go slow and be careful. If you explain this all to her, she will understand and will help you with it. Your honesty will also remove any suspicion she might have that you are playing games. You aren't playing games. You are simply being very careful.
I'm with the others though, that you need lots of time before entering the dating world again. You will go through MANY stages of healing in the first several years. You need to learn about yourself, about your own needs and desires and weaknesses, and that takes a lot of time and self-reflection. Much more than it might feel to you right now.
Constantly reminding yourself to GO SLOW helps too! Stop yourself and say "No, self, we aren't going to be thinking about that this early in the game. It's not time for that yet." Be honest with the woman you are seeing (this future woman) about wanting to go slow and be careful. If you explain this all to her, she will understand and will help you with it. Your honesty will also remove any suspicion she might have that you are playing games. You aren't playing games. You are simply being very careful.
I'm with the others though, that you need lots of time before entering the dating world again. You will go through MANY stages of healing in the first several years. You need to learn about yourself, about your own needs and desires and weaknesses, and that takes a lot of time and self-reflection. Much more than it might feel to you right now.
my primary advice to guys in general interested in women is to be their friend. i mean, a REAL friend.
i can't be more tired of hearing about the "friend-zone".
as i've oft said here (and others too) women date all the time from their friend zone, because the friend zone is very different (usually) for guys.
while guys "friend-zone" chicks they aren't attracted to, women "friend-zone" guys that they don't know well enough to be attracted to, or consider him a "maybe" while they are pursuing a relationship with someone else (as well as other scenarios). but women simply need a lot more time and information to develop attraction.
often during times of dating, i was often REAL friends (meaning legitimate friendships, not something under the guise of friendship) with guys that i considered "definite maybes", knowing that if things didn't turn out well with this guy i was dating/interested in, i was friends with guys that i thought highly of, and wouldn't mind getting to know better in another context (should the opportunities arise).
please don't confuse that with "juggling" or dating more than one guy. it's not the same, i promise.
the same qualities that make someone a great friend are usually similar qualities that make you a good romantic prospect. and for me, i never made friends with ulterior motives, as such, either outcome would be considered satisfactory (best case, he becomes more than a "friend" and worst case, i have a great friend).
bottom line, if you're really interested in a woman, choose the long game, and be her friend. get to know her, and allow her to know you without any expectations of more. the best case is that she'll see a lot in you and want more, and the worst case is you'll have a friend and probably learn a lot more about what women want and how to communicate better with them.
after some time, friendship allows you to see people more clearly. and those great qualities that one possesses really shine during the day to day grind of life--if you're funny, thoughtful, considerate and whatever other qualities that you bring to a friendship will be endearing. she'll see someone who she wants to know better--and if she's dating a loser, you'll show her what a "good guy" looks like without telling her she's settling for dating a bum. that foundation of friendship launches a romantic relationship upon a fuller spectrum of compatibility. the awkwardness is gone, and you're operating from position of knowledge about their personality, who they are, and established rapport.
besides, there's nothing better than being in love with someone who can be your best friend--there are plenty of great folks whom you might have the basis for falling in love with them, but not really liking who they are. : )
finally, to the OP...i really, really hope you avoid romantic relationships for a long time. seriously. after going out on some dates with divorced guys, i'd highly encourage you to take the time to do a real relationship autopsy of your failed marriage, and learn what it is you need to learn from it. you owe that to yourself and your future relationship and relationship partner. also, if you're harboring ANY ill will towards your ex, it will come out in all kinds of ways, and it will scream to every astute woman that you are not ready for a new relationship (something so very unattractive, yet common that i could write a book on this). look at this as an opportunity to be MORE CAPABLE for the next relationship by learning what it is that you need to know, whom it is you're looking for, and leaving your baggage behind.
no one deserves to pay the price for what your ex did, the resentment you've developed, be your "soft place to fall" or play therapist to your wounded ego/soul. you need to work out that stuff alone, with God. and a trained therapist, ideally.
some therapists recommend you stay single for 50% of the length of time you were with your ex. since i've never been married/divorced, nor am a therapist, i can't really speak to this personally, but please don't rush it. all the statistics practically predict failure for your future relationships when that occurs.
i can't be more tired of hearing about the "friend-zone".
as i've oft said here (and others too) women date all the time from their friend zone, because the friend zone is very different (usually) for guys.
while guys "friend-zone" chicks they aren't attracted to, women "friend-zone" guys that they don't know well enough to be attracted to, or consider him a "maybe" while they are pursuing a relationship with someone else (as well as other scenarios). but women simply need a lot more time and information to develop attraction.
often during times of dating, i was often REAL friends (meaning legitimate friendships, not something under the guise of friendship) with guys that i considered "definite maybes", knowing that if things didn't turn out well with this guy i was dating/interested in, i was friends with guys that i thought highly of, and wouldn't mind getting to know better in another context (should the opportunities arise).
please don't confuse that with "juggling" or dating more than one guy. it's not the same, i promise.
the same qualities that make someone a great friend are usually similar qualities that make you a good romantic prospect. and for me, i never made friends with ulterior motives, as such, either outcome would be considered satisfactory (best case, he becomes more than a "friend" and worst case, i have a great friend).
bottom line, if you're really interested in a woman, choose the long game, and be her friend. get to know her, and allow her to know you without any expectations of more. the best case is that she'll see a lot in you and want more, and the worst case is you'll have a friend and probably learn a lot more about what women want and how to communicate better with them.
after some time, friendship allows you to see people more clearly. and those great qualities that one possesses really shine during the day to day grind of life--if you're funny, thoughtful, considerate and whatever other qualities that you bring to a friendship will be endearing. she'll see someone who she wants to know better--and if she's dating a loser, you'll show her what a "good guy" looks like without telling her she's settling for dating a bum. that foundation of friendship launches a romantic relationship upon a fuller spectrum of compatibility. the awkwardness is gone, and you're operating from position of knowledge about their personality, who they are, and established rapport.
besides, there's nothing better than being in love with someone who can be your best friend--there are plenty of great folks whom you might have the basis for falling in love with them, but not really liking who they are. : )
finally, to the OP...i really, really hope you avoid romantic relationships for a long time. seriously. after going out on some dates with divorced guys, i'd highly encourage you to take the time to do a real relationship autopsy of your failed marriage, and learn what it is you need to learn from it. you owe that to yourself and your future relationship and relationship partner. also, if you're harboring ANY ill will towards your ex, it will come out in all kinds of ways, and it will scream to every astute woman that you are not ready for a new relationship (something so very unattractive, yet common that i could write a book on this). look at this as an opportunity to be MORE CAPABLE for the next relationship by learning what it is that you need to know, whom it is you're looking for, and leaving your baggage behind.
no one deserves to pay the price for what your ex did, the resentment you've developed, be your "soft place to fall" or play therapist to your wounded ego/soul. you need to work out that stuff alone, with God. and a trained therapist, ideally.
some therapists recommend you stay single for 50% of the length of time you were with your ex. since i've never been married/divorced, nor am a therapist, i can't really speak to this personally, but please don't rush it. all the statistics practically predict failure for your future relationships when that occurs.
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from what I have seen, women generally do not touch anyone in the friend zone. they will have the best guy in the world in that zone but won't touch him, she usually ends up running out with some five time loser and when it ends goes crawling back to the friend zone guy crying about the five time loser.
so i call bogus on the "women will chose from the friend zone" comment.
so i call bogus on the "women will chose from the friend zone" comment.
M
Good advice, but it certainly won't be years before i start dating, although i do imagine it will be years before i would ever be ready to get married again.
And this is good advice to anyone... I have to balance the stark reality of how short life is with finding sufficient healing, go to far one way or the other and it's not good. But certainly nothing is going to waste more time than rushing into something too quickly and wasting who knows how many years and then it doesn't work out! This much i do know!!
But also it does help me allot to think about starting dating, because when i think about starting dating that is when i take a good look at myself and ask the questions, ok what do i need to do to be ready? It is not so unlike the way we dress up to go on a date, and all the attention we pay to the details of how we look on the outside, only do this same process for how you look on the inside!
I also did a course, called 'being relationship ready'. At the end there was a special questionnaire to measure how relationship ready you are (to whatever extent that is possible). I rated 'moderate' meaning i could start a relationship but i still have allot of issues to deal with. I agree
And this is good advice to anyone... I have to balance the stark reality of how short life is with finding sufficient healing, go to far one way or the other and it's not good. But certainly nothing is going to waste more time than rushing into something too quickly and wasting who knows how many years and then it doesn't work out! This much i do know!!
But also it does help me allot to think about starting dating, because when i think about starting dating that is when i take a good look at myself and ask the questions, ok what do i need to do to be ready? It is not so unlike the way we dress up to go on a date, and all the attention we pay to the details of how we look on the outside, only do this same process for how you look on the inside!
I also did a course, called 'being relationship ready'. At the end there was a special questionnaire to measure how relationship ready you are (to whatever extent that is possible). I rated 'moderate' meaning i could start a relationship but i still have allot of issues to deal with. I agree
A few years may pass by without you even realizing it. Like you said, life is short. It goes by fast while we're looking for things.
I'm glad you seem to be doing well emotionally. However, if you tested "moderately" ready for a relationship while you are still legally unavailable to even remarry, I would have to question the validity of the test.
I'm glad you seem to be doing well emotionally. However, if you tested "moderately" ready for a relationship while you are still legally unavailable to even remarry, I would have to question the validity of the test.
M
Gypsygirl, some good advice there,
One of the first things i did when my marriage was over was to realize i do not want to continue on the same, i do not want to go through this again, yes there are no guarantees i know, but the person that i was in my marriage, gosh, cringe worthy! the potential to improve my chances in the future from the person that i was is literally staggering. But also i have a very good foundation to build upon, and there are many things i can be proud of. I was never unfaithful, i was always supportive, i never ever swore at my wife or shouted at her in anger, i was always gentle, always there for her, always honest, a great father to our child (which she herself told me many times). I never got drunk, never flirted with other women, never gambled or spent money on myself.
My area of deficiency springs from low self esteem, and my wife in her struggle to get what she wanted out of the relationship, did exactly all the wrong things to 'rub salt' so to speak against my low self esteem. I became depressed and cynical and unmotivated.
So my big life lesson has been to learn to like myself, and it is quite amazing how this one little thing can create such transformation, amazing, i just wish it had not taken me so long to learn!! So yes, i do feel like i am ready to start dating, but i am very cautious, i would feel better to at least wait until the divorce is finalized, and i still have allot to learn (as will always be the case).
Oh and i don't carry any bitterness towards my wife, although obviously i am not happy about not being allowed to try anything to save the marriage, i do acknowledge the divorce has opened the door to opportunity to find the healing and happiness that we could not find together.
One of the first things i did when my marriage was over was to realize i do not want to continue on the same, i do not want to go through this again, yes there are no guarantees i know, but the person that i was in my marriage, gosh, cringe worthy! the potential to improve my chances in the future from the person that i was is literally staggering. But also i have a very good foundation to build upon, and there are many things i can be proud of. I was never unfaithful, i was always supportive, i never ever swore at my wife or shouted at her in anger, i was always gentle, always there for her, always honest, a great father to our child (which she herself told me many times). I never got drunk, never flirted with other women, never gambled or spent money on myself.
My area of deficiency springs from low self esteem, and my wife in her struggle to get what she wanted out of the relationship, did exactly all the wrong things to 'rub salt' so to speak against my low self esteem. I became depressed and cynical and unmotivated.
So my big life lesson has been to learn to like myself, and it is quite amazing how this one little thing can create such transformation, amazing, i just wish it had not taken me so long to learn!! So yes, i do feel like i am ready to start dating, but i am very cautious, i would feel better to at least wait until the divorce is finalized, and i still have allot to learn (as will always be the case).
Oh and i don't carry any bitterness towards my wife, although obviously i am not happy about not being allowed to try anything to save the marriage, i do acknowledge the divorce has opened the door to opportunity to find the healing and happiness that we could not find together.
M
One thing i should also mention that will help put things in perspective for people to understand my position.... it was something my wife said, she said "the marriage has been over for a long time and we just did not want to admit it".
It is true, i just considered her to be a good friend, not a wife, there was no sex at all in the last year before she ended it, and only twice the year before that. I was so used to rejection in the bedroom i gave up asking, i think that is when deep down i have accepted it is over, that was over 2 years ago now.
This is why i have what is seemingly quite a head start on the healing process and preparedness to move on.
It is true, i just considered her to be a good friend, not a wife, there was no sex at all in the last year before she ended it, and only twice the year before that. I was so used to rejection in the bedroom i gave up asking, i think that is when deep down i have accepted it is over, that was over 2 years ago now.
This is why i have what is seemingly quite a head start on the healing process and preparedness to move on.
S
Keep praying and following the righteous path of Christ. Also don't forget, that for every minute we waste on dwelling in the past, is a minute we could have spent on hopes for the future. If the past was not good, don't have breakfast with it. Ask the waiter for the check and move on. God bless you!
Yeah... that's why I said it was just my opinion. It just seems to me like a friend is someone you can talk about your worries/wants more comfortably without worrying about scaring them off. You can go into the relationship on the same page. But maybe I should clarify I'm referring to starting a serious relationship not casual dating.
R
i'm attempting to to avoid going through this right now... i really want things to be different in this relationship, moving slow has never been in my nature but i find i am the one pulling the reins back and saying i'm not ready lets slow down but i also get caught up in the emotion, i want a book that says the 10 commandments of dating.... lol i just want someone to tell me what to do