Do We Have To Keep The Law?

[JaumeJ]

Because of time enough spent in this particular thread, it is time for me to go, and return when the subject is brought up again.

A always there are those who are quoting, cutting and pasting without truly relating the myriad of texts to each orther or the argument of the poster, while others are clear and concise with obvious understanding of what they are posting.

We truly do know the difference. One is her to undermine the faith of the weak and others are here to edify andexhort. God shows us the distinctions. God bless all. See you in the next one.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Let's see what James says about the law being used to measure someone's righteousness and how what he says measures up to what you say:


"8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,”[SUP]a[/SUP] you are doing right."-James 2:8


James is being pretty clear here. He's plainly saying that the written law (Leviticus 19:18 in this case) is the measure of doing right. But you say we don't use the law to measure that. ​

Yet james also says if we keep the whole law yet fail in one point we are guilty of all.

it seems james understood clearly what paul taught in gal 3,that whoever is under law is under a curse, because as moses made them all confirm an aoth, whoever does not confirm and keep every word is cursed.

Grandpa s right, god did is not going to write the ten commands on our hearts, those things by nature we already know, proven by the fsct paul said gentiles by nature know those commands (know to break those commands it was sin)

it will be a different law he writes, a law of love, something Israel never had, and sadly much of the physical church has never had either.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Yet james also says if we keep the whole law yet fail in one point we are guilty of all.

it seems james understood clearly what paul taught in gal 3,that whoever is under law is under a curse, because as moses made them all confirm an aoth, whoever does not confirm and keep every word is cursed.

Grandpa s right, god did is not going to write the ten commands on our hearts, those things by nature we already know, proven by the fsct paul said gentiles by nature know those commands (know to break those commands it was sin)

it will be a different law he writes, a law of love, something Israel never had, and sadly much of the physical church has never had either.

Are you familiar with the visions of Zechariah? At one stage Zechariah sees the flying scroll and I only want to highlight a few things:
1) Did you notice that there are writings on both sides of the scroll? Usually in Biblical times they only wrote on one side of the scroll or paper, but in this case on both sides. The only other place we find in scripture where something is written on both sides is when God gaveMoses the Ten Commandments.
2) The measurement of the scroll is the exact same measurements as the oracle of the temple where the Ark of the Covenant was kept 1Kings 6

I believe God will write the Ten Commandments on our hearts as it is relevant to Him.

God bless friends

 

[Grandpa]

Are you familiar with the visions of Zechariah? At one stage Zechariah sees the flying scroll and I only want to highlight a few things:
1) Did you notice that there are writings on both sides of the scroll? Usually in Biblical times they only wrote on one side of the scroll or paper, but in this case on both sides. The only other place we find in scripture where something is written on both sides is when God gaveMoses the Ten Commandments.
2) The measurement of the scroll is the exact same measurements as the oracle of the temple where the Ark of the Covenant was kept 1Kings 6

I believe God will write the Ten Commandments on our hearts as it is relevant to Him.

God bless friends

Nope. Can't happen.

2 Corinthians 3:7-9

[SUP]7 [/SUP]But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

[SUP]8 [/SUP]How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
[SUP]9 [/SUP]For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.​

Do you think that when God writes His Law on your heart that it will lead to Righteousness or to Death and Condemnation?

That was basically a kindergarten question. It will of course lead to Righteousness.


Wouldn't it make more sense that Love, Joy and Peace are written on our hearts like the Lord Jesus said He would do rather than the 10 commandments?

Wouldn't it make more sense that the fulfillment of the Ministry of Death and Condemnation would be written on our hearts, therefore giving us Rest like the Lord Jesus said He would do, rather than the Ministry of Death and Condemnation itself?


Of course it would make more sense. But I don't think I can show you this. Only the Lord Jesus can.

2 Corinthians 3:14-16

[SUP]14 [/SUP]But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.​

 

[Endoscopy]

What does the New Testament say about it?

If we are under the Law, we are not led by the Spirit. (Galatians 5:18)

Christ is the end of the Law (Romans 10:4)

No one is justified by the works of the Law (Galatians 2:16)

It has been abolished (Ephesians 2:15)

The Law is not for the Righteous. (1 Timothy 1:8, Galatians 2:21, Romans 3:20)

We can't keep it (James 2:10)

Not even the Jews could (Galatians 6:13)

The Law and faith do not mix (Romans 3:27-28)

If we rely on observing the Law we place ourselves under a curse (Galatians 3:10-11)

The Law is a curse that Jesus redeemed us from (Galatians 3:13)

If we continue in the Law we are fools (Galatians 3:2-3)

We are to live by faith, which the Law is not based on (Galatians 3:11-12)

The Law is lifeless (Galatians 3:21)

The Law only makes us prisoners (Galatians 3:23-25)

We become alienated from Christ (Galatians 5:4)

The Law is weak and makes nothing perfect (Hebrews 7:18-19)

It can never take away sins (Hebrews 10:4)

Paul said he himself was not under the Law (1 Corinthians 9:20)

We have been released from the Law (Romans 7:6)

The Law has been canceled and nailed to the cross (Colossians 2:14)

We are dead to the Law (Romans 7:4)

It is obsolete, outdated, and will disappear (Hebrews 8:13)

We have been justified apart from the Law (Romans 3:21-22, 27-28)

We are under grace, not the Law (Romans 6:14)


Clear enough?

You ignore the simple fact that Jesus said the law is eternal and will end only when the heavens and earth disappear. We acknowledge this every time we admit we sin. The definition of sin is transgression of the law. Christians are not under the penalty of the law but those who reject Jesus will be judged by the law. Woe to them at judgement time! I sincerely believe no one posting here knows all of the 613 laws scattered in the Torah.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Nope. Can't happen.

2 Corinthians 3:7-9

[SUP]7 [/SUP]But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

[SUP]8 [/SUP]How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
[SUP]9 [/SUP]For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.​

Do you think that when God writes His Law on your heart that it will lead to Righteousness or to Death and Condemnation?

That was basically a kindergarten question. It will of course lead to Righteousness.


Wouldn't it make more sense that Love, Joy and Peace are written on our hearts like the Lord Jesus said He would do rather than the 10 commandments?

Wouldn't it make more sense that the fulfillment of the Ministry of Death and Condemnation would be written on our hearts, therefore giving us Rest like the Lord Jesus said He would do, rather than the Ministry of Death and Condemnation itself?


Of course it would make more sense. But I don't think I can show you this. Only the Lord Jesus can.

2 Corinthians 3:14-16

[SUP]14 [/SUP]But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.​

What is the vail brother? It was their believe that they could be saved by keeping the law. When the vail is taken away we come to the realisation we need Christ and in it still be obedient to His word because He is the living word.

 

[Studyman]

Yet james also says if we keep the whole law yet fail in one point we are guilty of all.

it seems james understood clearly what paul taught in gal 3,that whoever is under law is under a curse, because as moses made them all confirm an aoth, whoever does not confirm and keep every word is cursed.

Grandpa s right, god did is not going to write the ten commands on our hearts, those things by nature we already know, proven by the fsct paul said gentiles by nature know those commands (know to break those commands it was sin)

it will be a different law he writes, a law of love, something Israel never had, and sadly much of the physical church has never had either.

Wow EG,

Israel didn't have God's Love? God's Law is not a Law of Love? Jesus is going to write "different" Laws on our hearts? Where in the world do you get this stuff. "God's Law isn't for the Christian", "The Pharisees were trying to earn Salvation by obeying God", and now "Israel didn't have God's "Law of Love".


Ex. 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Ex. 21:5 And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free:

Lev. 19:17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

34 But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

Duet 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire.
37 And because he loved thy fathers,(First) therefore he chose their seed after them, and brought thee out in his sight with his mighty power out of Egypt;

Duet. 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Duet. 7:8 But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.
9 Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;


Duet. 10:12 And now, Israel, what doth the LORD thy God require of thee, but to fear the LORD thy God, to walk in all his ways, and to love him, and to serve the LORD thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul,

Duet 10:18 He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger, in giving him food and raiment.
19 Love ye therefore the stranger: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.

Duet. 33:3 Yea, he loved the people; all his saints are in thy hand: and they sat down at thy feet; every one shall receive of thy words.

Josh 23:11 Take good heed therefore unto yourselves, that ye love the LORD your God.

In the KJV OT the word "love" is written over 275 times.

"

it will be a different law he writes, a law of love, something Israel never had, and sadly much of the physical church has never had either.

Israel never had God's Law of Love? WOW!!!!

 

[Cee]

Those who are sons of God shall be lead by the Spirit of God. Now in Christ we are united with Him, we are given spiritual eyes and ears to live, move and have our being in Him.

Three things will remain: love, hope, and faith. And the greatest of these is love. But our human love is only a starting point, as we receive His love we find His fullness inside of us (Eph 3:19-). The function of the Law was to lead us to our need for face to face relationship with a Savior. Not to puff ourselves up to think we can accomplish all these things on our own. It was to lead us to see our death, so that we could see true life. And this life is found in the person of Christ.

And now in Him, He gives us a NEW commandment. The Lord Jesus Himself says this is a new law not an old one. And this command is to love each other as He has loved us.

In 1 Co 13 Paul addresses the highest realities people exalt of being a Christian, but his nails it down by explaining that in all these without Love we are, have, and gain - nothing.

 

[Cee]

The Law was good, but the sin in us was not. The Law showed us that we needed a Savior. This is why Paul says the Law was given UNTIL... so why did Jesus say the Law would always exist because without Christ the Law shuts up the world until they allow Him to have mercy. But He came to fulfill the Law? Love is the fulfillment of the Law. And He empowers us with His love to love one another.

 

[Lighthearted]

Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

I'm not saying there certainly aren't those that could, do, and did...but God knew from the beginning He would become flesh and give us all willing to believe, the gift of His love through faith in Jesus Christ's shed blood and victory over the grave! Without Jesus, the uncircumcised would never have been made part of the circumcised.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So the law is a tool of righteousness in which everyone is condemned and no one lives up to.

In other words, the ministration of death and condemnation.

Like I said to begin with, we don't use the tool of condemnation to measure anothers Righteousness.

It just wouldn't make sense. It would make us hypocrites.


I don't think God uses the law as a measure of Righteousness for those who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, either.

Galatians 5:5

For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.


But you have shown that ancient Israel thought they would be righteous by their obedience to the law. I haven't ever tried to contend otherwise.​

I guess we could use it to measure righteousness

the problem is, by doing this, we would have to conclude all have sinnd and fall short, there are non righteous, no not one,

if we do not come to that conclusion, we do not inow the law very well, or we have done like many and water it down,

 

[Studyman]

The Law was good, but the sin in us was not. The Law showed us that we needed a Savior. This is why Paul says the Law was given UNTIL... so why did Jesus say the Law would always exist because without Christ the Law shuts up the world until they allow Him to have mercy. But He came to fulfill the Law? Love is the fulfillment of the Law. And He empowers us with His love to love one another.

You are trying to preach, as many others who come in Christ's name, that "Thou shall Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul" and "Thou shall Love thy neighbor as thyself", on which hang all the Law and Prophets, are only here "until".

You are ignoring, it seems, that it was the Priesthood and the "Law of Works" associated with it that was changed.

"12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law."

Paul is speaking about "works of the Law" for "justification".

So the "LAW" that was "ADDED" until the seed should come were the "Works" Moses prescribed for the cleansing, justification, atonement, of sins. Abraham had God's Laws but did not have these "Works of the Law" for justification. Levi wasn't born yet. He was justified by Faith, not the Levitical "works of the Law"

When the Messiah came, we are longer in need of these "works of the Law" for justification. He forgives our sins directly without the Levitical Priesthood sacrificial "works of the Law" just as He promised in Jer. 31.

But we are still required to "Love the Lord with all our might and love our neighbor as our selves on which all the teaching of the Word which became Flesh hangs.

His description and instructions on how to "love" God, and how to "love" our neighbors will be here as long as the earth is here as Jesus said. And He said "His Word's are forever".

I believe it is important to follow God's instructions as to how to Love Him and love others, as opposed to our religious human love.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Are you familiar with the visions of Zechariah? At one stage Zechariah sees the flying scroll and I only want to highlight a few things:
1) Did you notice that there are writings on both sides of the scroll? Usually in Biblical times they only wrote on one side of the scroll or paper, but in this case on both sides. The only other place we find in scripture where something is written on both sides is when God gaveMoses the Ten Commandments.
2) The measurement of the scroll is the exact same measurements as the oracle of the temple where the Ark of the Covenant was kept 1Kings 6

I believe God will write the Ten Commandments on our hearts as it is relevant to Him.

God bless friends

has he not already done this?

How can by nature people who do not onow God understand murder is a sin? I 5ink because those commands are written in our DNA, about the most we have done is as paul says in rom 1 and hide this truth and deny these commands are true,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Wow EG,

Israel didn't have God's Love? God's Law is not a Law of Love? Jesus is going to write "different" Laws on our hearts? Where in the world do you get this stuff. "God's Law isn't for the Christian", "The Pharisees were trying to earn Salvation by obeying God", and now "Israel didn't have God's "Law of Love".


Ex. 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Ex. 21:5 And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free:

Lev. 19:17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

34 But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

Duet 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire.
37 And because he loved thy fathers,(First) therefore he chose their seed after them, and brought thee out in his sight with his mighty power out of Egypt;

Duet. 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Duet. 7:8 But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.
9 Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;


Duet. 10:12 And now, Israel, what doth the LORD thy God require of thee, but to fear the LORD thy God, to walk in all his ways, and to love him, and to serve the LORD thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul,

Duet 10:18 He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger, in giving him food and raiment.
19 Love ye therefore the stranger: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.

Duet. 33:3 Yea, he loved the people; all his saints are in thy hand: and they sat down at thy feet; every one shall receive of thy words.

Josh 23:11 Take good heed therefore unto yourselves, that ye love the LORD your God.

In the KJV OT the word "love" is written over 275 times.

"


Israel never had God's Law of Love? WOW!!!!

Read the sermon on the mount, study it, take it in, and you will see how the law is flawed as a means of helping us to be righteous,

As jesus said, the law says, (the law written in stone),but i tell you.....(basically showing how the law was not enough, the law said do not commit adultry, but i tell you..)

 

[posthuman]

So the "LAW" that was "ADDED" until the seed should come were the "Works" Moses prescribed for the cleansing, justification, atonement, of sins.

This human opinion is certainly 'added' seeing it is not what scripture itself says. Scripture says 'the Law' was added. Studydude however would like to judge by a little bit of it but not by all, so he breaks it apart.

 

[Cee]

You are trying to preach, as many others who come in Christ's name, that "Thou shall Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul" and "Thou shall Love thy neighbor as thyself", on which hang all the Law and Prophets, are only here "until".

You are ignoring, it seems, that it was the Priesthood and the "Law of Works" associated with it that was changed.

"12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law."

Paul is speaking about "works of the Law" for "justification".

So the "LAW" that was "ADDED" until the seed should come were the "Works" Moses prescribed for the cleansing, justification, atonement, of sins. Abraham had God's Laws but did not have these "Works of the Law" for justification. Levi wasn't born yet. He was justified by Faith, not the Levitical "works of the Law"

When the Messiah came, we are longer in need of these "works of the Law" for justification. He forgives our sins directly without the Levitical Priesthood sacrificial "works of the Law" just as He promised in Jer. 31.

But we are still required to "Love the Lord with all our might and love our neighbor as our selves on which all the teaching of the Word which became Flesh hangs.

His description and instructions on how to "love" God, and how to "love" our neighbors will be here as long as the earth is here as Jesus said. And He said "His Word's are forever".

I believe it is important to follow God's instructions as to how to Love Him and love others, as opposed to our religious human love.

You are ignoring Scripture that says the Law was UNTIL the Savior would come. I’m simply agreeing with the Scripture and not trying to talk in circles around it.

If you have a different interpretation for what UNTIL means, I’m all for it, but ignoring it isn’t going to get you very far with me. I could address the rest of what you wrote, but let’s not confuse the issue. Scripture teaches the Law was the ministry of death, that it passed away, and it was UNTIL Christ could come.

So address those Scriptures.

 

[Ralph-]

All you proved Ralph, is you can't read.

Those whom Paul was speaking of, were Jews who came close to accepting Christ, but instead fell back into the Law. They "tasted", but instead fell from grace. Grace found only in Jesus.

Not born again believers.

Epic fail for you.

Who can't read?


"But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again?"-Galatians 4:9


Yes, budman, these are indeed saved people wanting to be enslaved all over again by the law who Paul says will not inherit the kingdom if they go back to the law for justification.

But I understand, budman. You're like so many countless other people; you can't believe that it's possible that so many leaders and 'learned' men can be so wrong about what can happen to the person who stops trusting in Christ for justification. Well, believe it. I showed you the plain words that prove it. But you don't have to worry about it if you just keep trusting in Christ for justification and move on to that which matters most--keeping the laws of how we are to treat others. And you can tell if you're doing that by if you're growing up more and more into the keeping of those laws.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

You are trying to preach, as many others who come in Christ's name, that "Thou shall Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul" and "Thou shall Love thy neighbor as thyself", on which hang all the Law and Prophets, are only here "until".

You are ignoring, it seems, that it was the Priesthood and the "Law of Works" associated with it that was changed.

"12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law."

Paul is speaking about "works of the Law" for "justification".

So the "LAW" that was "ADDED" until the seed should come were the "Works" Moses prescribed for the cleansing, justification, atonement, of sins. Abraham had God's Laws but did not have these "Works of the Law" for justification. Levi wasn't born yet. He was justified by Faith, not the Levitical "works of the Law"

When the Messiah came, we are longer in need of these "works of the Law" for justification. He forgives our sins directly without the Levitical Priesthood sacrificial "works of the Law" just as He promised in Jer. 31.

But we are still required to "Love the Lord with all our might and love our neighbor as our selves on which all the teaching of the Word which became Flesh hangs.

His description and instructions on how to "love" God, and how to "love" our neighbors will be here as long as the earth is here as Jesus said. And He said "His Word's are forever".

I believe it is important to follow God's instructions as to how to Love Him and love others, as opposed to our religious human love.

what you observe in your post above, is an ongoing theme here at CC and also a very good and biblical explanation that will be misunderstood and rejected no matter how many times you or anyone states and indicates that you believe no works are need for justification but those who are justified will, by nature exhibit works created by God for us to do

and I'm not even referencing the person you are responding to here; just a general observation on my part and thinking about how some are so nasty in this thread...and again, not the person you are responding to

again as I have said quite a few times around here, people are confusing works, fruit and obedience

I think it could be written until the site has run out of room for the words, that Jesus fulfilled all the requirements of the law, He alone is our High Priest and presented Himself as the final sacrifice (the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world and that is not Universalism even tho some try to say it is) and Jesus commandments are simply the fulfillment of the 10 commandments which we could never keep, but obedience to Christ does fulfill them

but that does not make us righteous

what it does do, is present the perfection of God's plan from beginning to end

this all makes perfect sense

but as I was saying, you could explain it until this site looses capacity to hold it and some folks will still not understand and come back with nonsense you never said and call you a pharisee

and some will actually get more than a little angry and call names and call you stupid and accuse you of saying things you never even thought, never mind actually wrote down here

they do not understand what actually transpired and suffer for the lack of that understanding

the Bible needs to be understood as one unit and not chopped up bits of that chapter, book or verse as it suits someone.
the selective process is always geared to the persuasion of the one doing the chopping and no amount of explanation will ever be helpful because, by gum, they have a 'verse' for you that proves they are right

and this problem in understanding is exacerbated by the jumping from one testament to the other and picking 'positive' verses from the OT and ADDING them to the NT. this creates a mashup doctrine that those who create it, use to the detriment of all.

we are not under condemnation and our High Priest does not condemn us. we condemn ourselves quite well because of a lack of understanding that what Christ accomplished, is forever our plea of 'innocent'

none of that has changed one iota...not one jot or tittle ... of God's laws. it does mean, to the believer, that we are no longer condemned by that law

however, so many seem to want to throw out the law. if we do that, that in what way do we even need a High Priest?

we don't need one if we just throw it all out. what do people suppose God will judge by? what criteria will He use?

disagreement is one thing, but the actual anger any of the above engenders indicates more than lack of study

 

[Cee]

Actually, I don’t think we are far off.

You said Abraham had God’s Laws, but he was counted righteous by his faith not his obedience to God’s Laws, whatever those were. Because Scripture doesn’t outline them.

Even David who was given the Law murdered and was still considered righteous because of his faith in God, Yes it was his faith that lead him to ask for God to wipe his slate clean.

As far as the Law Jesus increased our observance of it by writing it on our heart and and causing us to follow it daily because Love fulfills the WHOLE of the Law.

Yes, even the part about loving God because Christ is now One with us.

And as far as the Sabbath? In Christ, we live from His rest.

 

[Cee]

what you observe in your post above, is an ongoing theme here at CC and also a very good and biblical explanation that will be misunderstood and rejected no matter how many times you or anyone states and indicates that you believe no works are need for justification but those who are justified will, by nature exhibit works created by God for us to do

and I'm not even referencing the person you are responding to here; just a general observation on my part and thinking about how some are so nasty in this thread...and again, not the person you are responding to

again as I have said quite a few times around here, people are confusing works, fruit and obedience

I think it could be written until the site has run out of room for the words, that Jesus fulfilled all the requirements of the law, He alone is our High Priest and presented Himself as the final sacrifice (the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world and that is not Universalism even tho some try to say it is) and Jesus commandments are simply the fulfillment of the 10 commandments which we could never keep, but obedience to Christ does fulfill them

but that does not make us righteous

what it does do, is present the perfection of God's plan from beginning to end

this all makes perfect sense

but as I was saying, you could explain it until this site looses capacity to hold it and some folks will still not understand and come back with nonsense you never said and call you a pharisee

and some will actually get more than a little angry and call names and call you stupid and accuse you of saying things you never even thought, never mind actually wrote down here

they do not understand what actually transpired and suffer for the lack of that understanding

the Bible needs to be understood as one unit and not chopped up bits of that chapter, book or verse as it suits someone.
the selective process is always geared to the persuasion of the one doing the chopping and no amount of explanation will ever be helpful because, by gum, they have a 'verse' for you that proves they are right

and this problem in understanding is exacerbated by the jumping from one testament to the other and picking 'positive' verses from the OT and ADDING them to the NT. this creates a mashup doctrine that those who create it, use to the detriment of all.

we are not under condemnation and our High Priest does not condemn us. we condemn ourselves quite well because of a lack of understanding that what Christ accomplished, is forever our plea of 'innocent'

none of that has changed one iota...not one jot or tittle ... of God's laws. it does mean, to the believer, that we are no longer condemned by that law

however, so many seem to want to throw out the law. if we do that, that in what way do we even need a High Priest?

we don't need one if we just throw it all out. what do people suppose God will judge by? what criteria will He use?

disagreement is one thing, but the actual anger any of the above engenders indicates more than lack of study

I’m not angry.

But just so I’m clear did you just say faith doesn’t make us righteous?

I’m asking about this part here:

”but that does not make us righteous”