Not By Works

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,981
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#35,981
PHart said:
So I DON'T have to continue to believe the cross is enough because I did that already in the past? Peter says it is through faith that I am kept for the Day of Salvation. Are you saying I'm still kept for the Day of Salvation without faith?
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AGAIN...you miss the mark.....

WHAT part of

BEGIN, FINISH and COMPLETE do you not get when it comes to faith and salvation?

What part of SAVED TO THE UTTERMOST and KEPT by HIS POWER do you not get?

IT IS HIS WORK and to believe as you do states clearly that JESUS did not begin, cannot finish, complete, save to the uttermost and keep you by his power......

THAT is exactly what you say by your stance regardless of how you twist it, embellish it and or play word games....
 
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PHart

Guest
#35,982
#35,982
dcontroversal said:
Nice try....now quote the verse....pretty sure it does not say what you imply......feeling like bringing back the cake taker statement.....
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22“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell." (Matthew 5:22 NASB)
 
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UnderGrace

Guest
#35,983
#35,983
believing 'the cross is enough'
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So if a person came to have doubt/some level of unbelief because they had committed an egregious sin that Jesus not have possibly bore the penalty for that sin......... God would send them to hell?

So you need to wake up every day and remind yourself that every sin is covered because if you should have some doubt on that fact you could loose your salvation?

Is God so fickle towards us?

That is not the God I serve...sorry no way!!




PHart said:
You must keep believing 'the cross is enough' in order to be saved on the Day of Salvation. How you think that's a works gospel is astounding. You can not go back from the cross and still be saved on the Last Day. That's not a works gospel.
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PHart

Guest
#35,984
#35,984
dcontroversal said:
AGAIN...you miss the mark.....

WHAT part of

BEGIN, FINISH and COMPLETE do you not get when it comes to faith and salvation?

What part of SAVED TO THE UTTERMOST and KEPT by HIS POWER do you not get?

IT IS HIS WORK and to believe as you do states clearly that JESUS did not begin, cannot finish, complete, save to the uttermost and keep you by his power......

THAT is exactly what you say by your stance regardless of how you twist it, embellish it and or play word games....
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What do I do with all the scriptures exhorting me to keep believing?
Before you answer, think very carefully about how I'm going to respond....very carefully.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,985
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#35,985
PHart said:
22“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell." (Matthew 5:22 NASB)
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Yeah...nice...I never called him a GRACELESS WRETCH or a fool.....so again you embellishers and scripture twisters try to say I said something I did not say....as bad as lying....
 
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UnderGrace

Guest
#35,986
#35,986
Well none of us stand a chance, that is why we need Jesus!!!

That is the point....it was pointing to Jesus


PHart said:
22“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell." (Matthew 5:22 NASB)
Click to expand...
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

Senior Member
#35,987
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#35,987
PHart said:
22“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell." (Matthew 5:22 NASB)
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False accusation...he implied none of the above.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,988
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#35,988
PHart said:
What do I do with all the scriptures exhorting me to keep believing?
Before you answer, think very carefully about how I'm going to respond....very carefully.
Click to expand...
I could care less what you say....You have not answered the verses I gave...and they cannot be negated by anything that you use out of context....so....NEXT...
 
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PHart

Guest
#35,989
#35,989
UnderGrace said:
So if a person came to have doubt/some level of unbelief because they had committed an egregious sin that Jesus not have possibly bore the penalty for that sin......... God would send them to hell?
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No, Christians do not go to hell for screwing up.
You go to hell for not believing in Christ anymore and then screwing up because you don't believe in Christ anymore.


UnderGrace said:
So you need to wake up every day and remind yourself that every sin is covered because if you should have some doubt on that fact you could loose your salvation?
Click to expand...
No, not even doubt can forfeit your salvation. Only your determined, willing decision to go back to unbelief can forfeit the salvation you have in Christ.


UnderGrace said:
Is God so fickle towards us?

That is not the God I serve...sorry no way!!
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I don't either. But hopefully I've explained the God you do serve.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,990
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#35,990
preacher4truth said:
False accusation...he implied none of the above.
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AMEN....no big surprise that they use scripture out of context to falsely accuse me...they do the same thing with Jesus....their very verbiage states that JESUS is weak, does not start, finish and complete the work of faith he began in us....man...I am Glad my JESUS is actually GOD and finishes what he starts and keeps his promises......
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#35,991
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#35,991
preacher4truth said:
False teachers such as yourself always like it when others will lend them an ear.
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pt4 - Hi. .......... I always get that sinking feeling, when the sludge is about to bubble
up again. Strange this happens every time you appear.

Is there a connection between the sludge and stench with the contribution made.

The Lord says out of the mouth comes things the heart is full of.
 
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PHart

Guest
#35,992
#35,992
dcontroversal said:
I could care less what you say....You have not answered the verses I gave...and they cannot be negated by anything that you use out of context....so....NEXT...
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There is no argument I can not challenge using the Bible.
 
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PHart

Guest
#35,993
#35,993
dcontroversal said:
Yeah...nice...I never called him a GRACELESS WRETCH or a fool.....so again you embellishers and scripture twisters try to say I said something I did not say....as bad as lying....
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Don't explain it to me. You have to settle accounts with him, not me, before you can approach God in worship again (Matthew 5:23). I'm confident he will accept you with the loving open arms of Jesus. Try it.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,994
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#35,994
PHart said:
No, Christians do not go to hell for screwing up.
You go to hell for not believing in Christ anymore and then screwing up because you don't believe in Christ anymore.



No, not even doubt can forfeit your salvation. Only your determined, willing decision to go back to unbelief can forfeit the salvation you have in Christ.



I don't either. But hopefully I've explained the God you do serve.
Click to expand...

There is it folks....a works based dogma....JESUS WILL leave you, will forsake you, Jesus cannot finish what HE BEGAN, Jesus does not save you to the uttermost, Jesus does not keep you by his power, Jesus will allow something to separate you from his presence, Jesus will not complete the work he began, Jesus does not really give eternal life, you have not been SEALED by the H.S., you are not in the Father's hand and not in the Son's hand....WE are greater than GOD........

What a sad day...we learn through PHART that JESUS is not who he states he is and is inept to keep his promises.....we are all doomed.....
 
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UnderGrace

Guest
#35,995
#35,995
Well we hope you are reconsidering, PHart we just want you to be secure in your salvation, anything less is not really salvation is it?

PHart said:
There is no argument I can not challenge using the Bible.
Click to expand...
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

Senior Member
#35,996
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
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#35,996
PHart said:
There is no argument I can not challenge using the Bible.
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And you're proud of that? JW's make the same claim.

Interesting, you just talked about a preacher, only one, that didn't think he knew it all. Now you're implying you do know it all.

Let's put the above quote into perspective: you're already using (misusing) the Bible in feeble attempt to disprove the sufficiency of Christ.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,997
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#35,997
PHart said:
Don't explain it to me. You have to settle accounts with him, not me, before you can approach God in worship again (Matthew 5:23). I'm confident he will accept you with the loving open arms of Jesus. Try it.
Click to expand...
I have nothing to settle with him....His words speak loud and clear...go read his quotes....He denies the cross and the imputed righteousness of Christ....nothing else to say.....when he can be honest and own his own words and not falsely accuse me....then and only then can we have dialogue....
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#35,998
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#35,998
PHart said:
There is no argument I can not challenge using the Bible.
Click to expand...
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA that is hilarious....what the Preacher said above and UnderGrace........WOW......learn verb tense, context and honesty with the scriptures....then and only then you might be able to do what you say....
 
P

PHart

Guest
#35,999
#35,999
preacher4truth said:
And you're proud of that? JW's make the same claim.

Interesting, you just talked about a preacher, only one, that didn't think he knew it all. Now you're implying you do know it all.

Let's put the above quote into perspective: you're already using (misusing) the Bible in feeble attempt to disprove the sufficiency of Christ.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure you folks are the ones who are claiming inerrant, proven doctrine. Not me. I can level an honest Biblical challenge to anything you folks say regarding this subject. Not because I'm great, but because I've been through this so many times I'm trained in it, that's all. I understand your doctrine better than you do. That's why I'm able to point out the contradictions that you yourselves can not see.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#36,000
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#36,000
There is always a problem answering a fool to his folly, he thinks one is justifying
his position, because one hopes they will see sense, but the fool is way beyond this.

Mr Hart, I admire your patience, but these guys see only the letter and not the meaning.
The meaning holds no fear for them, because the believe God will not touch them.

Ironic, because on that day He does their building will shatter never to be rebuilt.
What Jesus shared was not a judgement but a warning of the emotional and
spiritual realities of ignoring His word. No God fearing in them, and they are proud
of that, because fear is sin, like recognising sin within is denial of Christs victory.

No more lost group I have found than this, about to go over the waterfall believing
they are safe.
 
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