-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Hi, firew.!
I have learnt from the birds ONE big thing: A male often leds... Sometimes she can lead too but, personally, I have seen then if she doesn´t follow, she doesn´t need a leader (it can be seem in her school, her friends, her own house and family).
I just imagined if a woman had killed Goliath, instead. Let´s imagine someone said: Samson "died" because of whom he saw... That´s not fair, i guess.
Each time I saw Jezabel´s "leading" evil spirit, I surely ran.
I have learnt from the birds ONE big thing: A male often leds... Sometimes she can lead too but, personally, I have seen then if she doesn´t follow, she doesn´t need a leader (it can be seem in her school, her friends, her own house and family).
I just imagined if a woman had killed Goliath, instead. Let´s imagine someone said: Samson "died" because of whom he saw... That´s not fair, i guess.
Each time I saw Jezabel´s "leading" evil spirit, I surely ran.
Now i know why priest were "ordered" to marry virgin ladies...
Lev_21:14 He must not marry a woman who has had sexual relations with any man. He must not marry a prostitute, a divorced woman, or a widow. The high priest must marry a virgin from his own people.
Eze_44:22 The priests must not marry a widow or a divorced woman. No, they must only marry a virgin from the family of Israel or a woman whose dead husband was a priest.
That was one way to be "safe" (they knew it)
Lev_21:14 He must not marry a woman who has had sexual relations with any man. He must not marry a prostitute, a divorced woman, or a widow. The high priest must marry a virgin from his own people.
Eze_44:22 The priests must not marry a widow or a divorced woman. No, they must only marry a virgin from the family of Israel or a woman whose dead husband was a priest.
That was one way to be "safe" (they knew it)
L
i thought the original post sort of interesting, but have to say i agree with what cinder has said.
i think it would only be fair to have something posted by the OP that would present some insights about mistakes that some males also make, in this day and age, instead of the arguments being lopsided and pretty much totally directed at women.
i think it would only be fair to have something posted by the OP that would present some insights about mistakes that some males also make, in this day and age, instead of the arguments being lopsided and pretty much totally directed at women.
I wish, for being sure (not assured) I knew that´s the leadership ladies talked about. My 1st hand experience is not the best I could have kept but, I rather read on other´s ideas, like these:
10 Types of Christian Leadership by David Murray – Church Life
These were taken from a copy-paste idea on leading styles:
"LEADERSHIP STYLES
There are many types of leadership styles. I will delve into some and compare them to each other and
see which ones are workable in the church setting.
a) Dictatorial type of leadership
This is a master-servant type of leadership. What the master says is what goes and is final. The leader
has absolute power. He leads by fear, intimidation and manipulation. He is usually a power drunkard.
This type of leadership has failed wherever it has been used. The leader becomes unpopular thereby
attracting uproars to oust them from office. This in a political set-up or church it always breeds
uprisings. And once the people move in that dimension they are labeled rebellious. Serious casualties
follow the debacle. It is not the best trend in leading the people.
Examples of dictators in the Bible are:
I) Nimrod- he was very arrogant, Genesis 10:8-9.
ii) Nebuchadnezzar, Daniel 2:1-13; 3:1-4:33.
iii) The Caesar, he chased Jews from Rome, Acts18:2.
Sometimes the church has been faced with dictatorial tendencies by their leadership in the name of
spiritual parenting even when it is clear they are abusing their authority. They apply military style when
it comes to their leadership style. This type of leadership makes a leader not answerable to his/her own
people. In short there's no accountability. They end up with people rebelling, church splits, and etc, etc.
Many hunger for control and power which becomes autonomous and makes those under them start
feeling abused, unloved, and marginalized. When the devil sees that loop-hole he capitalizes on it and
brings disharmony and hinders church growth because hurts out-weigh the love side of the kingdom.
b) Laissez-fa-ire type of leadership
This one is where the leader leads by being care-free. Meaning he lets issues handle themselves without
him initiating solutions, saying, “Things solve by themselves.” The leader does not take the lead in his
role. The people following him/her are given the free reign to do what they desire. And the other thing
is that they have no time to develop their people. This is a leader who is afraid of confrontations, facing
issues head on and staying put is the only thing he would settle for. This type of leadership is another
worst kind because no issue solves by itself especially when it requires the leader's attention. This
leader abdicates his/her responsibilities by not taking his position to attend to his/her functions. The
leader fails to lead and, therefore, leadership roles are taken by those who are to be led by default.
When the leadership role is taken over by the led ones, there begins a move of anarchy, confusion, inorderly
manner, and no much progress. Once prolonged, casualties take place.
EXAMPLES OF LAISSEZ-FA-IRE LEADERSHIP
a) Eli could not handle his sons` sinful life. And he had to pay for it. 1Samuel 3- 4.
b) Adam allowed this flow to take place in his life in the garden when he could not stop the wife being
entertained by the serpent about the fruit of the tree. We know the story, man fell. Genesis3.
c) David made a similar mistake when he could not do anything when his daughter, Tamar, was raped
by her half brother. Instead, Absalom took upon himself to do something, and it ended up disastrous.
2 Samuel 13:20-39. Isaiah 3:12.
c) Democratic type of leadership
This is leadership embracing the thought that people must be involved in decision making by using the
power to vote. It is taken as government of the people, for the people, by the people and through the
people. The Western world has been promoting this type of governance in the nations of the world. The
church has somehow adopted the element of democracy due to many issues of human rights. This type
of leadership has its own pros and cons. Democracy originates from the Greek theory."
Which of this are best for EACH home built? I keep on learning, not every "home" is the same (not all churches are alike).
10 Types of Christian Leadership by David Murray – Church Life
These were taken from a copy-paste idea on leading styles:
"LEADERSHIP STYLES
There are many types of leadership styles. I will delve into some and compare them to each other and
see which ones are workable in the church setting.
a) Dictatorial type of leadership
This is a master-servant type of leadership. What the master says is what goes and is final. The leader
has absolute power. He leads by fear, intimidation and manipulation. He is usually a power drunkard.
This type of leadership has failed wherever it has been used. The leader becomes unpopular thereby
attracting uproars to oust them from office. This in a political set-up or church it always breeds
uprisings. And once the people move in that dimension they are labeled rebellious. Serious casualties
follow the debacle. It is not the best trend in leading the people.
Examples of dictators in the Bible are:
I) Nimrod- he was very arrogant, Genesis 10:8-9.
ii) Nebuchadnezzar, Daniel 2:1-13; 3:1-4:33.
iii) The Caesar, he chased Jews from Rome, Acts18:2.
Sometimes the church has been faced with dictatorial tendencies by their leadership in the name of
spiritual parenting even when it is clear they are abusing their authority. They apply military style when
it comes to their leadership style. This type of leadership makes a leader not answerable to his/her own
people. In short there's no accountability. They end up with people rebelling, church splits, and etc, etc.
Many hunger for control and power which becomes autonomous and makes those under them start
feeling abused, unloved, and marginalized. When the devil sees that loop-hole he capitalizes on it and
brings disharmony and hinders church growth because hurts out-weigh the love side of the kingdom.
b) Laissez-fa-ire type of leadership
This one is where the leader leads by being care-free. Meaning he lets issues handle themselves without
him initiating solutions, saying, “Things solve by themselves.” The leader does not take the lead in his
role. The people following him/her are given the free reign to do what they desire. And the other thing
is that they have no time to develop their people. This is a leader who is afraid of confrontations, facing
issues head on and staying put is the only thing he would settle for. This type of leadership is another
worst kind because no issue solves by itself especially when it requires the leader's attention. This
leader abdicates his/her responsibilities by not taking his position to attend to his/her functions. The
leader fails to lead and, therefore, leadership roles are taken by those who are to be led by default.
When the leadership role is taken over by the led ones, there begins a move of anarchy, confusion, inorderly
manner, and no much progress. Once prolonged, casualties take place.
EXAMPLES OF LAISSEZ-FA-IRE LEADERSHIP
a) Eli could not handle his sons` sinful life. And he had to pay for it. 1Samuel 3- 4.
b) Adam allowed this flow to take place in his life in the garden when he could not stop the wife being
entertained by the serpent about the fruit of the tree. We know the story, man fell. Genesis3.
c) David made a similar mistake when he could not do anything when his daughter, Tamar, was raped
by her half brother. Instead, Absalom took upon himself to do something, and it ended up disastrous.
2 Samuel 13:20-39. Isaiah 3:12.
c) Democratic type of leadership
This is leadership embracing the thought that people must be involved in decision making by using the
power to vote. It is taken as government of the people, for the people, by the people and through the
people. The Western world has been promoting this type of governance in the nations of the world. The
church has somehow adopted the element of democracy due to many issues of human rights. This type
of leadership has its own pros and cons. Democracy originates from the Greek theory."
Which of this are best for EACH home built? I keep on learning, not every "home" is the same (not all churches are alike).
Last edited:
When a person marry marry together.
When a person divorces, divorces to be separated...
I wondered where the problem is: I am a problem but society or God too?
Somewhere I read:
Gen_2:18 Y dijo Jehová Dios: No es bueno que el hombre esté solo; le haré ayuda idónea para él.
Gen 2:18 Then the LORD God said, "I see that it is not good for the man to be alone. I will make the companion he needs, one just right for him."
PS
If I am a problem, there are more problems to be solved.
When a person divorces, divorces to be separated...
I wondered where the problem is: I am a problem but society or God too?
Somewhere I read:
Gen_2:18 Y dijo Jehová Dios: No es bueno que el hombre esté solo; le haré ayuda idónea para él.
Gen 2:18 Then the LORD God said, "I see that it is not good for the man to be alone. I will make the companion he needs, one just right for him."
PS
If I am a problem, there are more problems to be solved.
F
Which is what I already said. I understand what biblical leadership is and it applies to more than marriage. A man shouldn't have to even declare his right to lead. Women these days want to assume this role due to various influences. A man that doesn't assert his right to lead would likely be weak. Doormat anybody? She made a generalization about women as well which is a no-no around these parts.
You've got a lot to learn my boy!!
You've got a lot to learn my boy!!
You really don't seem to understand it because biblical leadership is synonymous with humility and servanthood. Asserting your "right" (leadership isn't a right, by the way) to lead is rooted in pride, not humility.
"Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves." - Philippians 2:3
"'But it is not this way with you, but the one who is the greatest among you must become like the youngest, and the leader like the servant.'" - Luke 22:26
And there is strength in humility, not weakness.
P.S. If you have to assert your leadership in the first place, you're probably not a good leader. And don't patronize me.
"Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves." - Philippians 2:3
"'But it is not this way with you, but the one who is the greatest among you must become like the youngest, and the leader like the servant.'" - Luke 22:26
And there is strength in humility, not weakness.
P.S. If you have to assert your leadership in the first place, you're probably not a good leader. And don't patronize me.
M
I've been lead by a man who felt the need to assert his "right" to lead...and you know what? I ended up serving him, waiting on him hand and foot, walking on eggshells around him because if his "leadership" was ever questioned (like the tons of times his decision-making left us facing eviction until we eventually ended up living in a tent- where I followed even then), then I wasn't fulfilling my submissive wife role and all hell would break loose.
Asserting yourself as the Boss doesn't make you strong or noble or manly or worthy of being followed- in fact, several infamous dictators come to mind when I think of men "asserting their right to lead".
Marriage shouldn't be a dictatorship where one partner is terrified or bullied or manipulated into following the self-proclaimed leader...women almost always revolt against the men who "lead" in this way.
If a man wants to lead a woman, the best way he can get her to follow is by holding her hand and working alongside her, showing her that they are equals but with different roles to fulfill, and showing that he values her and loves her.
Without having the woman's absolute trust in you and in turn loving her as Christ loves us, you can "assert your right to lead" til the cows come home and you're blue in the face, but you still won't be worth following.
Asserting yourself as the Boss doesn't make you strong or noble or manly or worthy of being followed- in fact, several infamous dictators come to mind when I think of men "asserting their right to lead".
Marriage shouldn't be a dictatorship where one partner is terrified or bullied or manipulated into following the self-proclaimed leader...women almost always revolt against the men who "lead" in this way.
If a man wants to lead a woman, the best way he can get her to follow is by holding her hand and working alongside her, showing her that they are equals but with different roles to fulfill, and showing that he values her and loves her.
Without having the woman's absolute trust in you and in turn loving her as Christ loves us, you can "assert your right to lead" til the cows come home and you're blue in the face, but you still won't be worth following.
It's not a right, it's a responsibility.
When we think of leadership as a right, we are focused on what we are getting.
When we think of leadership as a responsibility, we are focused on serving.
In a marriage, God charges the man with this responsibility. He'd be a fool not to share the responsibility with his wife, seeking her counsel, discussing, weighing her contribution to an important matter. Likewise, a woman would be a fool to try to usurp the leadership role from the man. Reasons for not including the other in important matters may be (but are certainly not limited to) lack of trust, lack of respect, or pride.
BINGO!!
When we think of leadership as a right, we are focused on what we are getting.
When we think of leadership as a responsibility, we are focused on serving.
In a marriage, God charges the man with this responsibility. He'd be a fool not to share the responsibility with his wife, seeking her counsel, discussing, weighing her contribution to an important matter. Likewise, a woman would be a fool to try to usurp the leadership role from the man. Reasons for not including the other in important matters may be (but are certainly not limited to) lack of trust, lack of respect, or pride.
BINGO!!
Last edited:
What I was thinking.
-------------
And to the OP, you quote that women should not be looking for a Proverb's 31 man, but instead should become the Proverb's 31 woman. How about men act like Christ. He gave grace to the humble and judgment to the proud. He served and did not demand to be served. He led by example, not forcing His way on others. To be honest, if men want a mature Godly woman, they need to be acting Holy. And they same goes for women, if we want a Godly man, then we need to act Holy.
-------------
And to the OP, you quote that women should not be looking for a Proverb's 31 man, but instead should become the Proverb's 31 woman. How about men act like Christ. He gave grace to the humble and judgment to the proud. He served and did not demand to be served. He led by example, not forcing His way on others. To be honest, if men want a mature Godly woman, they need to be acting Holy. And they same goes for women, if we want a Godly man, then we need to act Holy.