Speaking in tongues

[Stephen63]

Your initial reaction perceives such questioners as attacking you, or being mean, or being malicious.
Please put these reactions on hold for just a wee tad second.

Just for a wee tad second assume these questions are being asked out of love and a desire for truth and right spiritual practice.

If the majority of the posts sounded like the one you just wrote, it might be worth considering. However, the attitudes of individuals with their traps and snares, stupid videos and writings from way-out-there loonies, comparing such extremists to us in such a mocking fashion is neither Christlike nor loving. I Corinthians 13 says without love it's nothing. So, I'm not listening to nothing.

 

[1still_waters]

If the majority of the posts sounded like the one you just wrote, it might be worth considering. However, the attitudes of individuals with their traps and snares, stupid videos and writings from way-out-there loonies, comparing such extremists to us in such a mocking fashion is neither Christlike nor loving. I Corinthians 13 says without love it's nothing. So, I'm not listening to nothing.

Yeah I thought it was a trap and snares and all that too.
But it's not.
It's meant to make someone really confront what they believe so it can be measured against scritprue.

 

[Stephen63]

Yeah I thought it was a trap and snares and all that too.
But it's not.
It's meant to make someone really confront what they believe so it can be measured against scritprue.

Perhaps you don't understand. It's not the honest information I have a problem with...... it's the attitudes of the informers.



I've watched the attitudes of these informers for quite some time...... I wouldn't give air in a paper bag for what they've said. Because their attitudes stink, their witness has no credibility to me, and apparently quite a few others. They love to argue and fight. They ignore others' statements and accuses them of twisting scriptures.






I thought there were rules for that.

 

[SarahM777]

And I noticed you once again avoided the point, and that is, entrapment is a tactic used quite often by certain people to snare people in their words. A plan has been devised, a trap has been set to see if anyone will fall into it. Then they say, "Aha, see, I asked for proof, and this is what they show me."


This was a tactic used by the Pharisees against Jesus himself. They would plan in advance what they would ask him, to catch him in his words. We know what kind of people they were. These are no different.







I never plan to answer your questions. But I will do this:


Ephesians 5:11-12 [SUP]11 [/SUP]Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them; [SUP]12 [/SUP]for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret.

All I can say is WOW. Are you that afraid to actually look at it to see if maybe you are in error? And if you are not in error why can't you just explain it? And again if you are not in error why are you unwilling? If I am wrong I am more then willing to accept that. I just want to know the truth. I have very serious concerns about this whole thing and yet all it seems you want to do is blow it off. Your whole attitude comes across not in love but in arrogance and pride. I may be wrong but this how it seems like you are coming across.

You are quite free to believe what you want.

 

[inge]

But you still haven't answered the question of how are these videos different then what most Charismatic churches do or do not and how do you know the difference? That is never explained. What is most often said is "That is not what we do" and it's left at that. And again how do you know that you are praising God or cursing Jesus and how do you tell the difference?
That is what we are asking,we have no problem with the fact that God can do those things. The issue still comes back to the core question IS THIS FROM GOD OR NOT and how do you know?

How did Peter know that Cornelius spoke in tongues and not demonized stuff??

15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. 16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. 17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? 18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life. Acts 11:15-18​

How did the church than knew the difference between good and evil? (Acts 8:13-28, acts 16:16)

So....how do we know now the difference between good and evil?
God is the same yesterday today and forever
The Holy Spirit is the same yesterday today and forever
​

Scripture.
To test the Spirit needs the discernment of the Spirit, but what is more easy in general to explain is to test the fruit. It is IMPOSSIBLE to test as general Christian fruit through internet. It takes time to see somebodies life to examine it. But. It is mentioned in scriptures:

Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?1 Cor 4:6​

If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?1 Cor 13:24​

If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.1 Cor 14:27​

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1 I read the Bible, to gain knowledge of what is Christlike/ Biblical.

These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so Act 17:11​

This is what Paul did teach the Thessalonians:​

Quench not the Spirit. Despise not prophesyings. Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. Abstain from all appearance of evil. 2 'Thes 5:19-21​

I guess they searched this too.....​

But there remained two of the men in the camp, the name of the one was Eldad, and the name of the other Medad: and the spirit rested upon them; and they were of them that were written, but went not out unto the tabernacle: and they prophesied in the camp. Num 11:26​

And Moses said unto him, Enviest thou for my sake? would God that all the LORD'S people were prophets, and that the LORD would put his spirit upon them! Num 11:29​

Until the spirit be poured upon us from on high, and the wilderness be a fruitful field, and the fruitful field be counted for a forest. Jes 32:15​

...as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That He might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, Ef 5:25,26​

2 I use the Bible to reprove, rebuke, exhort and pierce.

Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. Math 4:7​

And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God Ef 6:17​

Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. 2 Tim 4:2​

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebr 4:12​

3 I pray for the Spirit to discern and the right way to walk.

And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it, when ye turn to the right hand, and when ye turn to the left. Jes 30:21
to another discerning of spirits 1 Cor 12:10​

That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ; Phil 1:10​

But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. Heb 5:14​

I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. Rev 3:18​

​

Whom is the giver/Giver?
Every time the great point in this debates is. IS IT FROM GOD

well....WHOM knows best if it is so?

Seek and yea shall know.....ask God.

You all trust God, but for sure not some bunch of Pentecostals BUT...do you trust God???

This are my quotes, but other people have written same sort of things.

 

[Stephen63]

All I can say is WOW. Are you that afraid to actually look at it to see if maybe you are in error? And if you are not in error why can't you just explain it? And again if you are not in error why are you unwilling?
1. If I am wrong I am more then willing to accept that.
2. I just want to know the truth.
3. I have very serious concerns about this whole thing and yet all it seems you want to do is blow it off.
4. Your whole attitude comes across not in love but in arrogance and pride.
5. I may be wrong but this how it seems like you are coming across.

You are quite free to believe what you want.

1. You never have admitted to being wrong before so nope, don't believe it.



2. Others have posted the truth and you ignored them.... So nope, don't believe it.



3. Yep, you're so serious about this..... It only took over five hours for you to answer my last post..... So, nope, don't believe it.



4. Here we go again, accusing me of what you're doing.....



5. I would tell you that you're wrong, but what's the use? You haven't believed anything I've said so far........ so nope.








So, I will believe what I want. I don't want to believe you.




Just leave me alone, k?






Sincerely, Stephen63

 

[zone]

If we had a video of infant baptism, would that prove that it is scriptural? No. You knew before you asked him that such a video would prove nothing. What you do know is that the only videos on the Internet are of these wackos in Lala land. Local churches don't do videos of such things. What it looks like you're trying to do is set Ricky up with some terribly bad examples.

you're not ricky....and you're doing a terrible job of addressing the issues.

so, what is on the net is "wackos in Lala land".

all you have to do is say WHY.
in what way is what they do different from what you do.
merely in EXCESS?

the tongues aren't the right kind?

explain it.

you won't and can't answer because you know it's the same stuff.

if you could prove otherwise you would have.

 

[zone]

I never plan to answer your questions.

there you have it.

you have zero credibility.

 

[inge]

It is interesting to watch all the struggle around this issue. I am preparing for 2 weeks "receiving the Holy Spirit" to teach the teenagers in church. And yes I mean study motivated from the Bible. How can we prepare a new generation or maybe the last generation for the dark days we live in? For sure not with just head-knowledge since that is clearly not enough in the Bible. So what is heart-knowledge...to clean the insight of "the cup" instead of the outside? I cannot do that by myself. I need the Holy Spirit. So what does it bother people that He can speak in/through me? I am glad God lives in me. I need God, and tongues are just a part of that visible relationship...the bases of it, is that it is a relationship with God.

He is not just my intellectual satisfaction, He is not only the Focus Point of my reasoning, He is also my soul-Mate, He lives in my soul. That is what the gift of the Holy Spirit is to me.

To me the Holy Spirit is no joke at all. He is serious business as God is to me. The Holy Spirit = truth as the Father and Jesus are. This truth I need. Without it, I can't survive it this sick, dark and evil world.

Even my mind or my feelings can play tricks with me and lead me to temptation, but the Holy Spirit is my Rock of my salvation, wired in my conscious, Comforter in the storms. He is God and can perform as He pleases in me, as long as I surrender to Him.

It keeps my mind wandering.

 

[zone]

Those who are finding issue with people asking for examples now days of tongues and such, please just pause for a second and hear me out.

Your initial reaction perceives such questioners as attacking you, or being mean, or being malicious.
Please put these reactions on hold for just a wee tad second.

Just for a wee tad second assume these questions are being asked out of love and a desire for truth and right spiritual practice.

These questioners are trying to make you compare what's happening today, to what happens in the Bible. They're hoping that if you see a major difference between what you practice, and what the Bible shows, that maybe you'll change your practice that isn't in the Bible.

I was once in the shoes of someone who viewed these questioners as mean, malicious, and attacking.
But then I paused.
Then I listened.
Then I did ask myself...

"Hmmm is what I'm experiencing a solid match with what's in the Bible?"

And guess what!

What I was experiencing wasn't a solid match with what's in the Bible.

Now I'm not saying you'll reach the same conclusion as me.

On the other hand, if you're walking in error, maybe it's worth putting your negative perceptions of the questioners aside for a wee tad second or two, so you can take an honest inventory of things.

We always hear about people who cling to their "traditions". But often those who rant the most about clinging to traditions, are the MOST guilty of clinging to a man made tradition that isn't in the Bible. Maybe you're afraid to let go? Maybe you're afraid to admit you've been wrong all these years? If that is the case, then humble yourself and change. I did.

If after an honest examination of yourself, you see no reason to change, then carry on, and disengage from the discussion. It's clear you're in faith about where you practice and stand.

such a rarity for someone who was in the movement to testify to the truth of it all.
i've suggested before maybe CC could have a private forum / mission-exit ministry for those seeking answers (but too afraid to ask or talk about it to their peers or at their church).

consider it still....it's needed.

 

[Ephraim]

I don't actually believe in it. When I see videos of people speaking tongues and writhing around I always think 'acting'. 'Too much adrenaline'. 'High blood sugar' .... 'LSD'.

IS it just me?

 

[zone]

Perhaps you don't understand. It's not the honest information I have a problem with...... it's the attitudes of the informers.



I've watched the attitudes of these informers for quite some time...... I wouldn't give air in a paper bag for what they've said. Because their attitudes stink, their witness has no credibility to me, and apparently quite a few others. They love to argue and fight. They ignore others' statements and accuses them of twisting scriptures.






I thought there were rules for that.

excuses excuses.

 

[HollyLoree]

Perhaps you don't understand. It's not the honest information I have a problem with...... it's the attitudes of the informers.

I've watched the attitudes of these informers for quite some time...... I wouldn't give air in a paper bag for what they've said. Because their attitudes stink, their witness has no credibility to me, and apparently quite a few others. They love to argue and fight. They ignore others' statements and accuses them of twisting scriptures.

I thought there were rules for that.

Well I think there is a rule somewhere. Hm. Oh yeah! You will know them by their fruits?
"A good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and an evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For the mouth speaks what the heart is full of."

When you hear only hatred coming out of someone's mouth, you can bet that's the state of their heart.

 

[inge]

I don't actually believe in it. When I see videos of people speaking tongues and writhing around I always think 'acting'. 'Too much adrenaline'. 'High blood sugar' .... 'LSD'.

IS it just me?

Don't look at humans Ephraim. Don't ask humans. Humans make big mistakes.
ASK GOD what is truth.

Ask HIM to show you in the Bible.

Throw everything from internet away. Don't watch it.

 

[HollyLoree]

excuses excuses.

All I see when I read your posts is meanness. Meanness doesn't come from God.

 

[Stephen63]

you're not ricky....and you're doing a terrible job of addressing the issues.

so, what is on the net is "wackos in Lala land".

all you have to do is say WHY.
in what way is what they do different from what you do.
merely in EXCESS?

the tongues aren't the right kind?

explain it.

you won't and can't answer because you know it's the same stuff.

if you could prove otherwise you would have.

See? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Already accused about it being the same, without anything being shown.


I rest my case.





And they wonder why I don't bother with explaining anything?

 

[zone]

Well I think there is a rule somewhere. Hm. Oh yeah! You will know them by their fruits?
"A good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and an evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For the mouth speaks what the heart is full of."

When you hear only hatred coming out of someone's mouth, you can bet that's the state of their heart.

worry about the state of the heart of others after we figure out if this charismatic chaos is even Christian.

(it isn't....so i recommend checking your own fruit...the fruit of that movement is evident to EVERYONE outside of it)

 

[Stephen63]

there you have it.

you have zero credibility.

That said by the woman who has zero authority

 

[zone]

See? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Already accused about it being the same, without anything being shown.
I rest my case.
And they wonder why I don't bother with explaining anything?

you don't have a case.
lots of people have asked straight-forward questions about why it's different, or some evidence of any kind that what you practice is Biblical while the stuff on the net by wackos in la-la land isn't.

you have shown nothing to prove what you do is different.

you have provided nothing but excuses, accusations of lack of love; judge not lest ye be judged; everbody who questions these practices is displaying bad fruit.....blah blah blah.

you don't need to bother explaining anything.
the fact you have to work so hard to avoid it makes your problem self-evident.

you've gotten lots of warnings that what you are doing and the beliefs it's founded on are not Biblical, and are unorthodox (aberrent counterfeits).


if you're so attached to them, at the risk you're running, it tells me everything i need to know.
bye then

 

[Stephen63]

worry about the state of the heart of others after we figure out if this charismatic chaos is even Christian.

(it isn't....so i recommend checking your own fruit...the fruit of that movement is evident to EVERYONE outside of it)

There she goes again......piling up everything that people believe in the gifts and calling it charismatic Chaos. Is it any wonder she's been banned once already?