The Gospel and the LGBTQ+ Community

[Rachel20]

*** We had an intercession class at church about the LGBTQ+ community and how to address the issues that Christians might come across as they deal with them. I am making this thread here to share notes and hopefully facilitate ideas that could be exchanged to enable us to be more compassionate, sensitive and bold to spread the gospel of Christ. ***


Our pastor first talked about his interactions with the people from the community and spoke about the general fear & distrust that most of them had of the church. He then shared personal testimonies, one of which was on a friend of his, who after living a gay lifestyle for a long period of time decided to surrender that to Christ. His friend still dealt with same sex attraction (SSA) but acknowledged that Christ was the biggest gain.

We also saw a video of Rosaria Butterfield, where she talked about the simple, non reactionary openness of a Christian pastor (Ken Smith) that led her to Christ.

So there were three points that he laid out -

1. As a church and a body of believers, we must be willing to open our hearts and homes to those who are different from us.
We might have to restructure the way we think of others. Non reactionary, open, compassionate and sensitive friends are what people look for.

2. That the gospel of Jesus Christ has laid out a cost that each of us have to accept. It's not easy to follow Christ. Whether it is giving up a gay lifestyle or any other form of sexual sin, everyone has different struggles.
It's not easy for someone to leave behind SSA or live with it as they follow Christ, especially in a society where media, science and peers ask people to "embrace" their "authenticity".

3. Churches need to focus a lot more on single Christians. Our culture has a warped view of romantic love where so much of expectation is placed on having a relationship with another person as well as sex. Singleness and its beauty should be embraced.

Our pastor also discussed our stance on homosexuality - that the Bible clearly is against it and it was not part of God's design for His people. We spent some time reading verses on homosexuality and what the Bible has said about it as well as the possible stance of Jesus on them. We discussed Christian views that were pro homosexuality and how it weighs against the Bible. (to us it doesn't.)

Common discussions on this - contrasting monogamous, loving respectful gay unions to Roman practices of exploitation which they reason as to what was actually condemned by Apostle Paul. However our pastor brought out various gay unions that have been mentioned in history as analogous to the gay couples of today.

That was in a summary what our discussion at our Church group was. I hope this helps someone.

God bless.

 

[Willie-T]

Sounds like you are saying they have to change, but at the same time I'm hearing you say that it is OK to remain that way.

Maybe I got the message wrong because I prefer to speak openly and directly...... without the sugar-coating.

 

[Miri]

Homosexuality isn't just about sexual preference.
Its a whole culture and lifestyle of its own, where people go, how they walk, talk,
think, mannerisms, language, gay nightclubs, gay bars, etc.

I have a cousin who is gay (he would make a lovely Christian he is one of the most generous
people in both his time, skills etc you would ever meet). So when someone who is
homosexual becomes a Christian, it requires a breaking of something in their lives, setting
free from that whole lifestyle and culture.

But there again the same would apply to a straight person who was a gang member and drug
addict. There would have to be a breaking of those chains in either case.

I think this is one of the reasons why it's not possible to actively practice homosexuality and
be a Christian at the same time. Being born again means a new way of doing things and seeing
things for everyone. But many homosexuals seem to think they can be born again and still be the
same. That's not possoble for anyone whether straight or gay, there has to be change, there has
to be a new creation.

For some people the change is practically overnight, for others it takes working at and
understanding, refining and moulding.

If a gay person recognises their need for a Saviour and genuinely is born again, then they will
want to do the right thing they will become more sin conscious. That might mean becoming
celebate if they cannot deal with homosexual desires. But there's nothing special about that,
there are plenty of single straight people who are celebate (taking a phrase from the other thread).

The church does not need to treat homosexuals any different to a non Christian.
Both are in sin, both need to hear the gospel, both need saving, both need to be new creations.

 

[Rachel20]

Common discussions on this - contrasting monogamous, loving respectful gay unions to Roman practices of exploitation which they reason as to what was actually condemned by Apostle Paul. However our pastor brought out various gay unions that have been mentioned in history as analogous to the gay couples of today.

I would like to clarify that rather than discussion, the right term would be counter arguments to the stance that "Bible condemns homosexuality."

Our group discussed various other Christian views that are supportive of homosexuality and makes claims that the Apostle Paul did not know of 'loving gay unions.'

The point that our pastor was trying to refute was that even if gay couples had more charity, love and respect than a heterosexual union it did not take away the fact that the Bible doesn't approve of it.

To further his point, our pastor pointed out to 1 Corinthians 5, where Paul calls out the illicit behavior of a man sleeping with his step mother. There were no questions on the nature of the relationship - whether it was loving or respectful.

From a personal front, my goal is to strive to be more compassionate and understanding of the people around me. As society has moved to a place where acceptance of homosexuality is the norm and more and more people have begun identifying on a wide spectrum of sexual orientations, I want to be able to reach out to people in a friendly and open manner to reflect Christ.

Ignorance and insensitivity might put off people rather than encourage them to the love of God.

I also disagree that the church doesn't have to do anything. As members of the body of Christ we are all at different places and stages of growth with different functions.
We may all come to Christ with a cost, that I do accept. When we are born again, we are new creatures and the old must go.

The church has a responsibility towards those who are broken, suffering and disheartened. Would you treat a cancer patient the same way you treat someone with a common cold?

Not that this is analogous to any of the things that people are going through but it definitely is important that there are people who are equipped to understand the various struggles that different people go through.

I have no idea how that is "sugar coating"? Maybe some of you would like to go the picketing funerals way?

Anyway, thanks for reading so far. Cheers & God bless.

 

[Miri]

Just a few musings.

If someone was a homosexual and went to your church, how would you know of their sexual orentiation.
Most would not announce it as they stepped through the door.

Just asking because a while back, a young woman came to our church with a background of
drugs, prostitution etc. She became a Christian, but several months down the line she
confessed she was still prostituing herself and asked for help to over come this.
The church arranged for her to go on a teen challenge rehab placement. Myself and one
other suspected she was still having issues but we chose not to say anything and pray
for her, at least she was coming to church in the meantime and seeing a different culture
and way of life. But as I say it worked out in the end, she asked for help herself.

If a gay person walked into your church you might not know, in fact if a murderer, druggie,
thief, bank robber, depressed person, party girl, or any one for that matter walked into
your church with a past or issues of any kind. How would you know? They might not want to
tell you.

People don't usually shout their misdemeanours from the roof top. That's why I think gay
people should be treated the same as straight people if they are sincere in wanting to know God.
Their sexual preferences are no one else's business except between them and God. Unless they
decide to make it public and make a big song and dance out if it. (See comments further below
about this). A straight person for example, wouldn't turn up at church saying hello I'm a newbie
by the way I've been divorced twice, had 7 sexual partners and I'm sleeping with two people at the
same time. So why expect gay people to announce their sexuality and want special consideration.

By they way my gay cousin has actually attended church a handful of times, only I knew
of his sexual orientation it was between him and God. He didn't expect people to be extra sensative
to him, or give him special attention. It was the last thing he wanted.

For all any of us know, we could be sat next to a seven times biggimist in church. Or someone
who has a different partner every week.

There is another possible scenerio. One where someone who isn't sincere and just wants
to stir things up, turns up at church, announces they are gay and challenges the church to
accept them for who they are, and who takes offence if people disagree with their lifestyle.
This does happen on CC - we call them trolls, but there are real life trolls too.

 

[Willie-T]

I would like to clarify that rather than discussion, the right term would be counter arguments to the stance that "Bible condemns homosexuality."

Our group discussed various other Christian views that are supportive of homosexuality and makes claims that the Apostle Paul did not know of 'loving gay unions.'

The point that our pastor was trying to refute was that even if gay couples had more charity, love and respect than a heterosexual union it did not take away the fact that the Bible doesn't approve of it.

To further his point, our pastor pointed out to 1 Corinthians 5, where Paul calls out the illicit behavior of a man sleeping with his step mother. There were no questions on the nature of the relationship - whether it was loving or respectful.

From a personal front, my goal is to strive to be more compassionate and understanding of the people around me. As society has moved to a place where acceptance of homosexuality is the norm and more and more people have begun identifying on a wide spectrum of sexual orientations, I want to be able to reach out to people in a friendly and open manner to reflect Christ.

Ignorance and insensitivity might put off people rather than encourage them to the love of God.

I also disagree that the church doesn't have to do anything. As members of the body of Christ we are all at different places and stages of growth with different functions.
We may all come to Christ with a cost, that I do accept. When we are born again, we are new creatures and the old must go.

The church has a responsibility towards those who are broken, suffering and disheartened. Would you treat a cancer patient the same way you treat someone with a common cold?

Not that this is analogous to any of the things that people are going through but it definitely is important that there are people who are equipped to understand the various struggles that different people go through.

I have no idea how that is "sugar coating"? Maybe some of you would like to go the picketing funerals way?

Anyway, thanks for reading so far. Cheers & God bless.

Much clearer. Thank you.

 

[zeroturbulence]

I would like to clarify that rather than discussion, the right term would be counter arguments to the stance that "Bible condemns homosexuality."

Our group discussed various other Christian views that are supportive of homosexuality and makes claims that the Apostle Paul did not know of 'loving gay unions.'

The point that our pastor was trying to refute was that even if gay couples had more charity, love and respect than a heterosexual union it did not take away the fact that the Bible doesn't approve of it.

To further his point, our pastor pointed out to 1 Corinthians 5, where Paul calls out the illicit behavior of a man sleeping with his step mother. There were no questions on the nature of the relationship - whether it was loving or respectful.

From a personal front, my goal is to strive to be more compassionate and understanding of the people around me. As society has moved to a place where acceptance of homosexuality is the norm and more and more people have begun identifying on a wide spectrum of sexual orientations, I want to be able to reach out to people in a friendly and open manner to reflect Christ.

Ignorance and insensitivity might put off people rather than encourage them to the love of God.

I also disagree that the church doesn't have to do anything. As members of the body of Christ we are all at different places and stages of growth with different functions.
We may all come to Christ with a cost, that I do accept. When we are born again, we are new creatures and the old must go.

The church has a responsibility towards those who are broken, suffering and disheartened. Would you treat a cancer patient the same way you treat someone with a common cold?

Not that this is analogous to any of the things that people are going through but it definitely is important that there are people who are equipped to understand the various struggles that different people go through.

I have no idea how that is "sugar coating"? Maybe some of you would like to go the picketing funerals way?

Anyway, thanks for reading so far. Cheers & God bless.

I agree!

sneaks out before the verbal melee begins....