Not By Works

[Ariel82]

If you teach repentance and conviction of sin by the Holy spirit, then you don't teach "hyper grace" or "easy believism".

If you don't preach about the need to put to death the flesh and live by the spirit,,,,then you aren't teaching biblical grace or the Gospel message.

Just like if you teach that works are required to be saved you are not teaching that salvation is by faith.

 

[stillness]

"I everything give thanks, we should be thankful for those who those who tell us we can do nothing, causing the power of the Holy spirit to empower those who are not ofended.

 

[Grace777x70]

This is a complete lie and no one has ever said that Christians don't repent - in fact people say the complete opposite of what you are saying. This is a prime example of making statements that are not even remotely true and thinking they are real.

This leads to another common mis-representing of what is really being said by the accusations of others that don't agree with some things about repentance. It 'conflicts" with their church teachings.

People are free to disagree but at the very least let's stop the deceitful behavior of mis-representing what is really being said.

Objection #3: Hyper-Grace Preachers Don’t Believe in Repentance

Not only do we believe in repentance, but we seek to understand and teach it thoroughly and accurately.

In the New Testament, “to repent” is a translation of the Greek verb “metanoeo” meaning “to change one’s mind or perspective.”

Obviously, when we receive Christ, we have repented in the genuine sense of the term – changing our minds about our need of a Savior and receiving Christ.

Before Christ, we lived as self-sufficiently as possible, thinking that God would probably grade on a curve and accept us at least partly on the basis of our own best efforts and self-generated goodness. When we came to understand our spiritual bankruptcy and our desperate need for Christ’s forgiveness and new life, we repented (had a change of perspective) and received Christ by trusting in Him alone to rescue us.

Beyond this initial experience of “getting saved” (as we often call it), repentance is a daily lifestyle in which an ongoing “renewal of the mind” process is taking place within us. As we grow in faith and in our understanding of God through His Word and our union with His Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 6:17), we begin to replace old thinking with new thinking and false thinking with true thinking.

This renewal of the mind (Rom. 12:1-3) is an integral part of the transformative process of the Spirit’s work in our lives. This is the essence of a lifestyle of repentance – taking false thoughts captive, making them obedient to (in conformity with) Christ (2 Cor. 10:5).

Paul affirmed in no uncertain terms that God’s kindness (His expressed grace toward us) is what leads to repentance (Rom. 2:4).

Far from being anti-repentance, hyper-grace theology affirms repentance and the ongoing renewal of the mind as an integral part of what it means to follow Jesus under His New Covenant.

Why I am Hyper-Grace: Answering Five Common Objections

 

[stonesoffire]

The middle sentence Ariel. We don't put our flesh to death. God has circumcised the flesh from us, and we are dead to sin, but alive to God through the Cross of Jesus and His death. Risen with Him in His resurrection.
We reckon or believe this is so daily. Eventually it becomes a part of us, and we live then in the resurrection power of Jesus. By Holy Spirit.

 

[Ariel82]

Actually, you don't have to know everything about a minister to prove whether he's a fake or not.

Investigate who he runs with & preaches with. A true man of God will know those he preaches with & runs with.

For instance, most televangelists will run with/preach with other false preachers/teachers.

A true man of God will guard his heart & his reputation.

Elijah preached in a crowd of false prophet's.

It's not who you preach with but who you endorse and say is A shepherd when they are really wolves,,

That is either showing a lack of discernment or a wolf acknowldging a packmate.

However King solomon had altars built to false gods,,,,yet his words are in proverbs, song of somgs, ecc.,

How do you explain that?

 

[Ariel82]

The middle sentence Ariel. We don't put our flesh to death. God has circumcised the flesh from us, and we are dead to sin, but alive to God through the Cross of Jesus and His death. Risen with Him in His resurrection.
We reckon or believe this is so daily. Eventually it becomes a part of us, and we live then in the resurrection power of Jesus. By Holy Spirit.

We acknowlledge the dead flesh needs to be removed and not cling to it like a cancerous zombie lover.

Some people sacrifice much to their freshly altars to their dead selves,

God tells us not to be double minded and adulterous

 

[Stephen63]

If you ever get a grasp of context you would make an excellent witness for JESUS......until then and while posting the twisted statements you make without context, you are only helping the side that ends up in a place with higher than normal temps and no liquid.......I stand amazed at your inability to be honest with context and verbiage in order to push the false gospel that you push!

Nearly every time I see you posting to willybob, I see you demeaning him & treating him like crap while he does nothing of the sort to you.

Regardless of what anyone thinks of what he believes (I think well of him), nobody on CC deserves the treatment you give him.

Jesus is right..... you'll know them by their fruits.

Nooo..... you will not know them by what they SAY they believe, you will know them by what they DO.

What exactly ARE you doing?!?

 

[stonesoffire]

We acknowlledge the dead flesh needs to be removed and not cling to it like a cancerous zombie lover.

Some people sacrifice much to their freshly altars to their dead selves,

God tells us not to be double minded and adulterous

That doesn't even make sense Ariel. The born again believer loves God. Wants His image to be formed, and desires Holiness.

This is deposited in our Spirit and we are sealed then. Have you not read that we have been given everything pertaining to godliness?

Our soul, our mind will be taught what God intends for us. This is the new creation man of God.

 

[Ariel82]

I am gonna drop the whole "hyper grace" discussion G777 because I would rather talk about BIBLICAL GRACE

If they are the same thing,good, if not.,,,i would rather discuss the Light and not the darkness of lies and heresies expect to reveal what God actually teaches via the Bible.

 

[Grace777x70]

The middle sentence Ariel. We don't put our flesh to death. God has circumcised the flesh from us, and we are dead to sin, but alive to God through the Cross of Jesus and His death. Risen with Him in His resurrection.
We reckon or believe this is so daily. Eventually it becomes a part of us, and we live then in the resurrection power of Jesus. By Holy Spirit.

Amen. The gospel of the grace of God has been so watered down by religion that the church is in a mess and we have remained babies trying to effect a behavior modification program for the flesh.

Those that are Christ "have the flesh crucified now". It's a reality.

It's called the circumcision of the flesh and of the heart. Col. 2:11 - also called the circumcision of Christ where the inner man in Christ is 'cut away" from the body of flesh where the power of sin still dwells. Rom. 7:17-22

This is what is meant in Rom. 8:9 about being " in the spirit and not in the flesh".

Galatians 5:24-25 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.

Have crucified = is in the Aorist indicative which means a one time event in the past that is completed.

As you say - we reckon ( which is an accounting term that says it is true because it's already done ) ourselves to be dead to sin which resides in the flesh. But we are not in the flesh but in the spirit. Rom. 8:9

Romans 8:9-10 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.

Notice the term "belong to Christ" in both Gal 5 and in Rom. 8.

 

[Stephen63]

The "if" seems to state otherwise......

I don't see that at all.

How is it folks state plainly & you still spin it to something else?

 

[Grace777x70]

I am gonna drop the whole "hyper grace" discussion G777 because I would rather talk about BIBLICAL GRACE

If they are the same thing,good, if not.,,,i would rather discuss the Light and not the darkness of lies and heresies expect to reveal what God actually teaches via the Bible.

I agree ...This is where labels become meaningless accusations. Let's drop the derogatory term that others have coined in order to malign the gospel of the grace of God in Christ's work.

 

[Ariel82]

That doesn't even make sense Ariel. The born again believer loves God. Wants His image to be formed, and desires Holiness.

This is deposited in our Spirit and we are sealed then. Have you not read that we have been given everything pertaining to godliness?

Our soul, our mind will be taught what God intends for us. This is the new creation man of God.

Why then does God tell believers not to be double minded?

Why does God say to add to your faith if love of God and maturity in Christ automatic?

Why say walk in the spirit and deny the flesh if the battle is already won?

 

[stonesoffire]

2Pe 1:3 His divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through the full knowledge of the one who called us by his own glory and excellence.

 

[Ariel82]

Galatians 6 ►
English Standard Version

1Brothers,a if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. 2Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. 3For if anyone thinks he is something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself. 4But let each one test his own work, and then his reason to boast will be in himself alone and not in his neighbor. 5For each will have to bear his own load.

6Let the one who is taught the word share all good things with the one who teaches. 7Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. 8For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. 9And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. 10So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone,

*****

How does your theology explain why the warning against "sowing in the flesh" is given, if you are perfect "spirit man" upon being born again?

 

[Ariel82]

2Pe 1:3 His divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through the full knowledge of the one who called us by his own glory and excellence.

Keep reading.,, it talks about adding to your faith.,

 

[stonesoffire]

Why then does God tell believers not to be double minded?



Hes talking about faith in a promise. That a double minded man is unstable in all his ways. It's like saying one day I believe God wants to heal me. Then cannot walk it out in faith to the end of receiving the promise. Being up and down in belief.



Why does God say to add to your faith if love of God and maturity in Christ automatic?


I said in our Spirit we have received the deposit of the Spirit of Christ when born again, and is the power to live. But, our soul is what is saved, first as a babe, then young man, then father or mature. That's according to 1John. Our minds need renewed by the Word. Taught by Holy Spirit. And the 5 fold ministry.



Why say walk in the spirit and deny the flesh if the battle is already won?


Oh, we will battle until we realize, that we rest in His victory. There's the power. Hard to believe it's so simple, but true.

This is Romans 7, then the realization is 8.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

The "if" seems to state otherwise......

I just think you do away with abiding by removing the if. It is only on one point I disagree but to me, that point is everything. Continuing in trust is putting my hand to the plow and not turning back to me. The one point that we disagree on is that continuing in trust is necessary. I just can't accept that the very trust through which He saved me by grace is now optional. I can't toss it out as optional. I just can't. It is how He saved me, by His kindness, through trust. I will examine myself to see if I really am in that trust and will take seriously when I see any area of mistrust or compromise. I will have to answer to Him one day so I have to follow my conscience just as you do. If I am found wrong in taking trust so seriously that I think if I don't remain in that trust there is possibility of being disqualified, then I trust Him to do what is good and right concerning me. We all must follow our conscience in the matter.

 

[stonesoffire]

Keep reading.,, it talks about adding to your faith.,

yes, Peter is telling us then what more we have.

2Pe 1:4 Through these he has given us his precious and wonderful promises, so that through them you may participate in the divine nature, seeing that you have escaped the corruption that is in the world caused by evil desires.

 

[Ariel82]

We acknowlledge the dead flesh needs to be removed and not cling to it like a cancerous zombie lover.

Some people sacrifice much to their freshly altars to their dead selves,

God tells us not to be double minded and adulterous

Here are the Bible verses...maybe they will make more sense tha, my words.

James 4 ►
English Standard Versio

1What causes quarrels and what causes fights among you? Is it not this, that your passionsa are at war within you?b 2You desire and do not have, so you murder. You covet and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have, because you do not ask. 3You ask and do not receive, because you ask wrongly, to spend it on your passions. 4You adulterous people!c Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God. 5Or do you suppose it is to no purpose that the Scripture says, “He yearns jealously over the spirit that he has made to dwell in us”?