I want to understand the Catholic faith so....

[GaryA]

Hello, I am new to this site and while I was trying to figure out how to use it I came across your post. I'll be completely honest with you, I joined this group in hopes that someone could educate me a little more on Christ and answer some questions I have. That being said I will start off by saying I attended a Catholic school and I have recently joined a Catholic Church. I didn't know that there was a big difference between Christians and Catholics, but after reading some of these comments I am eager to know what the difference is.

A "true" Christian is someone who has been 'born-again' ( -- which is the 'base-level' definition. Do not forget it, no matter what anyone tells you. The Bible teaches the Truth - and is above all - and goes before all - where Truth is concerned. Always remember that. ):


John 3:

[SUP]1[/SUP] There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: [SUP]2[/SUP] The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him. [SUP]3[/SUP] Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. [SUP]4[/SUP] Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? [SUP]5[/SUP] Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. [SUP]6[/SUP] That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. [SUP]7[/SUP] Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.


1 Peter 1:

[SUP]23[/SUP] Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. [SUP]24[/SUP] For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: [SUP]25[/SUP] But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.

 

[MikeHenderson]

First LonelyPilgrim God TOLD the people to make these images for the Ark! These Images were NOT made for the people to Worship as their God! No one ever bowed down to the Images on the Ark and Worship them as their God!

This is just another example of how the Corrupted Catholics try to justify their making of Idols of Mary and Worshiping Mary as their God!

I gave much Honor to my Mother but i NEVER Worshiped my Mother as my God!

This is the difference between you and me LonleyPilgrim. I actually Worship God ONLY! I do not Worship God and Mary anymore!

I gave up Praying the "Hail Mary" when i left the Catholic Church!

I gave up Praying the Rosary when i left the Catholic Church!

I tossed out all my pictures, books, medallions of Mary when i left the Catholic Church!

 

[ukok102nak]

No, neither infants nor mentally retarded people without the ability to tell right from wrong are capable of sin.



Scripture is not explicit about it, but it does tell us that Paul baptized entire families and households (Acts 16:15, 1 Corinthians 1:16, etc.). A "household," especially in the ancient world, generally included all children and even servants. Jesus said that even the youngest children (the Greek word used here means "newborns") should be brought to Him and not hindered (Luke 18:15-17). We have testimony from the very earliest of the Church Fathers (cf. Irenaeus of Lyon; the Apostolic Constitutions) that the Apostles did baptize children.

God bless you too!

:smoke: este what we mean brother that are you saying that
PAUL BAPTISED THE CHILDREN IN THAT HOUSE HOLDS
IN EARLY CHRISTIAN TIME?

:now: AND JESUS REALY MEAN THAT OR IT WAS YOUR
INTERPRETATION ONLY MY BROTHER . . . ..

: : everyone knows here that no disaples of christ jesus
would break his commandments!


sorry to say this my brother
but this verses tells everything about someone
like you
:read:
John 7:18
"The one speaking from himself seeks his own kavod (glory), but he who is seeking the kavod of the One having sent him, this one is ne'eman and there is no avlah (injustice) in him.

John: 7. 18. He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.


:ty:



God bless us all always

 

[PennEd]

Good morning to you also, and His peace be with you!



I'm not sure what they told you, but as Paul himself teaches us, quite rightly, that "whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord" and that "a man should examine himself" before partaking of the Body and Blood (1 Corinthians 11:27-28). Even as a Protestant, I understood that I had no business receiving Communion if I had sin on my conscience for which I hadn't asked forgiveness -- lest I "eat and drink judgment upon [myself]" (v. 29).

The "Hail Mary" is only as "heretical" as Luke 1:28 and 42-43.



Sure. Even Catholics teach that this is possible -- it just isn't what Jesus or His Apostles taught us to do. What was He talking about when he imparted to the Apostles that "whose sins you forgive are forgiven, and whose sins you retain are retained" (John 20:22-23)? What was James talking about when he taught us to "confess [our] sins one to another" (James 5:16)? Scripture teaches that sin is cleansed in baptism (Acts 22:16, Romans 6:3-6, etc.) -- and then the only other place it talks about sins being forgiven, for the one who sins after becoming a Christian, is in these passages about confession of sins.



Again: As I've said I think Mr. epostle has said, indulgences -- or any other exchange of money or goods -- don't have anything at all to do with the atonement of sins.



No, our works don't save us -- only His. My faith is in Christ alone, is His grace and mercy. May the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, guard your heart and your mind in Christ Jesus.

I pray that if there is no fruit with you that others reading would benefit. I get the impression your mind is fixed on these heresies.

The FACT is that in the past the catholic church told people that if they gave money to them their loved ones and themselves would spend less time in purgatory. The FACT is that,even TODAY, you must BUY mass cards so that a priest will say masses in that person's name to lessen their time in purgatory. If it wasn't about money then why does one have to BUY with MONEY the mass cards?

Further, NOWHERE in Scripture does it say we should be praying to ANYONE but God. Read what happened to King Saul when he tried to conjure up Samuel. Why are you praying to mary to pray for you NOW and at the hour of your DEATH? Where in Scripture does it say to pray to ANYONE but God?

Doing these things, and other heretical doctrines negates you saying you trust in Jesus ALONE for salvation. Why can't you see that?

 

[MikeHenderson]

Tell me LonleyPilgrim, where in the Traditions of First Century Church and in the Old Testament Traditions did anyone teach that Mary was born without sin?

Nobody taught that Mary was without sin. In fact LonleyPilgrim the teaching that Mary was born without sin was created in 1854 by the Catholic Church.

It interesting that for centuries the Catholic Church never taught that Mary was born without sin. In fact none of the Doctrines about Mary ever appeared before the 1800's!

IF Peter was the Pope and IF Mary was born without sin LonleyPilgrim, then there should be letters or papers of something from Pope Peter saying Mary was born with out.

Show us LonleyPilgrim any papers, letters, books, anything with the name Pope Peter on them! There is nothing at all from Peter indicating his role as the Pope of the Catholic Church! Nothing!

I challenge you LonleyPilgrim to show even one piece of paper from Peter that bears the name or signature of Pope Peter!

We have tons of papers from all the Popes of the Catholic Church, but yet we see NOTHING from Peter. Could this be because Peter never was the Pope and all you Catholics are liars?

Do you know LonleyPilgrim that no liar can enter into Heaven?

 

[MikeHenderson]

Romans 3:10
[SUP]10 [/SUP] As it is written: "There is none righteous, no, not one;

Romans 3:23
[SUP]23 [/SUP] for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Romans 5:12
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned--

1 John 1:10
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

No one is righteous LonelyPilgrim, not even Mary. All have sinned includes Mary also LonelyPilgrim. If Mary had said she had no sin she would be a liar LonelyPilgrim.

These verses proves the Catholic Church is nothing more than a Cult today LonelyPilgrim. A Cult Worshiping Mary as their god LonelyPilgrim.

 

[PennEd]

"A slight correction..."

[ The Bible teaches... ]

Anyone who is a born-again Christian is their own priest - and can go directly to the Father -- because of Jesus.

The only other-than-themselves priest a born-again Christian needs is the High Priest -- Jesus Himself.

Agreed. Sorry. I misspoke.

 

[PennEd]

Look brothers and sisters, and those searching for TRUTH. This creepy and eyeopening video will prove to you that you need to either come out or never start going to this church. I pray in Jesus name, that His Spirit will be poured out on your hearts.[video=youtube;dcpVrtv2t-M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcpVrtv2t-M[/video]

 

[MikeHenderson]

John 20:23
[SUP]23 [/SUP] If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained."

The forgiveness of sins is ONLY and ALONE through the Blood of Jesus Christ!

When Christ enjoins the apostles to forgive sins, He does NOT convey to them what is peculiar to Himself! It belongs to Him to forgive sins. He only enjoins them in His name to proclaim the forgiveness of sins.

Nowhere in the Scriptures do we find any instance of an apostle remitting the sins of anyone!

Let me ask you a question LonelyPilgrim. What is it that forgives sins?

Ephesians 1:7
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14
[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

1 John 1:7
[SUP]7 [/SUP] But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

Clearly LonleyPilgrim its the Blood of Jesus that forgives us of ALL our sins.

Like i said, the Catholic Church today is a Cult that follows Mary and Satan, and they do not follow God.

 

[MikeHenderson]

Repent LonelyPilgrim! Accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior before its too late!

You LonelyPilgrim are on the wide broad road that leads to the Lake of Fire. Turn around, reject Mary, reject the false teachings of the Catholic Church.

You too can enter into Heaven with us LonelyPilgrim if only you would listen to and heed the Words of Truth from the Holy Spirit in the Scriptures only!

No one outside of God has any Truth! Its God and God only who has ALL the Truth LonelyPilgrim! You have been lied to by the Catholic Church and by Satan to reject the very Truths in the Scriptures!

 

[epostle]

We can have a food fight or a discussion, your call.
There will be a test at the end of this post.

Please stop posting it -- it is incorrect...

This is a more correct representation of what the wording in this passage is referring to:

2 Timothy 3:

[SUP]14[/SUP] But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned { New Testament teaching of Christ }

Paul cannot possibly be appealing to a New Testament that did not yet exist. *The full New Testament did not have universal acceptance until the 4th century.

and hast been assured of, knowing of whom

thou hast learned them { the Apostles; i.e. - those directly commissioned by Jesus Himself }

; There is nothing in scripture indicating that Timothy met Jesus or any other Apostle other than Paul, and it would be redundant for Paul to be referring to himself. What Timothy learned was from the Judaic magisterium, known as the "Seat of Moses". You cannot connect "Seat of Moses" with the term "Magisterium" because you are doctrinally anti-Semitic. Jesus transferred the "Seat of Moses" from the Jews unto Peter.

[SUP]15[/SUP] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures

{ Old Testament teaching about Christ } , which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Agreed. Who taught Timothy the Old Testament as a child when there were no Apostles around???

[SUP]16[/SUP] All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: [SUP]17[/SUP] That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

You can read it, post it, preach it, but I see no evidence of the senses of scripture being applied. *
I explained how Luther and many other Protestants obscure this verse with an overemphasis of literal-ism, rendering 2 Tim 3:16 to mere words on a page.

In the context of this passage, the phrase 'the things which thou hast learned' is referring to the doctrine / teaching of Christ that Timothy had been taught that was later written as New Testament scripture -- nothing is included here - suggested, or referred to - that was not included in New Testament scripture.

Paul is training Timothy to be a bishop, so obviously Tim is an adult. Were the Apostles preaching when Timothy was a child? Tim learned about the OT scriptures as a child, it is not logical for the Apostles to be around when Tim was a child. And BTW, which canon of scripture were the Jews using when Timothy was a child? Paul is giving us the 4 senses of scripture.

There is no 'tradition' ( where 'the things which thou hast learned' is concerned ) outside of the doctrine / teaching of Christ.

I am not talking about that, I am talking about the Traditions Timothy learned as a JEWISH-NOT-YET-CHRISTIAN child. There were no Christians when Timothy was a child. "Which thou has learned" does not mean "which thou has read". Tradition is also sacred to the Jews and again, more evidence of doctrinal Antisemitism on your part. Catholicism is the fulfillment of Judaism, and no Protestant church or group or bless-me-club can make that claim.

The "sense and tense" of the phrase 'knowing of whom thou hast learned them' is a validation of the doctrine / teaching referred to in the first part of the sentence -- it is a "one-time, one-shot" reference.

The phrase is past tense because Tim learned from the Jewish magisterium when he was a child. " knowing of whom refers to people, not scripture or doctrines, they are not a "whom". , "whom" were they?

It is not - and, does not constitute - a continually-existing organizational entity which is to conduct rulings that "make" doctrine.

2 Tim. 3 tells us how to study bible, it has nothing to do with ecclesiastical structure you are so bent on demonizing. It is impossible for the Church to "make"doctrine.

Grammatically speaking - and, in the context of the passage - it is not [ in-of-itself ]

indicated to be a source of teaching ( in any sense of continual progression - please understand the context of what I am attempting to convey here ).

Do you mean the Bible is not the sole rule of faith?
The Apostles and their successors are commissioned to teach the Bible in the light of Tradition. Actually, the bible itself is Tradition that both spring from Apostolic Teaching but you've been told that on other forums.

There is no "Magisterium" -- only the doctrine / teaching of Christ.

The Magisterium has been commissioned by God to teach, not individuals acting on their own.

There is the relationship: the Scriptures are a tool for "teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness," but who is to use this tool for these purposes? That is, who has the authority to teach, reproof, correct, and train others in righteousness? The "man of God" has this authority.

But, who is the "man of God?" You may wish to claim this title for yourself as well, but a short survey of Scripture's use of the title will reveal that this, too, is a privileged title that cannot be simply taken upon oneself:


Moses - "This is the blessing with which Moses the man of God blessed the children of Israel before his death." (Deut. 33:1)
"Then the people of Judah came to Joshua at Gilgal; and Caleb the son of Jephunneh the Kenizzite said to him, 'You know what the LORD said to Moses the man of God in Kadesh-barnea concerning you and me.'" (Josh. 14:6)


The Angel of the Lord - "Then the woman came and told her husband, 'A man of God came to me, and his countenance was like the countenance of the angel of God, very terrible; I did not ask him whence he was, and he did not tell me his name...' Then Manoah entreated the LORD, and said, 'O, LORD, I pray thee, let the man of God whom thou didst send come again to us, and teach us what we are to do with the boy that will be born.'" (Jud. 13:6, 8)


St. Timothy - "But as for you, man of God, shun all this; aim at righteousness, godliness, faith, love, steadfastness, gentleness." (1 Tim. 6:11)

Contrary to the opinion that the "man of God" can be any Christian without distinction, Scripture itself will not allow such an interpretation, insisting that the "man of God" is a figure of authority, either commissioned by God directly through Divine Intervention (such as Moses or the Angel), or appointed by another holder of authority (such as Samuel, David, Elisha, and St. Timothy).
From this very brief survey of the phrase "man of God" (there are perhaps a dozen or so more passages, relating to the characters listed above - I have chosen representative verses), we see that what holds true for "pastors" holds true for the "man of God": it is a title of authority that can in no way be taken upon oneself, but rather, it is bestowed upon a man by a higher authority. A man must be called by God to hold this title of "man of God."
But there is another objection here: you will say, "I have been called by God to be a pastor." Very well, let us take another look at Scripture to measure your claim.
Biblically, there is only one way to become a legitimate ambassador of Christ, or "pastor": by appointment from a superior.

This can be done in two ways:
1) being commissioned by a legitimate ambassador (apostolic succession), or
2) being called directly by God.

We saw examples of this in Scripture already: Ss. Timothy and Titus were appointed to their positions of authority by succession, Moses was appointed to his position directly by God, with no human mediation.
As to the first method, apostolic succession comes through the laying on of hands in ceremony:

"Hence I remind you to rekindle the gift of God that is within you through the laying on of my hands... guard the truth that has been entrusted to you by the Holy Spirit who dwells within us." (2 Tim. 1:6, 14)

When St. Paul imposed his hands on St. Timothy, he passed on a legitimate apostolic authority, "entrusted" the "truth" to him, and imparted the gift of "the Holy Spirit" for the safekeeping and preservation of the Gospel.x

As has already been said, only a superior can do this, and not an inferior, since an inferior cannot pass on what he does not already possess.

 

[epostle]

Tell me LonleyPilgrim, where in the Traditions of First Century Church and in the Old Testament Traditions did anyone teach that Mary was born without sin?

In the Tradition of what Luke handed down, and the parallels he made with 2 Sam. and 1 Chronicles. "Full of Grace" means there is no room for sin, or the Angel Gabriel is lying. A basic kernel form of Mary's sinless was with the Apostles, and developed down through ages as it was challenged and questioned. It was clarified in 1854 for that reason. Claiming it was invented is just an anti-Catholic canard based on ignorance because some people say they can't find it explicity in the bible. .

Nobody taught that Mary was without sin. In fact LonleyPilgrim the teaching that Mary was born without sin was created in 1854 by the Catholic Church.

No, Mary's sinlessness was done by the power of God, not by any teaching. The words of God delivered by Gabriel are eternal, they are not restricted to linear time. The same applies to Christ's divine words from the cross. They too are eternal. Mary was "Full of Grace" at her conception because the angel said, The Lord IS with you... Not "the Lord be with you" and not "The Lord will be with you" and not "poof! the Lord is now with you." To read it that way does violence to the scriptures. Again:
the angel said, The Lord IS with you...

It interesting that for centuries the Catholic Church never taught that Mary was born without sin. In fact none of the Doctrines about Mary ever appeared before the 1800's!

That simply is false. Teachings always predate writings. The Church predates the Bible.

IF Peter was the Pope and IF Mary was born without sin LonleyPilgrim, then there should be letters or papers of something from Pope Peter saying Mary was born with out.

Because it was so obvious and common there was no need for it.

Show us LonleyPilgrim any papers, letters, books, anything with the name Pope Peter on them! There is nothing at all from Peter indicating his role as the Pope of the Catholic Church! Nothing!

Now you are ranting. If I were LonelyPilgrim, I would walk away from your bullying.

I challenge you LonleyPilgrim to show even one piece of paper from Peter that bears the name or signature of Pope Peter!

Now you are being childish.

We have tons of papers from all the Popes of the Catholic Church, but yet we see NOTHING from Peter. Could this be because Peter never was the Pope and all you Catholics are liars?

2 Peter 1:20 - interpreting Scripture is not a matter of one's own private interpretation. Therefore, it must be a matter of "public" interpretation of the Church. The Divine Word needs a Divine Interpreter. Private judgment leads to divisions, and this is why there are 30,000 different Protestant denominations.

2 Peter 3:15-16 - Peter says Paul's letters are inspired, but not all his letters are in the New Testament canon. See, for example, 1 Cor. 5:9-10; Col. 4:16. Also, Peter's use of the word "ignorant" means unschooled, which presupposes the requirement of oral apostolic instruction that comes from the Church.

2 Peter 3:16 - the Scriptures are difficult to understand and can be distorted by the ignorant to their destruction. God did not guarantee the Holy Spirit would lead each of us to infallibly interpret the Scriptures. But this is what Protestants must argue in order to support their doctrine of sola Scriptura. History and countless divisions in Protestantism disprove it.

Where in scripture does it say that all doctrines, practices and devotions must be explicitly found in scripture??? Nowhere. It's a man made doctrine you rigidly follow so your demand for "proof texting" on every catholic doctrine is hypocritical. Proof text your own first.

Do you know LonleyPilgrim that no liar can enter into Heaven?

Including bullies?

 

[epostle]

He was the ark formed of incorruptible wood. For by this is signified that His tabernacle was exempt from putridity and corruption."
Hippolytus, Orations Inillud, Dominus pascit me (ante A.D. 235).

"This Virgin Mother of the Only-begotten of God, is called Mary, worthy of God, immaculate of the immaculate, one of the one."
Origen, Homily 1(A.D. 244).

"Let woman praise Her, the pure Mary."
Ephraim, Hymns on the Nativity, 15:23 (A.D. 370).

"Thou alone and thy Mother are in all things fair, there is no flaw in thee and no stain in thy Mother."
Ephraem, Nisibene Hymns, 27:8 (A.D. 370).

"But the other conception, namely the infusion of the soul, it is piously and suitably believed, was without any sin, so that while the soul was being infused, she would at the same time be cleansed from original sin and adorned with the gifts of God to receive the holy soul thus infused. And thus, in the very moment in which she began to live, she was without all sin..."
MartinLuther, Weimar edition of Martin Luther's Works,English translation edited by J. Pelikan [Concordia: St.Louis],Volume 4, 694.

Funny how people will follow "sola scriptura" to the letter, turn a blind eye to the fact that Martin Luther invented it, and reject his teaching on Mary's purity.

"It cannot be denied that God in choosing and destining Mary to be theMother of his Son, granted her the highest honor."
John Calvin, Calvini Opera[Braunshweig-Berlin, 1863-1900], Volume 45, 348.

 

[santuzza]

Well, that's the issue, isn't it? Is a young child really culpable for an offense -- is it a sin -- if he or she didn't understand it was wrong? Do you hold it against your own child? Most Christians I know (not just Catholics) would agree that children reach an age of reason at which they appreciate the difference between right and wrong -- but before then, if they don't have such moral consciousness, they are not capable of sin.

I disagree with you. Just because they cannot recognize it as sin doesn't mean it isn't sin.

If a young adult was brought up in an environment that did not acknowledge fornication or adultery as sin, would you say they were not capable of that sin because they don't recognize it as sin? I think a lot of people sin, but do not see it as sin -- but that doesn't "clear" them of the sin or the punishment for that sin, does it? Even something as simple as taking a pen from work -- most people wouldn't even THINK of that as sin, yet it IS sin -- it's stealing. But I think most people wouldn't even recognize it as such. That doesn't mean it's not sin. And that also doesn't mean there isn't a punishment for that sin.

 

[ukok102nak]

:smoke: as our lord jesus christ says
:read:
John: 17. 18. As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
19. And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
20. Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
21. That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

:now: did christ jesus sent those people to tell all the truth about his words
for those people who only came out after the remaining apostles went to sleep and after the early true christians scattered through in different places because of the persecution of the empire . . . ...

:rofl: that's is why the man made doctrine were implemented
through out the ages with the dictatorship of those people who
want to create a world in their own graven image este what we mean is
in their own image of wickedness which been unnoticed by those early
people because if we could only back a few century before where the ordinary
people are not permitted to read what is written in the holy scriptures
and even cannot say the things they want to express from the holy book
for they were bound by those people of the church of the empire
and not people of the church of the god of truth and love . ...

as one of his ministries said before . ...
:read:
2 Timothy: 3. 10. But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
11. Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
12. Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
14. But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15. And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17. That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

God bless us all always


:ty:

 

[LonelyPilgrim]

First LonelyPilgrim God TOLD the people to make these images for the Ark!

But you were pretty adamant before, and I quote, that "We are NOT to have any image of anything!"

These Images were NOT made for the people to Worship as their God! No one ever bowed down to the Images on the Ark and Worship them as their God!

Neither do Catholics "worship" any images as gods.

This is just another example of how the Corrupted Catholics try to justify their making of Idols of Mary and Worshiping Mary as their God!

No, Catholics don't "worship" Mary as any sort of god.

I gave much Honor to my Mother but i NEVER Worshiped my Mother as my God!

Good; neither have I.

I gave up Praying the "Hail Mary" when i left the Catholic Church!
I gave up Praying the Rosary when i left the Catholic Church!
I tossed out all my pictures, books, medallions of Mary when i left the Catholic Church!

I'm sorry for your loss.

 

[LonelyPilgrim]

I pray that if there is no fruit with you that others reading would benefit. I get the impression your mind is fixed on these heresies.

I pray that others reading this will benefit as well. I want to fix my mind only on the truth.

The FACT is that in the past the catholic church told people that if they gave money to them their loved ones and themselves would spend less time in purgatory. The FACT is that,even TODAY, you must BUY mass cards so that a priest will say masses in that person's name to lessen their time in purgatory. If it wasn't about money then why does one have to BUY with MONEY the mass cards?

In five years of being a Catholic, in all the funerals I've been to, I've never even seen or been offered a "Mass card", or been asked to pay money or make a donation for any such thing. I get the feeling your conception of Catholicism is rooted in a long-ago childhood. I'm sorry if it was an unpleasant one, but you do not speak with any authority about the Catholic Church that I know.

I will say it again: the concept of purgatory has nothing at all to do with atonement of sins or even with salvation. The idea of indulgences does have to do with alleviating the burdens of those in purgatory -- but every one of those people is already saved; has already had their every sin washed away.

Further, NOWHERE in Scripture does it say we should be praying to ANYONE but God. Read what happened to King Saul when he tried to conjure up Samuel. Why are you praying to mary to pray for you NOW and at the hour of your DEATH? Where in Scripture does it say to pray to ANYONE but God?

The saints in heaven are our brothers and sisters in the Lord, those who have already received their reward in Him. We know for a fact that they are with Christ in glory and that they stand as a great cloud of witnesses around us (cf. Hebrews 12:22-23, 1), and that they are united to the same Christ as we. We are told in Scripture that they do intercede for us (cf. Revelation 5:8-9), and that the prayer of a righteous person avails much (James 5:16). So why would we not ask them to pray for us?

Doing these things, and other heretical doctrines negates you saying you trust in Jesus ALONE for salvation. Why can't you see that?

What you call "heretical doctrines," I call the glorious gifts of God's grace. I trust in Christ alone: He has given me an abundance of grace, more than enough for my every need. I see my former faith as a Protestant to be mostly barren, dour, and fruitless, and I can't imagine why I would ever want to go back to that.

 

[LonelyPilgrim]

Look brothers and sisters, and those searching for TRUTH. This creepy and eyeopening video will prove to you that you need to either come out or never start going to this church. I pray in Jesus name, that His Spirit will be poured out on your hearts.[video=youtube;dcpVrtv2t-M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcpVrtv2t-M[/video]

Sir, here is where it helps to know a little Latin. You may not, but I assure you that plenty of people do, and if the Catholic Church were actually invoking Satan then plenty of people would know about it and not just obscure Internet videos.

Here is an explanation of what is actually happening in this video:

Who or What is Lucifer?

 

[ukok102nak]

i've been a catholic for almost 30 years my brother . . ..
and from that long period of time
i never learned anything spiritual things but only the sermons of those priest

:smoke: and that is why without a doubt he is already dead :rofl:
:happy: but thanks to
our lord god the father almighty who is good and doesn't lie
and to
lord god the only begotten son who is our saviour when the time comes . ...

:scarf: he was given a chance to do the will of god og the truth and love
AND NOT THE WILL OF ANY MEN . . ..

8) as the written scriptures say
:read:

 

[LonelyPilgrim]

I disagree with you. Just because they cannot recognize it as sin doesn't mean it isn't sin.

So you would really say that an infant-in-arms is capable of sin, and worthy of damnation? Nearly all Protestants I've ever heard of -- and especially those who reject infant baptism -- would say that no, infants lack the understanding either to sin or to have a saving faith. Therefore if they die before coming to an age of reason, they are accepted lovingly by God. How does this work in your mind?

If a young adult was brought up in an environment that did not acknowledge fornication or adultery as sin, would you say they were not capable of that sin because they don't recognize it as sin? I think a lot of people sin, but do not see it as sin -- but that doesn't "clear" them of the sin or the punishment for that sin, does it?

Adults who are of an age of reason and do have a moral consciousness are capable of discerning right from wrong, even if their consciences are poorly formed. Having a bad upbringing and a poorly formed conscience certainly can be mitigating -- but God has written what the law requires on our hearts (Romans 2:15). Human societies have almost universally understood adultery, theft, murder and the like to be wrong -- because their harm to others is self-evident. Any person having reason is able to see this, and is without excuse, even if they have no law (Romans 2:14-16). A child or a mentally retarded person who lacks moral consciousness is not able to discern or understand this, and therefore is not culpable.