Heavenly bound or Not

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E

ELECT

Guest
#1
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium or some short period of time in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation.

Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false.

But what does the bible teach ? Has heaven been promised to redeemed ?
 
May 2, 2014
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#2
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, endless tracts, booklets, magazines etc. have been printed all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation.

Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false.

But what does the bible teach ? Has heaven been promised to redeemed ?
No, it hasn't. The earth is the destination of the redeemed.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#4
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium or some short period of time in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation.

Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false.

But what does the bible teach ? Has heaven been promised to redeemed ?
the millennium will be 1000 years on earth, not heaven.

Isaiah 11:6-12 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.
And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

etc.
 
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E

ELECT

Guest
#6
You are asking the wrong question, provide scriptural proof that heaven is the reward of the saved.
i cannot find any that why i am asking
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#7
the millennium will be 1000 years on earth, not heaven.

Isaiah 11:6-12 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.
And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

etc.

What does the saints caught up in the air means ?
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#8
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium or some short period of time in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation.

Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false.

But what does the bible teach ? Has heaven been promised to redeemed ?
Fixed: The vast majority of people in America today...

In Australia, by and large, the rapture and this sort of stuff isn't talked about, let alone believed by most Christians. I think it's more of an American thing.
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#9
Fixed: The vast majority of people in America today...

In Australia, by and large, the rapture and this sort of stuff isn't talked about, let alone believed by most Christians. I think it's more of an American thing.
In the caribbean it is talked about and believed by many that why i wana know why

Where does it say we go to heaven for any period of time be it 3 1/2 years 1000 yrs etc
 
May 2, 2014
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#10
Please provide scriptural proof
God promised the land to Abraham as an everlasting possession.

14 And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward:
15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.
16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.
17 Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee. (Gen 13:14-17 KJV)

God promised to give the land to Abraham as an everlasting possession. He made the same promise to Isaac and Jacob.

And Isaac called Jacob, and blessed him, and charged him, and said unto him, Thou shalt not take a wife of the daughters of Canaan.
2 Arise, go to Padanaram, to the house of Bethuel thy mother's father; and take thee a wife from thence of the daughters of Laban thy mother's brother.
3 And God Almighty bless thee, and make thee fruitful, and multiply thee, that thou mayest be a multitude of people; {a multitude...: Heb. an assembly of people}
4 And give thee the blessing of Abraham, to thee, and to thy seed with thee; that thou mayest inherit the land wherein thou art a stranger, which God gave unto Abraham. (Gen 28:1-4 KJV)

Here Isaac speaks of the blessing of Abraham, which is to inherit the land. Paul quotes this phrase in the NT and applies it to Gentiles.

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. (Gal 3:13-14 KJV)

The blessing of Abraham in the land inheritance, Paul says here that it might come on the Gentiles through faith in Christ. The promise was made to Abraham and his seed, the Jews thought that that was them but Paul says otherwise.

6 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (Gal 3:16 KJV)

The promise wasn't to all of the Jews but rather was to Christ. David also prophesied this.

6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion. {set: Heb. anointed} {upon...: Heb. upon Zion, the hill of my holiness}
7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. {the decree: or, for a decree}
8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.(Psa 2:6-8 KJV)

The word earth is actually land. The land was promised to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Christ. Paul said that those who are in Christ are Abraham's seed and heirs.

26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.The (Gal 3:26-1 KJV)





The promise is the land inheritance, Christians are coheirs with Christ, and Abraham's seed.

This is just a quick overview, I've written an article on this that goes in much more detail and give lots of evidence from Scripture, if you'd like to read it. The article is "The Kingdom of God (A Biblical Perspective)"
 
Sep 30, 2014
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#11
Luke 23:42
The Crucifixion
…42And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."
 
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Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
5,948
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#12
Luke 23:42
The Crucifixion
…42And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."
Could that be circumstantial? Yes the thief happened to be dying that day, but could Jesus not tell you or I that if the moment we believed and received Him is even this day?
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#13
Luke 23:42
The Crucifixion
…42And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."
So is the thief in heaven ?
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#14
Could that be circumstantial? Yes the thief happened to be dying that day, but could Jesus not tell you or I that if the moment we believed and received Him is even this day?
Where is Elijah and Enoch ?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,707
3,650
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#15
What does the saints caught up in the air means ?
That's the Church in the rapture but come back to earth with Christ at the end of the Tribulation.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
5,948
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#16
Ezekiel 14:12-23 speaks of God's judgement upon Jerusalem stating in 14:20 Though Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, as I live, saith the Lord GOD, they shall deliver neither son nor daughter; they shall but deliver their own souls by their righteousness. 21 For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my four sore judgements upon Jerusalem, the sword, and the famine, and the noisome beast, and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast? 22 Yet, behold, therein shall be left a remnant that shall be brought forth...

I believe this supports no rapture will happen, and those that remain are those that are left (rather than left behind)
 
D

dalconn

Guest
#17
Is that remnant of the Jews or the gentiles? When Christ returns the time of the gentiles will be fulfilled
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#18
That's the Church in the rapture but come back to earth with Christ at the end of the Tribulation.
How long will they be in heaven ? is there a verse for that ?
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#19
Ezekiel 14:12-23 speaks of God's judgement upon Jerusalem stating in 14:20 Though Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, as I live, saith the Lord GOD, they shall deliver neither son nor daughter; they shall but deliver their own souls by their righteousness. 21 For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my four sore judgements upon Jerusalem, the sword, and the famine, and the noisome beast, and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast? 22 Yet, behold, therein shall be left a remnant that shall be brought forth...

I believe this supports no rapture will happen, and those that remain are those that are left (rather than left behind)
So where did God take Enoch ?
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
5,948
1,693
113
#20
Is that remnant of the Jews or the gentiles? When Christ returns the time of the gentiles will be fulfilled
The remnant are the righteous, so both Jew and Gentile, as righteousness only comes by Christ. Although, I would like to look further into whether those that are blinded might be spared to learn from this remnant, when the one that hinders is taken out of the way. I realize this is a fairly radical interpretation as consensus is that the one that restrains is believed to be the church, but, indeed the one that hinders is the spirit of antichrist as the definition of blasphemer is one who hinders the holy spirit.