Doctrinal doo doo?

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crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
113
#21
I would humbly request that when you use the word church in the plural state as churches, please use the small case "c".

Because there is only one true Church (body of believers), not many, and pointing out the truth of bad teachings in the churches should not be frowned upon but should be looked into by all believers to see if there church is actually teaching the truth.

Maybe he goes about it the wrong way but it should lead people to go and actually test what they have been taught by the Holy Spirit's guidance and the Word of God.

It is hard to wake up the blind though as the scriptures say !!!
Only God knows who the true believers are...in the meantime it's inevitable that there will be mixed multitude with born again believers and tares, and even at that there are disagreements amongst the born agains due to our flesh.
 
B

biblicalsandy

Guest
#22
To me it is like playing "Chess", carefully weighing and watching your opponent (They are not going to let you win). Not playing "War"! Or like, being the kid that did not study and cheated off another students paper...only to find out the other person did not study either, and they both got "F's"....Psalms 118:8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#23
Oh, I know well what legalism is, and I can spot a legalist quicker than they can say, "NT law has now replaced OT law".

This is how blind they are

Hebrews tells us NO ONE WAS SAVED by OT LAW.

So they want us to believe we are saved by NT LAW..

I guess the OT believer was saved by grace alone with no works? and we have to work??
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#24
Oh, I know well what legalism is, and I can spot a legalist quicker than they can say, "NT law has now replaced OT law".
Do you know what the "perfect law of liberty" is that James is speaking on ???

It is not the 613 written ordinances of the Mosaic laws he is speaking on there, but instead he is speaking the two greatest commandments the Lord said we are to follow in Matthew 22:37-40.

Lord Jesus and Apostle Paul both show by those two commands upholds and thus fulfills the law and prophets, because love would do no wrong to self and others. Therefore there is no transgressing in walking in love !!!

We are to focus on walking in love and not written ordinances, and all else will fall in place !!!
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#25
Only God knows who the true believers are...in the meantime it's inevitable that there will be mixed multitude with born again believers and tares, and even at that there are disagreements amongst the born agains due to our flesh.
That is a lie taught in churches now days, as the Lord Jesus clearly told us.............

Matthew 7:16
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

It amazes me some fall to that teaching that we can not tell when Jesus clearly told us we would by their actions/fruits !!!
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#26
Do you know what the "perfect law of liberty" is that James is speaking on ???

It is not the 613 written ordinances of the Mosaic laws he is speaking on there, but instead he is speaking the two greatest commandments the Lord said we are to follow in Matthew 22:37-40.

Lord Jesus and Apostle Paul both show by those two commands upholds and thus fulfills the law and prophets, because love would do no wrong to self and others. Therefore there is no transgressing in walking in love !!!

We are to focus on walking in love and not written ordinances, and all else will fall in place !!!
Yes the perfect "law of liberty", the royal law of love. An elegant oxymoron is it not?

It forces me to my knees to find its fulfillment in the One who alone is Love.
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#27
To me it is like playing "Chess", carefully weighing and watching your opponent (They are not going to let you win). Not playing "War"! Or like, being the kid that did not study and cheated off another students paper...only to find out the other person did not study either, and they both got "F's"....Psalms 118:8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man.
Yes which is why we are to use the Holy Spirit's guidance and the Word of God both to test what is being taught behind the pulpits. To many walk into their churches sit down listen to the pastor preach and accept what he says as truth without testing them.

Just because a person stands in front of a congregation and preaches does not mean they are giving the truth, or actually even qualified to be doing that job.

Look at all the churches now days accepting gay marriage in them, should we accept their teachings as truth just because they are a church??? How about Westboro Baptist who teaches a hate doctrine, should we accept their church teachings as truth ???

I don't think so !!!
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
5,066
1,502
113
#28
Just throw it in the pot, stir and watch the smoke rise. Lord please keep the wind from behind me.
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#29
Yes the perfect "law of liberty", the royal law of love. An elegant oxymoron is it not?

It forces me to my knees to find its fulfillment in the One who alone is Love.
Yes but we can not neglect how both Jesus and Paul both show that walking in love will uphold the other teachings and commands from Christ. Not void them out or neglect them !!!
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
113
#30
That is a lie taught in churches now days, as the Lord Jesus clearly told us.............

Matthew 7:16
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

It amazes me some fall to that teaching that we can not tell when Jesus clearly told us we would by their actions/fruits !!!
Not sure what churches you are referring to...

2 Timothy 2:19 KJV
[19] Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.


1 Corinthians 4:3-5 KJV
[3] But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self. [4] For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. [5] Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
 
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B

biblicalsandy

Guest
#31
Even Moses I believe walked in liberty, and this is how I received it on liberty with love. [h=1]Exodus 2:11-12King James Version (KJV)[/h]11 And it came to pass in those days, when Moses was grown, that he went out unto his brethren, and looked on their burdens: and he spied an Egyptian smiting an Hebrew, one of his brethren.
12 And he looked this way and that way, and when he saw that there was no man, he slew the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
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#32
I believe the "Law of Liberty " is essentially the principles of the Gospel e.g. "Freely you have received freely give" or we are to forgive others their debt because our sins have freely been forgiven etc.
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#33
Yes but we can not neglect how both Jesus and Paul both show that walking in love will uphold the other teachings and commands from Christ. Not void them out or neglect them !!!
Walking by faith in Jesus Christ IS walking in love and IS upholding the teachings and commands of Christ.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#34
Walking by faith in Jesus Christ IS walking in love and IS upholding the teachings and commands of Christ.

sadly you can say that a millions times and they will claim you do not believe that way, and its not true.
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#35
Not sure what churches you are referring to...

2 Timothy 2:19 KJV
[19] Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.


1 Corinthians 4:3-5 KJV
[3] But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self. [4] For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. [5] Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
Do we have to get into a discussion of showing the difference between judging and rebuking/reproving ???

Do you really think a church like Westboro Baptist church that teaches their congregation a hate doctrine is saved???

I can tell you by His Word no as His grace, mercy, and forgiveness has no place for hatred in His teachings, for He even tells us to love and do good to our enemies !!!



I believe the "Law of Liberty " is essentially the principles of the Gospel e.g. "Freely you have received freely give" or we are to forgive others their debt because our sins have freely been forgiven etc.
The perfect law of liberty is the two greatest commandments given by the Lord to uphold, and by doing so all else will fall in place !!!
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#36
Do we have to get into a discussion of showing the difference between judging and rebuking/reproving ???

Do you really think a church like Westboro Baptist church that teaches their congregation a hate doctrine is saved???

I can tell you by His Word no as His grace, mercy, and forgiveness has no place for hatred in His teachings, for He even tells us to love and do good to our enemies !!!


The perfect law of liberty is the two greatest commandments given by the Lord to uphold, and by doing so all else will fall in place !!!
Churches aren't saved, people are. How is it you know the heart of every person in that church?
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#37
Walking by faith in Jesus Christ IS walking in love and IS upholding the teachings and commands of Christ.
We are to show the same love, mercy, and forgiveness to others as He has shown to us.
If we are not doing that then we are not walking in the faith, as Apostle John says if you say you love God but hate your brother no eternal life abides in you. (1 John 4:20)

Apostle Paul also says if we continue to walk in iniquity, we have not learned Christ !!!
(Ephesians 4:20)
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#38
Churches aren't saved, people are. How is it you know the heart of every person in that church?
Do they all not follow that bad doctrine and stand out on the street corners holding those hate signs ???

Also if a person's heart is true to the ways of God I would believe they would get out of that church and seek out another, as I did with the Catholic church. There is no need to stay under the guidance of false teaching like that !!!
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#39
Do they all not follow that bad doctrine and stand out on the street corners holding those hate signs ???

Also if a person's heart is true to the ways of God I would believe they would get out of that church and seek out another, as I did with the Catholic church. There is no need to stay under the guidance of false teaching like that !!!
Hmmmm, aren't you the anybody involved in Homosexuality are all gonna burn in Hell guy?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
113
#40
Do we have to get into a discussion of showing the difference between judging and rebuking/reproving ???

Do you really think a church like Westboro Baptist church that teaches their congregation a hate doctrine is saved???

I can tell you by His Word no as His grace, mercy, and forgiveness has no place for hatred in His teachings, for He even tells us to love and do good to our enemies !!!





The perfect law of liberty is the two greatest commandments given by the Lord to uphold, and by doing so all else will fall in place !!!
Sigh, I'm simply saying that Churches are subject to criticism because they are made up of sinners saved by grace.
Look at the Corinthian Church...a mess, and yet Paul even though he handed them some constructive criticism worked with them like a mother to a child. But this continual degrading of the churches with no suggestions for improvement is getting old. I suggested to Yet to start a Church, maybe he can help that way.
You jump in with the usual destracting arguments. .no thanks.