Feminism, is this just me?

[T_Laurich]

I feel like the feminist movement was won, and I am glad it is... I honestly am: women can vote, have equal salary if they do equal work, and obtain higher education.

However, a few days ago I was watching the news with my little sister and there was a girl wrestling boys in highshool. So I asked her "Do you think she should be allowed to wrestle boys".
My sister said "Why shouldn't she be able to wrestle them, we are equal". And to be honest she seem mad at me even asking her that.
I then said" I don't know about you, but if I was wrestling a girl I would treat her differently because I would have to touch areas that I am not supposed too in order to win. I don't think she should be able to roll around on the ground with a bunch of hormonal boys in the name of equality".
When she didn't answer I said "I don't want to fight I just want to hear your thoughts, and see what you think..."
And she said in a defeated tone"I think your right..."...

It seems to me that feminism has turned from civil rights, and became a Genesis 3 event.

Now, I don't want to sound chauvinistic; however, I am seeing this "psychology" of a war of the sexes much like war of political views and war of races... Am I just culture shocked, and behind the times, or what?

 

[sigh33n]

First things first, no, you're not being chauvinistic. You're handling this with kindness, gentleness, and respect. Secondly, (here's where the controversy comes in) it's of my opinion with the scriptures to back me up that men and woman were created differently and we're just experiencing the effects of the post-modern world when we think we're "behind the times".
The Lord did not make women greater than men, nor is man supposed to reign over women like tyrants. This is to imply that physically, men ARE different and naturally dominant-oriented whereas women are naturally more submissive. There's nothing wrong with this at all, we see differences like this in nature and should expect to see it in man.

I don't have an exact agreement on the wrestling issue, however. I feel that if the parents, school district, and wrestlers themselves are all consenting, then it's their affair to tend to and resolve any issues within but I understand your concern.

 

[Willie-T]

I'm old now, but when I was younger I played Judo. Not a lot of girls in the sport then, but a few. Trust me, after your brains have been rattled a time or two from being slapped down on the mat by a girl, you quickly tend to lose focus about just which gender it is that is causing you this pain.

 

[JFSurvivor]

I feel like the feminist movement was won, and I am glad it is... I honestly am: women can vote, have equal salary if they do equal work, and obtain higher education.

However, a few days ago I was watching the news with my little sister and there was a girl wrestling boys in highshool. So I asked her "Do you think she should be allowed to wrestle boys".
My sister said "Why shouldn't she be able to wrestle them, we are equal". And to be honest she seem mad at me even asking her that.
I then said" I don't know about you, but if I was wrestling a girl I would treat her differently because I would have to touch areas that I am not supposed too in order to win. I don't think she should be able to roll around on the ground with a bunch of hormonal boys in the name of equality".
When she didn't answer I said "I don't want to fight I just want to hear your thoughts, and see what you think..."
And she said in a defeated tone"I think your right..."...

It seems to me that feminism has turned from civil rights, and became a Genesis 3 event.

Now, I don't want to sound chauvinistic; however, I am seeing this "psychology" of a war of the sexes much like war of political views and war of races... Am I just culture shocked, and behind the times, or what?

Well 1) there still is a pay gap. Women do get paid less than men. 2) I kinda agree with you on your view about women and wrestling, I'm on the fence about that because on one hand why shouldn't a woman kick a guys butt but on the other hand you make a good point about the touching in inappropriate areas. So those are my thoughts.

 

[T_Laurich]

I completely disagree with the gender wage gap... This is a myth that has been perpetuated for political gain.

[video=youtube;yNMiTxso4Q0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNMiTxso4Q0[/video]

 

[T_Laurich]

For instance, every job I have ever worked, women have made the same if not more than myself... I have been in road work, fast food, and janitorial services...

 

[JonahLynx]

I completely disagree with the gender wage gap... This is a myth that has been perpetuated for political gain.

The gap is real, even as the video you posted shows. What factors play into creating that gap is debatable - and is the reason most feminists focus on blurring the line between male/female gender roles. If I understand their position correctly, it is less about outright discrimination against women (although this is still a tenet) and more about addressing the perceived societal barriers or demands which lead to women allegedly "working less hours than men," for example. But in terms of strict numbers, women very clearly earn less than men, on average, within the same occupations.

 

[AnnaBou]

Women usually do different jobs to men. They get paid the same for the same job. There are more women nurses than male nurses and more male doctors than women doctors. Doctors get paid more than nurses. Its really because men and women are different that they do different things.
I am not a feminist I think it is stupid for women to want to be the same as men in everything.

 

[JonahLynx]

I'm old now, but when I was younger I played Judo. Not a lot of girls in the sport then, but a few. Trust me, after your brains have been rattled a time or two from being slapped down on the mat by a girl, you quickly tend to lose focus about just which gender it is that is causing you this pain.

Yeah, I practiced Taekwondo and it was very much the same. Once you put on those pads you become competitors and nothing more. It is more respectful to treat all opponents equally and according to skill rather than gender. I haven't known anyone to be bothered by awkward positioning or holds except beginners.

 

[phil38111]

I dont't know if women get paid less than men. I doubt it. But what I will say is I take a statistics class, and have learned it is important not to beleive every statistic you hear. Alot of organizations who fund these statistical studies cheat when getting the statistics so the results will go in their favor, so they can further whatever agenda they have. I personally find it hard to beleive that women get paid less than men for the same jobs TODAY. I'd like to see how they got these results and how they did this study, to see if it should even be taken seriously. As for femenism. Don't know enough about it to really speak on it. Heard alot of negative and positive things about it. Too lazy to research it.

 

[phil38111]

I'm old now, but when I was younger I played Judo. Not a lot of girls in the sport then, but a few. Trust me, after your brains have been rattled a time or two from being slapped down on the mat by a girl, you quickly tend to lose focus about just which gender it is that is causing you this pain.

Yeah as I have done BJJ. But if yall were both at the same skill level meaning had the same amount of training, best beleive you would have dominated the female. Thats the beauty of martial arts though. Through special technique you can take out someone much bigger and stronger than you.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Oh man, you don't me here... lol. For starters equal is not the same thing as "the same thing."

 

[ServantStrike]

I think there may be some confusion about feminism vs women's suffrage.

The right to vote, the right to education - all of that happened before the term feminism was ever coined. It happened as part of the women's suffrage movement.

Feminism was about equal pay. Other issues have been tacked to that particular definition, and now there are those who are redefining it to mean equality for every one - except then it shouldn't be called feminism, it should be called equality.

 

[Test_F_i_2_Luv]

Women usually do different jobs to men. They get paid the same for the same job. There are more women nurses than male nurses and more male doctors than women doctors. Doctors get paid more than nurses. Its really because men and women are different that they do different things.
I am not a feminist I think it is stupid for women to want to be the same as men in everything.

I think you are a feminist, but a good feminist.

Feminists can want equality...like the right to vote, the right to own property, and the right to work.

At the same time, feminism can acknowledge the differences between men and women and acknowledge that, in some cases, men will do better at X while women will do better at Y.

Radical feminism wants equal results even if there is not an equal effort or equal skill. A radical feminist might have a fit that a woman in construction isn't getting equal pay even though she can't lift the same weight as her male co-workers and also wants to take time off while she brings 2-3 babies into the world.

 

[T_Laurich]

jonahlynx
Let's play this out logically and economically...
You own a business, and you have two people applying for a job: they can both do the exact same amount of work in the same amount of time. They are equal...
Now one costs 75 cents a hour, and the other cost $1.00 a hour... Which do you hire?

See if the gender wage gap was real, then you would see that women would be getting hired like hot-cakes... For the same reason that China and Mexico got a lot of manufacturing and production jobs in the last decade.


But we see that unemployment is nearly identical for men and women... In 2014 Men were at 5.5, and women were at 5.4...



Why are companies hiring all these over priced men if they can get a women to do the same job for less?
The answer, is that women do not cost less. And in some cases they are not equal to men such as oilfield or manual labor.

 

[MultilingualMessenger]

I feel like the feminist movement was won, and I am glad it is... I honestly am: women can vote, have equal salary if they do equal work, and obtain higher education.

However, a few days ago I was watching the news with my little sister and there was a girl wrestling boys in highshool. So I asked her "Do you think she should be allowed to wrestle boys".
My sister said "Why shouldn't she be able to wrestle them, we are equal". And to be honest she seem mad at me even asking her that.
I then said" I don't know about you, but if I was wrestling a girl I would treat her differently because I would have to touch areas that I am not supposed too in order to win. I don't think she should be able to roll around on the ground with a bunch of hormonal boys in the name of equality".
When she didn't answer I said "I don't want to fight I just want to hear your thoughts, and see what you think..."
And she said in a defeated tone"I think your right..."...

It seems to me that feminism has turned from civil rights, and became a Genesis 3 event.

Now, I don't want to sound chauvinistic; however, I am seeing this "psychology" of a war of the sexes much like war of political views and war of races... Am I just culture shocked, and behind the times, or what?

I've been the girl on a wrestling team before. Trust me, when you're out there on the mat, you're thinking in competitive terms, not sexual terms. You also know where to grab, and no legal moves require you to grab anyone's chest, crotch, or buttocks (though you may get close). It also goes by weight class so they'd be fairly matched (At least in theory. Sadly enough, nobody was anywhere near my size...).

 

[AnnaBou]

I think you are a feminist, but a good feminist.

Feminists can want equality...like the right to vote, the right to own property, and the right to work.

At the same time, feminism can acknowledge the differences between men and women and acknowledge that, in some cases, men will do better at X while women will do better at Y.

Radical feminism wants equal results even if there is not an equal effort or equal skill. A radical feminist might have a fit that a woman in construction isn't getting equal pay even though she can't lift the same weight as her male co-workers and also wants to take time off while she brings 2-3 babies into the world.

If this was 19thC I might be a feminist. I don't believe in equality. I might say I support the right to vote but I don't need to be a feminist to battle men for the right to vote or own property because that has been done. So what is there to fight about now? Have you heard that there are menimists? They want equality for men. Its right though if you have feminists you have menimists. Feminism has gone way too far. There is a report out that says men who smile at women are nice to women or hold open doors are sexists. To not be sexist you have to treat men and women the same. Feminism denies that because women have babies and so are mothers they are naturally suited to be domestic life while men are hunters, fighters and leaders. If we could ban words like sexism and feminism from the dictionary we would all be better off. Women should be keepers of the home and are better suited to the caring jobs like teaching and nursing. They should not be soldiers, builders, weight lifters.

 

[PoetMary]

If we could ban words like sexism and feminism from the dictionary we would all be better off. Women should be keepers of the home and are better suited to the caring jobs like teaching and nursing. They should not be soldiers, builders, weight lifters.

The idea that women should "keep the home" doesn't address the issue of unmarried women, single mothers, or widows. Should those women be disallowed from certain fields because they're "not suited" to it (which, btw, is bunk). Being "suited" to a job is based on personality, not biology.

And here's a little history: There was a time when women were not allowed to be teachers. The First Wave Feminists (particularly Catherine Beecher, the never-married sister of Harriet Beecher Stowe), advocated for women being allowed to teach as a means of occupation for single women, and because the need for teachers in far-flung pioneer-territory schools was great. The men, who controlled the educational system, allowed women to begin to teach at HALF the price of male teachers. Married women were NOT allowed to teach. When it was realized that money could be saved because women were paid half-salary for the same work, BOOM, education began to become female-dominated.

As a further aside: Studies show that the more female-dominated a field becomes, the overall status and salary-base of the profession lowers.

So what is there to fight about now?

Hmmm...how about female genital mutilation, the lack of access to jobs and education in poorer countries, the lack of basic human rights in Muslim countries, the poor healthcare for women and children. ALL of these are feminist issues.

 

[PoetMary]

It seems to me that feminism has turned from civil rights, and became a Genesis 3 event.

Now, I don't want to sound chauvinistic; however, I am seeing this "psychology" of a war of the sexes much like war of political views and war of races... Am I just culture shocked, and behind the times, or what?

It actually is an ACCESS issue. Despite the efforts of Title IX, female students still lack some of the athletic opportunities afforded to male students. Most large high schools offer far more competitive options for male students than female students. Additionally, funding still favors the males. I know football teams in my part of the U.S. get new uniforms each year, get all the pep-rallys, get more morning announcements, etc., and the female teams wear five-year-old uniforms, get little acclaim, etc.

So, if a female student wants to wrestle, and her school doesn't have a female wrestling team, why shouldn't she be allowed to get into the male arena. The same, btw, is true for young ladies who've played football or hockey on the "boys" teams. This isn't about some young girl wanting to dominate men (Gen 3). This is about a young woman who has a certain skill set and about providing her a venue that allows her to use these skills. If the school had a female wrestling team, it would be a non-issue.

(As an aside, you don't see girls on "boys" teams when there is a female option. For example, you don't see girls being allowed to play basketball on the boys team because most schools have a girls basketball team. Also, I've read articles where boys were allowed to play on traditionally "female" teams because there was no male option--volleyball and field hockey come to mind. And, btw, the article about field hockey talked about the young man wearing the "traditional" uniform--a plaid skirt, which he called a "kilt").

The idea that females should not WANT access to certain kinds of sports and activities is a philosophical argument, NOT a legal one. Legalities demand that females be provided access to the same athletic opportunities afforded to young men in the public school system.

This, btw, is also true for ACADEMIC activities. There was a time in our not-so-distant past when the underlying philosophy was that too much education ruined a young lady. Young women were disallowed or strongly discouraged from studying certain subjects (particularly hard sciences). Women were told they were "not suited" to such vigorous thinking. They were told to take classes in homemaking instead. Today if a school DARED to disallow a young lady from taking an upper level science course, even the most conservative of Christians would likely take offense. We realize that our ideas of "suitable" were based on a philosophical construct that didn't match the reality of womanhood. Thus, females are now allowed ACCESS to every kind of academic pursuit provided to men.

Realistically, it's not like many young ladies would be physically capable or even desire to compete on a male team. We're talking a significant level of athleticism on the part of the female. Something that is likely outside the norm. Additionally, she'd have to have an outlier sensibility to take on the role of "female wrestler" in a public high school where ridicule and shame abound for those who step outside the norm. So, if she has the ability and the grit, why shouldn't she be able exercise her skills and push her abilities?

 

[AnnaBou]

Hmmm...how about female genital mutilation, the lack of access to jobs and education in poorer countries, the lack of basic human rights in Muslim countries, the poor healthcare for women and children. ALL of these are feminist issues.

Thats not a fight for women in civilised countries except where immigrants bring these practices here and thats a fight to preserve civilisation. I think women make good teachers but whether we are best teaching girls not boys?