Unaddressed sins and prayer requests

[hoss2576]

I was reading in the family and prayer request forums, and I began to wonder about something. If someone asks for prayer, and in the course of their prayer request, the person mentions a sin in their life. However, the person doesn't address it as a sin.

Ex: A man asks for prayer because he and his girlfriend just had a new baby, and he is out of work. He is now seeking prayer that he finds a job so he can support his new little family.

Do you feel an obligation to address the sin issue being presented? Do you simply pray for the request? Should we feel an obligation if that is not what the person is seeking prayer about? If you do address it, how do you do it in a productive/helpful way since the "sinner" won't have been in the mindset or open to address it?

 

[Olerica]

When that happens in my 1:1 life, I do. I first affirm that I will pray, and then counsel regarding the sin.

I think I have done that here when I've seen it. Somehow it's more difficult online. I don't know if they are in the process of getting married, etc. (to use your example). I think gently, but firmly and in the kindest way possible and don't back down when the issue needs to be addressed and corrected again. It's scary to do it though.... and I pray a lot about it.

 

[blue_ladybug]

People don't always need to be presented with their sin. In your example, the guy most likely knows that it's wrong to live together and have premarital sex before marriage. He's asking for prayer to find some work so he can support his new family, NOT requesting prayer to be reminded of his sins.. He has God to account to for that. It's not our job to pardon him or not.

If the guy wanted to address his sin he might have said something like "I need prayer to repent of my sin of fornication AND ALSO to find more work." BUT he only addressed the work aspect of prayer. Saying "well, if you were'nt living together and having sex then you wouldn't need to support a family" is not the way we should address it at all.

Many posts that I have read on here have the people saying that they know such and such is a sin, but they did it anyway, and now need help with a solution. They own up to the sin, and ask for prayer for what they need. Do I feel an obligation to address the sin? Not always.. If they own the sin, then I might say something. Do I simply pray for the person? Yes, because God knows what they need, far better than we do. Should we feel an obligation if the sin isn't what the person's asking prayer for? No, we shouldn't feel any obligation to throw it in their face.

"Judge not, lest ye be judged."

If they ONLY ask for prayer, then that's what we're to give them.. If they ask for help with the sin also, then it would be appropriate to say something like, "You know it was wrong, ask God to forgive you and repent of it." Something along those lines..

 

[hoss2576]

Should we feel an obligation if the sin isn't what the person's asking prayer for? No, we shouldn't feel any obligation to throw it in their face.

"Judge not, lest ye be judged."

Since when is addressing sin equated to judging the person?

 

[Olerica]

Well, Hoss was talking about UNADRESSED sin, so... I kinda agree with you Blue in that we shouldn't be bashing people over the head if they are acknowledging the sin... but if they aren't? We are obligated to try encourage them back to following Christ.

[h=3]Galatians 6:1-2 ESV [/h]Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.


[h=3]James 5:19-20 ESV [/h]My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

1 Corinthians 5:12 ESV For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?

I think it's very wise for us to consider that. Those who call themselves Christians should be judged by that meter by each other... not to condemn but to draw towards sanctification. It's the world we shouldn't be judging because frankly, they don't have the standard in their lives.

 

[blue_ladybug]

Since when is addressing sin equated to judging the person?

For example, a woman cheats on her husband. She owns up to it on here, and someone responds with, "well, must be your husband is lacking in the bedroom or you wouldn't have cheated"--along the lines of that.. That IS judging the person, just assuming hubby isn't good in bed so wife went elsewhere for a better sex partner.. I have seen many responses like that on here..

 

[hoss2576]

For example, a woman cheats on her husband. She owns up to it on here, and someone responds with, "well, must be your husband is lacking in the bedroom or you wouldn't have cheated"--along the lines of that.. That IS judging the person, just assuming hubby isn't good in bed so wife went elsewhere for a better sex partner.. I have seen many responses like that on here..

Again, one has nothing to do with the other. Pointing out her husband must have been horrible in bed isn't even a sin issue as much as her cheating is. I actually have absolutely no clue how this applies to what I am talking about. In your example the person wasn't even passing judgment on the sinner as much as on the mate.

 

[Grace-Like-Rain]

Well, Hoss was talking about UNADRESSED sin, so... I kinda agree with you Blue in that we shouldn't be bashing people over the head if they are acknowledging the sin... but if they aren't? We are obligated to try encourage them back to following Christ.

Galatians 6:1-2 ESV

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.


James 5:19-20 ESV

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

1 Corinthians 5:12 ESV For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?

I think it's very wise for us to consider that. Those who call themselves Christians should be judged by that meter by each other... not to condemn but to draw towards sanctification. It's the world we shouldn't be judging because frankly, they don't have the standard in their lives.

"You must spread some reputation around before giving it to Olerica again."

Good stuff. Why would we address the unaddressed sin? Not to condemn, but to encourage a brother or sister further toward righteousness, out of love for them.

I'm not really sure what I would do in the example situation. Definitely let them know that I am praying for them to find employment, and that the Lord would be with them and draw them close to him during this time. In this situation I might not mention the living situation at all, but come back to it later in an unrelated way, asking if they've thought about getting married and encouraging them to perhaps consider it if they haven't done so. I think it would be best in that situation not to tie the two subjects so closely together. My prayers (and love) for them are not conditional, and I wouldn't want to give the impression that they are.

 

[ServantStrike]

For example, a woman cheats on her husband. She owns up to it on here, and someone responds with, "well, must be your husband is lacking in the bedroom or you wouldn't have cheated"--along the lines of that.. That IS judging the person, just assuming hubby isn't good in bed so wife went elsewhere for a better sex partner.. I have seen many responses like that on here..

Sometimes horrific things happen to people who haven't sinned intentionally. I don't think some people can handle seeing that as it makes them uncomfortable to realize the world isn't just. It's much more comfortable for many to pass arbitrary judgement in that situation. Anyone who does that is sinning themselves, and we will all have to answer for every careless word we say. There is a difference between showing someone a sin issue out of love and ramming the sword of the spirit into the heart of another believer. And yes, around here I've seen people bury that sword right to the hilt - I've seen it in physical churches too.

In Hoss'es example, we're obligated to tell the person what they're doing is a sin. They may not even know it - and if we do so out of a place of love, we can still pray for them and talk to them afterwards.

If someone has an obvious and glaring unrepentant sin issue in their life (like ongoing premarital sex in Hoss'es example), then they need to know about this and to deal with it. God can bless anyone He chooses to, but we open ourselves up to all kinds of trouble when we have unrepentant sin issues.

Sin is a void that separates us from God. If we hold on to it intentionally, at best we miss out on blessings. In the worst case, we open ourselves up to hardship because God can and will let us be broken to turn us back to Him. He's not going to let our hearts turn to stone forever. It's a lot better and a lot more loving to tell someone this before they hit rock bottom.

I'm thankful for everyone who has ever called me out on my sin, and I pray God blesses them a thousand fold for their kindness in having the courage to tell me.

 

[DuchessAimee]

I was reading in the family and prayer request forums, and I began to wonder about something. If someone asks for prayer, and in the course of their prayer request, the person mentions a sin in their life. However, the person doesn't address it as a sin.

Ex: A man asks for prayer because he and his girlfriend just had a new baby, and he is out of work. He is now seeking prayer that he finds a job so he can support his new little family.

Do you feel an obligation to address the sin issue being presented? Do you simply pray for the request? Should we feel an obligation if that is not what the person is seeking prayer about? If you do address it, how do you do it in a productive/helpful way since the "sinner" won't have been in the mindset or open to address it?

First, how do you know the sin hasn't been addressed?

How close are you to the man who has asked for prayer?

How are you going to approach the man about the sin?

If you're absolutely sure they're living together, are you sure they're sleeping together? Because it's not a sin for an unmarried couple to live together. It simply presents an appearance of evil.

Here's my point. With something like this, unless you're a fixture in this man's life, unless he knows you love him, I wouldn't pull the "I'm an elder Christian who's doing everything right card.". And whether or not that's how you mean it, that's how he's going to take it. If he's living with his girl, he's a noob. You have to consider this generation and the chip on their shoulder. You also have to consider that the church is basically mirroring the world.

I have been a Christian for 14 years, and I grew up in church to boot. So that's 34 years of being around the body of Christ. To this day, unless you're the pastor, if you don't have some sort of place in my life, you can say what you want, but don't be surprised when I shine you on. And if you bring up some sin you think I committed, but that I wasn't talking to you about... yeah, that's not going to go over well.

 

[Faithful_Fay]

Wow, that's such a delicate situation. I think that I would hesitate to point out a person's sin when they're obviously vulnerable or coming to you under pain/pressure. I would think that they're somewhat aware and probably be reticent if they felt judged. Not to say that anyone's intention would be to point out shortcomings, but I would guess that's how it'd be perceived.

My approach would be to offer them the prayer and support while building a rapport, if that's possible and then prayerfully approach them. From my experience, God will lead a person's heart to be more aware of their sins as their relationship with Him deepens, so that is when they're receptive to loving corrections.

 

[gypsygirl]

in the OP's example, there is info missing that speaks to his current relationship with the girlfriend, and whether he is dealing with the sin matter appropriately, either. for all we know, he could be seeking money to support his "family" but has repented from the sin and is now trying to do "right" by them through a job.

i think there is an opportunity for us to listen carefully, and do what we are asked (pray for those who need it) while still being sensitive to the complexity of the couple'situation, seeking to "listen" without assumption, with our primary goal to be a blessing, to lift up in prayer, to encourage and to be obedient in Christ.


think of it this way: what if someone asked for prayer to provide for the family borne of sinful behavior but has been repented of, and resolved?

generally speaking, i will pray about this situation. given the amount of information i am aware of, i might ask for clarity through additional information, as well. if/when i am inclined to address their situation and current path, i don't do it from the perspective of a "prayer request" but will send them a message of encouragement, with my clear and most important objective to be that they know i am concerned about them and have love for them as a sister or brother in Christ.

rather that fulfilling an objective to point something out to them, i tend to prefer to create the environment for dialogue the discussion can naturally happen in a way that this sort of concern can be raised. because expressing this concern should only happen if you actually care about the person, and the motivation is completely out of love.

if your motivation is simply to convict (or even indict) someone because you feel some eager authority to do so, i think that would be a mistake. in fact, anytime someone asks for prayer or advice for their "_______________" we should be checking our heart and intention for having the right "heart attitude" that we are approaching them in love and concern for them both as a brother and sister but as someone who is hurting.

further, rather than assumption, i think the value of handling something like this on a "one to one basis" is important (something olerica already touched on). if there is a sin issue concern, i think the discussion should always be privately addressed, sensitively handled, free from assumption (ask questions first) and ONLY if you can genuinely admit that it is motivated of love and concern, instead of something that is more likely about the person who is presenting the concern. : )

People don't always need to be presented with their sin. In your example, the guy most likely knows that it's wrong to live together and have premarital sex before marriage. He's asking for prayer to find some work so he can support his new family, NOT requesting prayer to be reminded of his sins.. He has God to account to for that. It's not our job to pardon him or not.

If the guy wanted to address his sin he might have said something like "I need prayer to repent of my sin of fornication AND ALSO to find more work." BUT he only addressed the work aspect of prayer. Saying "well, if you were'nt living together and having sex then you wouldn't need to support a family" is not the way we should address it at all.

Many posts that I have read on here have the people saying that they know such and such is a sin, but they did it anyway, and now need help with a solution. They own up to the sin, and ask for prayer for what they need. Do I feel an obligation to address the sin? Not always.. If they own the sin, then I might say something. Do I simply pray for the person? Yes, because God knows what they need, far better than we do. Should we feel an obligation if the sin isn't what the person's asking prayer for? No, we shouldn't feel any obligation to throw it in their face.

"Judge not, lest ye be judged."

If they ONLY ask for prayer, then that's what we're to give them.. If they ask for help with the sin also, then it would be appropriate to say something like, "You know it was wrong, ask God to forgive you and repent of it." Something along those lines..

unfortunately, i think people (most people) think that addressing the sin matter is not a loving thing to do--which is a huge issue, with people feeling able to confront another in Christ. this kind of attitude maintained by "christian" folk is something that makes me feel very very lonely and part of an insincere community.

however, give people an objective situation, and remove any risk of feeling personally "called out", we can usually gain a christian consensus on the basis of the many verses that speak to our being in submission and accountability to our brothers and sisters.

i think a perception that we often carry is that it's probably okay to approach those who are openly, outwardly, living a sinful lifestyle that we all recognize in it's obvious appearance, but you'd better not address my "respectable sin issue".

oh, i didn't mean it like that. i think i'm misunderstood
you don't know me all that well
i'm going through a very hard time, so you can't hold that behavior against me
i understand you are telling me i come off that way in most all communication. but that's not what i think.
what makes you stnk you are in a position to suggest that i need to work on something?
i think you just think that because i constantly discuss it, joke about it, and perseverate on it
i don't think there is an issue in my life. God knows me best and He'll tell me if there is a problem.

those above are some of the things i've heard in the past. and i'd say most conversations designed to express loving concern don't make it that far because the defensive posture quickly comes. as a result, regardless of how close i am with someone, i am very, very slow to express concern. because i have discovered that most people don't really want you to shatter their perceptions and fragile constructions. and most people are really irritated when you're perceptive enough to bring something to them that might feel "too close to home".

and by the way, i'm referring to those conversations that are lovingly, painfully prepared for, not with strangers but folks who God has placed on your heart and approach softly, motivated by authentic, respectful love.

something that says, "i love you" and "this isn't to condemn you, but to say that i have real concern for you".

this is something i really, really struggle with a lot. i know amazing, loving sisters and brothers whom i work hard to be open and vulnerable to. but in reality, for all my courage and strength of conviction, i'd sooner eat a worm sandwich than have a loving conversation with most of them about approaching them and something observed and concerned about.

ironically, i have worked SO hard to be open to feedback and criticism. of course there is often a bit of a sting, but that never hurts as much as the thought that it's something that i might have missed out hearing.

the last times i've gotten some feedback, sure, there might be a real sting for a moment. but when i can tell it's from a loving place, i love that they're willing to say it. it feels loving to me that someone is showing such courage and respect for what they feel is for my benefit and growth. i guess this remains as a reminder that the examined, open, and "accountable to another" life isn't for the faint of heart. : )

 

[gypsygirl]

grrrrr... third paragraph editing goof! first line of third paragraph should be:

think of it this way: what if someone asked for prayer to provide for the family borne of sinful behavior but has been repented of, and resolved?

please strike the rest of the 3rd paragraph following the above line. sorry folks.

 

[gypsygirl]

First, how do you know the sin hasn't been addressed?

How close are you to the man who has asked for prayer?

How are you going to approach the man about the sin?

If you're absolutely sure they're living together, are you sure they're sleeping together? Because it's not a sin for an unmarried couple to live together. It simply presents an appearance of evil.

Here's my point. With something like this, unless you're a fixture in this man's life, unless he knows you love him, I wouldn't pull the "I'm an elder Christian who's doing everything right card.". And whether or not that's how you mean it, that's how he's going to take it. If he's living with his girl, he's a noob. You have to consider this generation and the chip on their shoulder. You also have to consider that the church is basically mirroring the world.

I have been a Christian for 14 years, and I grew up in church to boot. So that's 34 years of being around the body of Christ. To this day, unless you're the pastor, if you don't have some sort of place in my life, you can say what you want, but don't be surprised when I shine you on. And if you bring up some sin you think I committed, but that I wasn't talking to you about... yeah, that's not going to go over well.

i love what you said that i bolded (and made red). i personally think the "i'm' the older/mature christian" bit is a pretty precarious step to take. i've seen newer christians show real maturity in some ways, and older christians pull some pretty juvenile stuff.

in fact, i don't want my "years as a christian" to be the reason someone listens to me. i want it to be because i clearly have concern and love for them. because i took the time to get to know their situation before i became alarmed at the scenario, and because i prayed about it and made the effort to take the time to privately, lovingly, respectfully approach them as well as offer to help them in any way if i can be of assistance.

well, that and the fact there is actual biblical basis for my concern. : )

p.s. very good thread idea, hoss. : )

 

[Oncefallen]

grrrrr... third paragraph editing goof! first line of third paragraph should be:

think of it this way: what if someone asked for prayer to provide for the family borne of sinful behavior but has been repented of, and resolved?

please strike the rest of the 3rd paragraph following the above line. sorry folks.

I think I fixed it for ya, or then maybe I messed it up worse.

 

[gypsygirl]

thanks oncefallen! you make this crazy-fast-impatiently-mind-flying-way-too-fast chick very grateful. : )

besides, who doesn't need a little adventure when they're reading??? ; p

 

[ServantStrike]

thanks oncefallen! you make this crazy-fast-impatiently-mind-flying-way-too-fast chick very grateful. : )

besides, who doesn't need a little adventure when they're reading??? ; p

That may be sig worthy.

 

[Lynx]

To answer the OP I would have to say it depends on whether the guy's problem he needs prayer for is a direct result of the sin he's doing. Will praying about it do any good?

See, I can fix a computer. But if you run a Windows computer online without an antivirus I'm not going to fix it every time you get a virus. My friend Motorhead Mike probably won't help me with my car if I neglect simple things like oil changes.

Praying about the problem is basically you asking a friend (God) to help another friend with his problem. But if the guy's problem is a direct result of ignoring the advice God already gave us (advice He gave us specifically BECAUSE He wanted us to avoid that problem) praying God will help with the bad end result will probably not have any result. In that case I would (tactfully, I hope) suggest maybe my friend should change the cause so the effect will change.

Of course if the prayer request has nothing to do with stuff that resulted from the friend's sin, ignore everything I just said.