Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
The nonsense was found in your all encompassing quote.....
Originally Posted by Hizikyah
There is no such thing as faith that does not obey.
Our Justification: the imputed righteous of Jesus Christ
"For in it the righteousness of God is revealed "from faith to faith;" as it is written, "BUT THE RIGHTEOUS man SHALL LIVE BY FAITH."
Quote: Monergism.com
Paul is making the point that if Adam's disobedience to the law of God was the reason for death, then Jesus full obedience to all the prescriptions of the divine law unto death is what brings us righteousness.
"For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous." Rom5:19
"He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him." 2Cor5:21
"But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption."1Cor1:30
"He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."2Cor5:2
Your works will not merit you eternal life but Jesus Christ perfect obedience will.
Attribute: https://www.monergism.com/topics/justification/imputation/righteousness
"For in it the righteousness of God is revealed "from faith to faith;" as it is written, "BUT THE RIGHTEOUS man SHALL LIVE BY FAITH."
Quote: Monergism.com
Paul is making the point that if Adam's disobedience to the law of God was the reason for death, then Jesus full obedience to all the prescriptions of the divine law unto death is what brings us righteousness.
"For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous." Rom5:19
"He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him." 2Cor5:21
"But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption."1Cor1:30
"He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."2Cor5:2
Your works will not merit you eternal life but Jesus Christ perfect obedience will.
Attribute: https://www.monergism.com/topics/justification/imputation/righteousness
The bolded is backwards.....cart before the ox.......read Romans 3.....and Corinthians......a lost man cannot obey....the natural man is not subject unto the law of God and neither indeed can be.....
And my bible states clearly....
It pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. <--bible
It pleased God to save them that OBEY, jump through hoops, keep the commandments and run as fast as they can. <--your version
And my bible states clearly....
It pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. <--bible
It pleased God to save them that OBEY, jump through hoops, keep the commandments and run as fast as they can. <--your version
J
You completely overlooked dcontroversal's post how ridiculous,he wasn't saying anything about a person having no sin in order to obey God,he was establishing that salvation is eternal,a person still sins thereafter but for the most part will eventually have a desire to do right by God,you made up an accusation and then tried to justify it,and yet you call dcontroversal silly?
You just acted in a preposterous manner,how is your view better when you rely on unjustified claims?
bizarre how people can be so one sided and flat out lie,yet claim to be saved or at the least claim Jesus,but tis all apart of God's plan I suppose.
You just acted in a preposterous manner,how is your view better when you rely on unjustified claims?
bizarre how people can be so one sided and flat out lie,yet claim to be saved or at the least claim Jesus,but tis all apart of God's plan I suppose.
There is no "as a jew" or "as a gentile"
You have need to learn the basic principles of the Word.
Jeremiah 31:33, "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people."
Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."
Psalm 105:6-9, "O seed of Abraham His servant, You children of Yaaqob, His chosen ones! He is YHWH our Father! His judgments are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, the Law He commanded for a thousand generations; Which He made; ratified, established, with Abraham, and vowed by His oath to Isaac. He confirmed it; let it stand, to Yaaqob for a Law, and to Israyl for an everlasting covenant."
Galatians 3:27-29, “For as many of you as were immersed into Messiah have put on Messiah. There is not Yehuḏi nor Greek, there is not slave nor free, there is not male and female, for you are all one in Messiah יהושע. And if you are of Messiah, then you are seed of Aḇraham, and heirs according to promise.”
Rom 11:16-31, “Now if the first-fruit is set-apart, the lump is also. And if the root is set-apart, so are the branches. And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, have been grafted in among them, and came to share the root and fatness of the olive tree, do not boast against the branches. And if you boast, remember: you do not bear the root, but the root bears you! You shall say then, “The branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” Good! By unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by belief. Do not be arrogant, but fear. For if Yah did not spare the natural branches, He might not spare you either. See then the kindness and sharpness of Yah: on those who fell sharpness, but toward you kindness, if you continue in His kindness, otherwise you also shall be cut off. And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, shall be grafted in, for Yah is able to graft them in again. For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree, how much more shall these who are the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? For I do not wish you to be ignorant of this secret, brothers, lest you should be wise in your own estimation, that hardening in part has come over Yisra’ĕl, until the completeness of the gentiles has come in. And so all Yisra’ĕl shall be saved, as it has been written, “The Deliverer shall come out of Tsiyon, and He shall turn away wickedness from Ya‛aqoḇ, and this is My covenant with them, when I take away their sins. Truly, as regards the Good News they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. For the gifts and the calling of Yah are not to be repented of. For as you also at one time disobeyed Yah, but now have obtained compassion through their disobedience, so also these have now disobeyed, that through the compassion shown you they also might obtain compassion.”
You have need to learn the basic principles of the Word.
Jeremiah 31:33, "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people."
Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."
Psalm 105:6-9, "O seed of Abraham His servant, You children of Yaaqob, His chosen ones! He is YHWH our Father! His judgments are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, the Law He commanded for a thousand generations; Which He made; ratified, established, with Abraham, and vowed by His oath to Isaac. He confirmed it; let it stand, to Yaaqob for a Law, and to Israyl for an everlasting covenant."
Galatians 3:27-29, “For as many of you as were immersed into Messiah have put on Messiah. There is not Yehuḏi nor Greek, there is not slave nor free, there is not male and female, for you are all one in Messiah יהושע. And if you are of Messiah, then you are seed of Aḇraham, and heirs according to promise.”
Rom 11:16-31, “Now if the first-fruit is set-apart, the lump is also. And if the root is set-apart, so are the branches. And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, have been grafted in among them, and came to share the root and fatness of the olive tree, do not boast against the branches. And if you boast, remember: you do not bear the root, but the root bears you! You shall say then, “The branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” Good! By unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by belief. Do not be arrogant, but fear. For if Yah did not spare the natural branches, He might not spare you either. See then the kindness and sharpness of Yah: on those who fell sharpness, but toward you kindness, if you continue in His kindness, otherwise you also shall be cut off. And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, shall be grafted in, for Yah is able to graft them in again. For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree, how much more shall these who are the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? For I do not wish you to be ignorant of this secret, brothers, lest you should be wise in your own estimation, that hardening in part has come over Yisra’ĕl, until the completeness of the gentiles has come in. And so all Yisra’ĕl shall be saved, as it has been written, “The Deliverer shall come out of Tsiyon, and He shall turn away wickedness from Ya‛aqoḇ, and this is My covenant with them, when I take away their sins. Truly, as regards the Good News they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. For the gifts and the calling of Yah are not to be repented of. For as you also at one time disobeyed Yah, but now have obtained compassion through their disobedience, so also these have now disobeyed, that through the compassion shown you they also might obtain compassion.”
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 Corinthians 6:9-10, “Do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the reign of Yah? Do not be deceived. Neither those who whore, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor greedy of gain, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers shall inherit the reign of Yah.”[/FONT]
Romans 8:1-4
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Well maybe we both have a different view of his post? He weighed faith against each of these men's sins. Was each man he named in that post not obedient to Yah over their lifetime? Yet he mentioned a single sin each one of them did.
It is my point that these men were obedient and that transposing a single sin against their faith was not true to their lives.
It is my point that these men were obedient and that transposing a single sin against their faith was not true to their lives.
Friend there is nothing backwards in what was said. Only those that obey him are Born again. This is the same as saying if you are not Born again you do not obey God. As it is written who so ever is Born of God does not commit sin or he that says I know him and keeps not his commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him...
The scripture is very clear if you have not been Born again you have not received the Holy Spirit because God only gives his Spirit to those that through their faith in His Word obey him.
If your believe does not produce the fruit of obedience it is dead and not the faith that God wants you to have because true faith works through love and love is the fulfilling of Gods law to those that walk in His Spirit
The scripture is very clear if you have not been Born again you have not received the Holy Spirit because God only gives his Spirit to those that through their faith in His Word obey him.
If your believe does not produce the fruit of obedience it is dead and not the faith that God wants you to have because true faith works through love and love is the fulfilling of Gods law to those that walk in His Spirit
Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law* through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law*!"
*“Law” is word # G3551 – nomos, Strong's Concordance, nomos: that which is assigned, hence usage, law, Original Word: νόμος, ου, ὁ, Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine, Transliteration: nomos, Phonetic Spelling: (nom'-os), Short Definition: a law, the Mosaic Law, Definition: usage, custom, law; in NT: of, law in general, plur: of divine laws; of a force or influence impelling to action; of the Mosaic law;, metion: of the books which contain the law, the Pentateuch, the Old Testament scriptures in general
Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"
*What is sin, that we may not continue in it?
1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."
*“Law” is word # G3551 – nomos, Strong's Concordance, nomos: that which is assigned, hence usage, law, Original Word: νόμος, ου, ὁ, Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine, Transliteration: nomos, Phonetic Spelling: (nom'-os), Short Definition: a law, the Mosaic Law, Definition: usage, custom, law; in NT: of, law in general, plur: of divine laws; of a force or influence impelling to action; of the Mosaic law;, metion: of the books which contain the law, the Pentateuch, the Old Testament scriptures in general
Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"
*What is sin, that we may not continue in it?
1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."