The Law Debacle Resolved
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The 10 commandments are most valuable for instruction and edification, but Acts 15:20, which you listed, proves that gentiles were never under, not expected to be under, the 10 commandments.
Every other commandment you listed falls under the two greatest commandments of faith and love. Again, what you listed is most useful for instruction and edification in how to walk.
Every other commandment you listed falls under the two greatest commandments of faith and love. Again, what you listed is most useful for instruction and edification in how to walk.
K
Walking in the fruit of the Holy Spirit will not lead one to transgress the law, we do that our selves when we get drawn away by our own lusts and desires. Apostle James clearly shows this !!!
Walking in the Spirit a person can not walk in disobedience, disobedience comes from self not the Spirit !!!
Walking in the Spirit a person can not walk in disobedience, disobedience comes from self not the Spirit !!!
It does appear that HeRoseFromTheDead is twisting things you are saying as I read both yours and his posts.
Now concerning the Sabbath as Saturday, didn't Pope Gregory live after Constantine died? The Julian calendar was revised by Pope Gregory's calendar? Saturn was a Roman God. Then Sunday was named after a sun god Ra in relation to Egyptian worship. Should either day be called a Sabbath day according to Exodus chapter 16?
Now concerning the Sabbath as Saturday, didn't Pope Gregory live after Constantine died? The Julian calendar was revised by Pope Gregory's calendar? Saturn was a Roman God. Then Sunday was named after a sun god Ra in relation to Egyptian worship. Should either day be called a Sabbath day according to Exodus chapter 16?
Let me interject here one more time in the (probably false) hope of removing some blinders.
Part one:
I have from the VERY BEGINNING been in agreement with your 'anti-Pharisee' argument:
SALVATION IS NOT GAINED OR LOST THRU WORKS.
Let me repeat that because I know you're not listening:
I agree with you the salvation is not gained by works, nor can it be lost by works.
And one more time, just because I know you're not listening:
I HAVE, AND ALWAYS HAVE, AGREED THAT SALVATION IS NOT GAINED THRU WORKS, NOR IS IT LOST BY WORKS.
Do I have to say it a fourth time or are we good now?
Part one:
I have from the VERY BEGINNING been in agreement with your 'anti-Pharisee' argument:
SALVATION IS NOT GAINED OR LOST THRU WORKS.
Let me repeat that because I know you're not listening:
I agree with you the salvation is not gained by works, nor can it be lost by works.
And one more time, just because I know you're not listening:
I HAVE, AND ALWAYS HAVE, AGREED THAT SALVATION IS NOT GAINED THRU WORKS, NOR IS IT LOST BY WORKS.
Do I have to say it a fourth time or are we good now?
Part two: Here's the troubling issue -
The non-Pharisee group goes on to insist that because salvation itself is not affected by one's works, that works therefore have no place in a believers life.
Let me repeat that again lest you not be paying attention:
The non-Pharisee group goes on to insist that because salvation itself is not affected by one's works, that works therefore have no place in a believers life.
That is where we disagree. That is and always have been the gist of my arguments -
THAT EVEN THO WORKS (AND THE LAW THEY ARE BASED UPON) HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON ONE'S SALVATION. WORKS DO NONETHELESS HAVE A PLACE IN A BELIEVERS LIFE.
And let me repeat that because, oh, you know -
THAT EVEN THO WORKS (AND THE LAW THEY ARE BASED UPON) HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON ONE'S SALVATION, WORKS DO NONETHELESS HAVE A PLACE IN A BELIEVERS LIFE.
Now, the fact that you non-Pharisees cannot discern the difference in my simple little missives, tells me you cannot discern the difference in scripture.
And let me repeat that for clarity:
the fact that you non-Pharisees cannot discern the difference in my simple little missives, tells me you cannot discern the difference in scripture.
And that is what troubles me here. There is a huge lack of discernment in the non-Pharisee group. And lack of discernment is caused by tunnel vision and the unwillingness to take in the whole picture.
The non-Pharisee group goes on to insist that because salvation itself is not affected by one's works, that works therefore have no place in a believers life.
Let me repeat that again lest you not be paying attention:
The non-Pharisee group goes on to insist that because salvation itself is not affected by one's works, that works therefore have no place in a believers life.
That is where we disagree. That is and always have been the gist of my arguments -
THAT EVEN THO WORKS (AND THE LAW THEY ARE BASED UPON) HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON ONE'S SALVATION. WORKS DO NONETHELESS HAVE A PLACE IN A BELIEVERS LIFE.
And let me repeat that because, oh, you know -
THAT EVEN THO WORKS (AND THE LAW THEY ARE BASED UPON) HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON ONE'S SALVATION, WORKS DO NONETHELESS HAVE A PLACE IN A BELIEVERS LIFE.
Now, the fact that you non-Pharisees cannot discern the difference in my simple little missives, tells me you cannot discern the difference in scripture.
And let me repeat that for clarity:
the fact that you non-Pharisees cannot discern the difference in my simple little missives, tells me you cannot discern the difference in scripture.
And that is what troubles me here. There is a huge lack of discernment in the non-Pharisee group. And lack of discernment is caused by tunnel vision and the unwillingness to take in the whole picture.
Part 3 -
So let me sum up here what a lot of us are saying:
Works do not earn or lose you salvation.
and again
Works do not earn or lose you salvation.
But works (and the law they are based upon) still have a place in a believers life.
And again
works (and the law they are based upon), altho not a factor in salvation, still have a place in a believers life
now, A)Can we agree on that, or are you all B) still stuck on the idea that I (and others like me) are preaching a works based salvation?
Your answer to that will answer whether you are tunnel visioned or seeing the big picture. And with scripture you want to see the big picture
So let me sum up here what a lot of us are saying:
Works do not earn or lose you salvation.
and again
Works do not earn or lose you salvation.
But works (and the law they are based upon) still have a place in a believers life.
And again
works (and the law they are based upon), altho not a factor in salvation, still have a place in a believers life
now, A)Can we agree on that, or are you all B) still stuck on the idea that I (and others like me) are preaching a works based salvation?
Your answer to that will answer whether you are tunnel visioned or seeing the big picture. And with scripture you want to see the big picture
I saw this because someone had responded to it and I felt it needed a reponse.
I put you on ignore not for 'a simple disagreement' but because you incessantly (even on other threads) seem to argue just to argue, and when challenged you start to redefine terms, twist the issues and misrepresent what the other is saying.
Yes, we all are guilty from time to time of this but in your case it is in constant crescendo mode and I could stand it no longer as well as find it a total waste of time responding.
I put you on ignore not for 'a simple disagreement' but because you incessantly (even on other threads) seem to argue just to argue, and when challenged you start to redefine terms, twist the issues and misrepresent what the other is saying.
Yes, we all are guilty from time to time of this but in your case it is in constant crescendo mode and I could stand it no longer as well as find it a total waste of time responding.
Right. It's called fruit of the Spirit...
Galatians 5:18-24 KJV
[18] But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. [19] Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these ; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, [20] Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, [21] Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. [22] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. [24] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Galatians 5:18-24 KJV
[18] But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. [19] Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these ; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, [20] Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, [21] Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. [22] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. [24] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
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