Many of Paul's letters to the churches open with "I, Paul, called to be an apostle" .. or even more pronounced than that in Galatians .. "Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead". Christ personally spoke to Paul on the Damascus road. Paul, the author of over half the NT written under the inspiration of God. The bible does not teach that there are others similar today. I have often asked for those who claim that there is to name one ? Can you ?
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Many of Paul's letters to the churches open with "I, Paul, called to be an apostle" .. or even more pronounced than that in Galatians .. "Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead". Christ personally spoke to Paul on the Damascus road. Paul, the author of over half the NT written under the inspiration of God. The bible does not teach that there are others similar today. I have often asked for those who claim that there is to name one ? Can you ?
There is still an element of seeing in the future to reveal what is to come in New Testament prophets as seen in Agabus.
Acts 11:27-28 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] Now at this time some prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] One of them named Agabus stood up and began to indicate by the Spirit that there would certainly be a great famine all over the world. And this took place in the reign of Claudius.
Acts 11:27-28 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] Now at this time some prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] One of them named Agabus stood up and began to indicate by the Spirit that there would certainly be a great famine all over the world. And this took place in the reign of Claudius.
Well, at least the guy that held the robes of those that killed him....
I'm still wondering why (as I and a couple of others have mentioned before) the apostles listed the "requirements" for the replacement of Judas as one of the 12....
I still think that the original 12.. the original "apostles" were special in some way. They weren't simply "called out" or "sent out", as many disciples were.... their role was much more significant than that, and for THAT role, there were requirements, as listed in scripture.
THOSE are the apostles, or that TYPE of apostle that I believe does not exist today.
Yes, many (all?) of us are called out... many of us are sent out.. so in THAT sense, we could be called apostles... the strict, grammatical sense of the word.
But, the type of apostles that the 12 (24?) were? I don't think we have anything like that.. and haven't since the last one died. They were special...
Strictly my opinion, of course...
I'm still wondering why (as I and a couple of others have mentioned before) the apostles listed the "requirements" for the replacement of Judas as one of the 12....
I still think that the original 12.. the original "apostles" were special in some way. They weren't simply "called out" or "sent out", as many disciples were.... their role was much more significant than that, and for THAT role, there were requirements, as listed in scripture.
THOSE are the apostles, or that TYPE of apostle that I believe does not exist today.
Yes, many (all?) of us are called out... many of us are sent out.. so in THAT sense, we could be called apostles... the strict, grammatical sense of the word.
But, the type of apostles that the 12 (24?) were? I don't think we have anything like that.. and haven't since the last one died. They were special...
Strictly my opinion, of course...
B
You make a valid point indeed, and they were special mostly that is of today's believers of coarse, IMO on what Jesus might have view them, He didn't pick the highly esteemed but just normal everyday people, I feel as Jesus still looks upon people in the same way.. He sent 72 disciples out and they preformed miracles also.
In the end it wasn't any of the main 12 disciples who had the courage to approach The authorities to obtained the body of Christ but another disciples who came to do that.
In the end it wasn't any of the main 12 disciples who had the courage to approach The authorities to obtained the body of Christ but another disciples who came to do that.
Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 652: ἀπόστολος
ἀπόστολος, ἀποστόλου, ὁ;1. a delegate, messenger, one sent forth with orders (Herodotus 1, 21; 5, 38; for שָׁלוּחַ in 1 Kings 14:6 (Alex.); rabbinical שְׁלִיחַ): John 13:16 (where ὁ ἀπόστολος and ὁ πέμψας αὐτόν are contrasted); followed by a genitive, as τῶν ἐκκλησιῶν, 2 Corinthians 8:23; Philippians 2:25; ἀπόστολον ... τῆς ὁμολογίας ἡμῶν the apostle whom we confess, of Christ, God's chief messenger, who has brought the κλῆσις ἀπουρανιος, as compared with Moses, whom the Jews confess, Hebrews 3:1.
2. Specially applied to the twelve disciples whom Christ selected, out of the multitude of his adherents, to be his constant companions and the heralds to proclaim to men the kingdom of God: Matthew 10:1-4; Luke 6:13; Acts 1:26; Revelation 21:14, and often, but nowhere in the Gospel and Epistles of John; ("the word ἀπόστολος occurs 79 times in the N. T., and of these 68 instances are in St. Luke and St. Paul." Lightfoot). With these apostles Paul claimed equality, because through a heavenly intervention he had been appointed by the ascended Christ himself to preach the gospel among the Gentiles, and owed his knowledge of the way of salvation not to man's instruction but to direct revelation from Christ himself, and moreover had evinced his apostolic qualifications by many signal proofs: Galatians 1:1, 11; Galatians 2:8; 1 Corinthians 1:17; 1 Corinthians 9:1; 1 Corinthians 15:8-10; 2 Corinthians 3:2ff; 12:12; 1 Timothy 2:7; 2 Timothy 1:11, cf. Acts 26:12-20. According to Paul, apostles surpassed as well the various other orders of Christian teachers (cf. διδάσκαλος,εὐαγγελιστής, προφήτης), as also the rest of those on whom the special gifts (cf. χάρισμα) of the Holy Spirit had been bestowed, by receiving a richer and more copious conferment of the Spirit: 1 Corinthians 12:28; Ephesians 4:11. Certain false teachers are rated sharply for arrogating to themselves the name and authority of apostles of Christ: 2 Corinthians 11:5, 13; Revelation 2:2.
3. In a broader sense the name is transferred to other eminent Christian teachers; as Barnabas, Acts 14:14, and perhaps also Timothy and Silvanus, 1 Thessalonians 2:7 (6), cf. too Romans 16:7 (?). But in Luke 11:49; Ephesians 3:5; Revelation 18:20, 'apostles' is to be taken in the narrower sense. (On the application of the term see especially Lightfoot on Galatians, pp. 92-101; Harnack, on 'Teaching etc. 11, 3 [ET]; cf. BB. DD. under the word)
Are there apostles today? Has to be, since they're listed in the ministries of the church.
One sent on a mission..... missionaries, anyone? One sent to evangelize, teach doctrine, start churches, & circuit the country they're sent to visit the churches to check on them & bring reproof & discipline. Sounds like a missionary to me. But not all of them, for not all missionaries have this much responsibility.
STRONGS NT 652: ἀπόστολος
ἀπόστολος, ἀποστόλου, ὁ;1. a delegate, messenger, one sent forth with orders (Herodotus 1, 21; 5, 38; for שָׁלוּחַ in 1 Kings 14:6 (Alex.); rabbinical שְׁלִיחַ): John 13:16 (where ὁ ἀπόστολος and ὁ πέμψας αὐτόν are contrasted); followed by a genitive, as τῶν ἐκκλησιῶν, 2 Corinthians 8:23; Philippians 2:25; ἀπόστολον ... τῆς ὁμολογίας ἡμῶν the apostle whom we confess, of Christ, God's chief messenger, who has brought the κλῆσις ἀπουρανιος, as compared with Moses, whom the Jews confess, Hebrews 3:1.
2. Specially applied to the twelve disciples whom Christ selected, out of the multitude of his adherents, to be his constant companions and the heralds to proclaim to men the kingdom of God: Matthew 10:1-4; Luke 6:13; Acts 1:26; Revelation 21:14, and often, but nowhere in the Gospel and Epistles of John; ("the word ἀπόστολος occurs 79 times in the N. T., and of these 68 instances are in St. Luke and St. Paul." Lightfoot). With these apostles Paul claimed equality, because through a heavenly intervention he had been appointed by the ascended Christ himself to preach the gospel among the Gentiles, and owed his knowledge of the way of salvation not to man's instruction but to direct revelation from Christ himself, and moreover had evinced his apostolic qualifications by many signal proofs: Galatians 1:1, 11; Galatians 2:8; 1 Corinthians 1:17; 1 Corinthians 9:1; 1 Corinthians 15:8-10; 2 Corinthians 3:2ff; 12:12; 1 Timothy 2:7; 2 Timothy 1:11, cf. Acts 26:12-20. According to Paul, apostles surpassed as well the various other orders of Christian teachers (cf. διδάσκαλος,εὐαγγελιστής, προφήτης), as also the rest of those on whom the special gifts (cf. χάρισμα) of the Holy Spirit had been bestowed, by receiving a richer and more copious conferment of the Spirit: 1 Corinthians 12:28; Ephesians 4:11. Certain false teachers are rated sharply for arrogating to themselves the name and authority of apostles of Christ: 2 Corinthians 11:5, 13; Revelation 2:2.
3. In a broader sense the name is transferred to other eminent Christian teachers; as Barnabas, Acts 14:14, and perhaps also Timothy and Silvanus, 1 Thessalonians 2:7 (6), cf. too Romans 16:7 (?). But in Luke 11:49; Ephesians 3:5; Revelation 18:20, 'apostles' is to be taken in the narrower sense. (On the application of the term see especially Lightfoot on Galatians, pp. 92-101; Harnack, on 'Teaching etc. 11, 3 [ET]; cf. BB. DD. under the word)
Are there apostles today? Has to be, since they're listed in the ministries of the church.
One sent on a mission..... missionaries, anyone? One sent to evangelize, teach doctrine, start churches, & circuit the country they're sent to visit the churches to check on them & bring reproof & discipline. Sounds like a missionary to me. But not all of them, for not all missionaries have this much responsibility.
A
Ephesians 2:20
20 | being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the chief corner stone;
the church must be built upon the apostles said the bible
the question is: upon dead apostle or living???
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
so if there are living evangelists in the church, or pastors or teachers,
There must be a living apostle, it's obvious
20 | being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the chief corner stone;
the church must be built upon the apostles said the bible
the question is: upon dead apostle or living???
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
so if there are living evangelists in the church, or pastors or teachers,
There must be a living apostle, it's obvious
A
2Corinthians 11:13 - 15
13 | For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, fashioning themselves into apostles of Christ.
14 | And no marvel; for even Satan fashioneth himself into an angel of light.
15 | It is no great thing therefore if his ministers also fashion themselves as ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.
the bible said that there are false apostles, but they look like apostles of Christ,
the question is: Does it speak about the 12 apostles?
No, not only there are more than 12, we know there are Paul and Barnabas, and Paul said:
2Corinthians 11:5
5 | For I reckon that I am not a whit behind the very chiefest apostles.
there is no difference
so if there are false apostles, there must be apostles of Christ...
if there are false...there are true 1Corinthians 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you,...
till now, Satan have fashioned himself into an angel of light
till now, there have been false apostles who preach deceit and wrong salvation
It means that apostles of Christ have been still in existence and they always have preached the truth
false apostles always continu their work, and when one of them deads, someone else takes its place, this is an endless cycle
the apostles of christ also have an endless cycle, if some of them dead, someone else takes their place, see Mattias, Paul and Barnabas
John 14:18
18 | I will not leave you desolate: I come unto you.
13 | For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, fashioning themselves into apostles of Christ.
14 | And no marvel; for even Satan fashioneth himself into an angel of light.
15 | It is no great thing therefore if his ministers also fashion themselves as ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.
the bible said that there are false apostles, but they look like apostles of Christ,
the question is: Does it speak about the 12 apostles?
No, not only there are more than 12, we know there are Paul and Barnabas, and Paul said:
2Corinthians 11:5
5 | For I reckon that I am not a whit behind the very chiefest apostles.
there is no difference
so if there are false apostles, there must be apostles of Christ...
if there are false...there are true 1Corinthians 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you,...
till now, Satan have fashioned himself into an angel of light
till now, there have been false apostles who preach deceit and wrong salvation
It means that apostles of Christ have been still in existence and they always have preached the truth
false apostles always continu their work, and when one of them deads, someone else takes its place, this is an endless cycle
the apostles of christ also have an endless cycle, if some of them dead, someone else takes their place, see Mattias, Paul and Barnabas
John 14:18
18 | I will not leave you desolate: I come unto you.
A
1Kings 18:22
22 | Then said Elijah unto the people, I, even I only, am left a prophet of Jehovah; but Baal's prophets are four hundred and fifty men.
till the story, there have been false and there have been right prophet(of Christ),
whenever people of God exist, God never let them alone
even at the time of Elijah, when he was the only one alive, it's not possible that all prophet of Christ dead
Ecclesiastes 1:9
9 | That which hath been is that which shall be; and that which hath been done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
There always someone who takes their place,
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
22 | Then said Elijah unto the people, I, even I only, am left a prophet of Jehovah; but Baal's prophets are four hundred and fifty men.
till the story, there have been false and there have been right prophet(of Christ),
whenever people of God exist, God never let them alone
even at the time of Elijah, when he was the only one alive, it's not possible that all prophet of Christ dead
Ecclesiastes 1:9
9 | That which hath been is that which shall be; and that which hath been done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
There always someone who takes their place,
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
These Churches which try to "do away" with things are sad------Apostles are part of the Church according to Ephesians 4----until the return of Christ----Israel has not been replaced by the Church (Romans 11:1, 27-29)----Gary Summers was correct---- disunity will be in the Church----when people study the Word----because many denominations are stripping things out of God's Word------this is the same spirit that tried to "disqualify" Christ when He walked the Earth---religion picks and chooses truth----God doesn't----He just lays it out there...
A
why not?
if you accept the existence of pastors? why not apostles?
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
if you accept the existence of pastors? why not apostles?
Ephesians 4:11 - 12
11 | And he gave some 'to be' apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 | for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
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