Marrying Well: The Broken Man Syndrome

[Jullianna]

Originally Posted by kayem77

No, I'm not saying that christian men are boring....that was not my point at all. Yes, I think some people take for granted their relationship with Christ, especially if that's all they have known all of their lives, but I'm not by any means saying this is ALWAYS the case since I have friends who were raised christian and they aren't boring (well maybe yes accoding to the world ). This is how I see it :

1.You can be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke nor drink, and is considered a nice person. Nevertheless, your faith doesn't move you to give more of you to God, you are therefore in what I call ''the comfort zone'' (or not being led by the Spirit) and you don't even notice. Your life is about not gettin out of that comfort zone.

2.You can be a person who was not raised in a christian family BUT you have good values, help your friends, do well in school, has fun in a healthy way and is considered a good friend and a nice person. Nevertheless, you don't believe in God or you just don't care much about it. Your life is about being succesful and being happy with what you have.

3.You can also be a person who WAS NOT raised in a christian family, used to drink or smoke or both, went to parties, had the wrong friends, behaved the wrong way, and was considered ...not a nice guy or girl. Nevertheless, you are now a born-again christian who loves the Lord and having known what being lost is you don't want ANYTHING to do with your past life. Your life is about Christ now.

4.You can also be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke or drink, and is considered a nice person. This person does so because he understands how blessed he is to have lived close to God all his life and he doesn't want to change that. This person wants to do more for God and his life is about Christ and his relationship with him.

Now this is MY opinion : for me from these 4 groups of people #1 and #2 are the same, and #3 and #4 are the same. I think that you always make a choice, wheter you were raised christian or not, In my previous post I was assuming that the new guy at church was actually a christian who bears fruit, not just someone who started to go to church. If a God-fearing woman chooses him over guy #1, I think it's totally great.
Maybe the reason why some of the new believers show so much passion is because of this:
“I tell you, her sins—and they are many—have been forgiven, so she has shown me much love. But a person who is forgiven little shows only little love.” Luke 7: 36.47 (Jesus anointed by a sinful woman)

Everyone can lose their ''luster'' if they don't mantain their relationship with Christ, so I agree with you on that.

One of the best posts I've read in a long time, Karla *hugs* Nothing I can add to this.


" Take Han Solo for instance, kind of a reformed 'bad guy.' All of the qualities that made him a scoundrel also serve to make him an excellent good guy. In essence he's pretty much the opposite of C-3PO who never does anything wrong but also never wants to get his hands dirty or go anywhere. "

Liamson: Excellent, my friend. Fun way to enforce the Luke 7 scripture Karla posted.

Sometimes I really don't want to post, just read. Loving this thread.

[Cheekygrin]

Originally Posted by Jullianna

" Take Han Solo for instance, kind of a reformed 'bad guy.' All of the qualities that made him a scoundrel also serve to make him an excellent good guy. In essence he's pretty much the opposite of C-3PO who never does anything wrong but also never wants to get his hands dirty or go anywhere. "

Perfect analogy from Star Wars. However, I would still never date a guy. Or a robot.
Only princesses for me.

Originally Posted by Jullianna

It is not the bad boy or a christian version thereof that girls are attracted to, it's the testosterone and confidence. It's the guy who knows who he is, knows how best to showcase his most attractive attributes in a non-arrogant/approachable way, knows how to engage a girl in comfortable (not awkward) conversation and in a way that leaves a young lady feeling good about herself, whether he has walked with the Lord all of his life or not.

Thanks

[Jullianna]

You're welcome

[alienx7587]

Originally Posted by kayem77

No, I'm not saying that christian men are boring....that was not my point at all. Yes, I think some people take for granted their relationship with Christ, especially if that's all they have known all of their lives, but I'm not by any means saying this is ALWAYS the case since I have friends who were raised christian and they aren't boring (well maybe yes accoding to the world ). This is how I see it :

1.You can be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke nor drink, and is considered a nice person. Nevertheless, your faith doesn't move you to give more of you to God, you are therefore in what I call ''the comfort zone'' (or not being led by the Spirit) and you don't even notice. Your life is about not gettin out of that comfort zone.

2.You can be a person who was not raised in a christian family BUT you have good values, help your friends, do well in school, has fun in a healthy way and is considered a good friend and a nice person. Nevertheless, you don't believe in God or you just don't care much about it. Your life is about being succesful and being happy with what you have.

3.You can also be a person who WAS NOT raised in a christian family, used to drink or smoke or both, went to parties, had the wrong friends, behaved the wrong way, and was considered ...not a nice guy or girl. Nevertheless, you are now a born-again christian who loves the Lord and having known what being lost is you don't want ANYTHING to do with your past life. Your life is about Christ now.

4.You can also be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke or drink, and is considered a nice person. This person does so because he understands how blessed he is to have lived close to God all his life and he doesn't want to change that. This person wants to do more for God and his life is about Christ and his relationship with him.

Now this is MY opinion : for me from these 4 groups of people #1 and #2 are the same, and #3 and #4 are the same. I think that you always make a choice, wheter you were raised christian or not, In my previous post I was assuming that the new guy at church was actually a christian who bears fruit, not just someone who started to go to church. If a God-fearing woman chooses him over guy #1, I think it's totally great.
Maybe the reason why some of the new believers show so much passion is because of this:
“I tell you, her sins—and they are many—have been forgiven, so she has shown me much love. But a person who is forgiven little shows only little love.” Luke 7: 36.47 (Jesus anointed by a sinful woman)

Everyone can lose their ''luster'' if they don't mantain their relationship with Christ, so I agree with you on that.

Very nice post. I think I understand here you're coming from now. So what are your thoughts on the questions posed in Post #9?

[zeroturbulence]

Originally Posted by alienx7587

I understand what you're saying. However, you're seemingly placing me at the pinnacle of the argument/topic rather than giving your thoughts about the topic itself. How many times do I have to reiterate that I'm not bitter toward nor condemning women? Did you even read the Disclaimer?

Yes I read the disclaimer, but then I read your post and its pretty clear to me that this is some sort of rant with a lot of thought put into it. No offense, but the points you are trying to make sound just like the type of things that guys rant about after being jilted (women need to be more respectful, etc...). You say its not a rant in a couple of places, but if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...

Anyway, I really don't care if its a rant or not. I saw a guy who seemed bitter and was just trying to help him out.

[kayem77]

Originally Posted by Jullianna

One of the best posts I've read in a long time, Karla *hugs* Nothing I can add to this.

Hugs back*

[kayem77]

Originally Posted by alienx7587

Very nice post. I think I understand here you're coming from now. So what are your thoughts on the questions posed in Post #9?

These questions?

Originally Posted by alienx7587

I may be digging myself a hole, but let's run with this for a moment.


1) It's important not to get into intimate conversation with an individual too soon after you being dating. It's equally important not to have deep and intimate conversations before you start dating. That being said, what if the men (or "some" men since I'll be hanged for generalizing) had committed sins so sinister they could not immediately confess to you? Are you saying it would be easier to talk with them if you knew about their sin? If so, how and when would you expect them to tell you about it?


If your church is anything like mine, there always those people who you see on Sunday yet have no idea what they're up to Monday-Saturday.


2) Paul states to the people of Corinth that Christians should be equally yoked. Most Christians take this to mean "a Christian can only marry another Christian". This is only partially true. What this passage really means (and I've spoken in depth about this with a doctor of theology) in terms of romantic relationships is that as Christians, we should be building relationships with people who are at or about the same spiritual maturity as us, so we can help one another grow in Christ and not be "stumbling blocks" (v.3) to one another. Do you believe a young woman, who has been part of the church her whole life (never leaving) is equally yoked when she begins a path of courtship with a newly found Christian man who had spent part of his life indulging in or "battling" sin? The best way to battle sin is to battle it as part of the church, there's safety in numbers.

I would respond with the same answers I think....
1. How would I know about their sin? I don't think anyone walks around with a sign in their heads that says ''I was out in the world and I sinned'' so I don't know how would you know at first sight if that person was raised at church. I don't expect anyone to confess their sins to me unless we have a relationship and that sin is somehow related to me or it's something that somehow marked him.
If I'm in a relationship with a man I think it's natural that we talk and get to know each other's past, if he has a sinister past, depending on what it is and how he is NOW, I think we would decide what's best for us....

2.I agree that it's best to be in a relationship with someone who is at the same spiritual maturity as us...but sometimes a christian can be at church for 10 years and learn nothing, so I think I can answer this question with my previous post.

I think these questions also depend on what your pesonal interests are...if you think you can handle someone's past that's fine, if you can't just dont get into a relationship with that person or else you will make him/her feel guilty and you will feel insecure and unhappy.

[alienx7587]

Originally Posted by zeroturbulence

Yes I read the disclaimer, but then I read your post and its pretty clear to me that this is some sort of rant with a lot of thought put into it. No offense, but the points you are trying to make sound just like the type of things that guys rant about after being jilted (women need to be more respectful, etc...). You say its not a rant in a couple of places, but if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...

Anyway, I really don't care if its a rant or not. I saw a guy who seemed bitter and was just trying to help him out.

Ok well, to each his own I guess. Agree to disagree.

Originally Posted by kayem77

These questions?



I would respond with the same answers I think....
1. How would I know about their sin? I don't think anyone walks around with a sign in their heads that says ''I was out in the world and I sinned'' so I don't know how would you know at first sight if that person was raised at church. I don't expect anyone to confess their sins to me unless we have a relationship and that sin is somehow related to me or it's something that somehow marked him.
If I'm in a relationship with a man I think it's natural that we talk and get to know each other's past, if he has a sinister past, depending on what it is and how he is NOW, I think we would decide what's best for us....

2.I agree that it's best to be in a relationship with someone who is at the same spiritual maturity as us...but sometimes a christian can be at church for 10 years and learn nothing, so I think I can answer this question with my previous post.

I think these questions also depend on what your pesonal interests are...if you think you can handle someone's past that's fine, if you can't just dont get into a relationship with that person or else you will make him/her feel guilty and you will feel insecure and unhappy.

Thanks for your thoughts, Kayem!

[kayem77]

Thank you for this interesting thread God bless

[PopClick]

I'm only going to pick two points here, Alien:

Originally Posted by alienx7587

The Fix-it-Up Factor- OK, this one is widely speculated amongst Christian men. Basically, women like ,no, love a man they feel they can change. Especially if it has to do with changing mannerisms, etiquette or a general change of heart. Again, Bad Boy Syndrome?
Girls who want a "bad boy" don't want to "fix him up", they want him because it's all wrong and they know it... but it's still appealing for some reason.
It's important not to get into intimate conversation with an individual too soon after you being dating. It's equally important not to have deep and intimate conversations before you start dating.
I'm not going to say too much about this, because we may have a different definition of "deep and intimate". But according to my definition, I wouldn't date somebody if I had not yet had a deep conversation with him.

Originally Posted by Liamson

As a man I know that I find a woman who has seen the Darkside and chosen to return to the light of much greater value than one who has never been tested.

I'm sure you know that just because they haven't strayed, it doesn't mean they haven't been tested.

Originally Posted by kayem77

No, I'm not saying that christian men are boring....that was not my point at all. Yes, I think some people take for granted their relationship with Christ, especially if that's all they have known all of their lives, but I'm not by any means saying this is ALWAYS the case since I have friends who were raised christian and they aren't boring (well maybe yes accoding to the world ). This is how I see it :

1.You can be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke nor drink, and is considered a nice person. Nevertheless, your faith doesn't move you to give more of you to God, you are therefore in what I call ''the comfort zone'' (or not being led by the Spirit) and you don't even notice. Your life is about not gettin out of that comfort zone.

2.You can be a person who was not raised in a christian family BUT you have good values, help your friends, do well in school, has fun in a healthy way and is considered a good friend and a nice person. Nevertheless, you don't believe in God or you just don't care much about it. Your life is about being succesful and being happy with what you have.

3.You can also be a person who WAS NOT raised in a christian family, used to drink or smoke or both, went to parties, had the wrong friends, behaved the wrong way, and was considered ...not a nice guy or girl. Nevertheless, you are now a born-again christian who loves the Lord and having known what being lost is you don't want ANYTHING to do with your past life. Your life is about Christ now.

4.You can also be a person raised in a christian family who has christian values, goes to church, has christian friends, don't smoke or drink, and is considered a nice person. This person does so because he understands how blessed he is to have lived close to God all his life and he doesn't want to change that. This person wants to do more for God and his life is about Christ and his relationship with him.

Now this is MY opinion : for me from these 4 groups of people #1 and #2 are the same, and #3 and #4 are the same. I think that you always make a choice, wheter you were raised christian or not, In my previous post I was assuming that the new guy at church was actually a christian who bears fruit, not just someone who started to go to church. If a God-fearing woman chooses him over guy #1, I think it's totally great.
Maybe the reason why some of the new believers show so much passion is because of this:
“I tell you, her sins—and they are many—have been forgiven, so she has shown me much love. But a person who is forgiven little shows only little love.” Luke 7: 36.47 (Jesus anointed by a sinful woman)

Everyone can lose their ''luster'' if they don't mantain their relationship with Christ, so I agree with you on that.

Well, now I want to hug kayem77, too... looks like I'll have to get in line

[zeroturbulence]

Originally Posted by alienx7587

Ok well, to each his own I guess. Agree to disagree.

Ok then, if you say its not a rant then its not a rant. My apologies.