Why should we seek the gifts earnestly, but especially prophecy?

[livingbygrace]

I am sorry brother, but this is not serving Jesus any longer.

With the hopes and prayers of His love,
vic

VW

No-one should be 'hounded' off this website.

You and I both know that Red deliberately targets your posts as he has mine so often. But I hope you will remain on this website.

Red said and I quote

Anyone led by the spirit of God will only speak to their Christian brothers or sisters to edify them

Therefore by Reds own words(not mine but his) he cannot be being led by the Spirit much of the time on this website. I hope you will reconsider, but if you need a break I hope you come back refreshed. You will be in my prayers

 

[Red33]

You both sound like two little puppies trying to console one another because of the big bad wolf. Are you not men, with a conscience and with conviction? If you are, then act like men. How long are you two going to keep being offended?

1Cor 16:13 Be alert and on your guard; stand firm in your faith your conviction respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, keeping the trust and holy fervor born of faith and a part of it). Act like men and be courageous; grow in strength!

 

[livingbygrace]

You both sound like two little puppies trying to console one another because of the big bad wolf. Are you not men, with a conscience and with conviction? If you are, then act like men. How long are you two going to keep being offended?

1Cor 16:13 Be alert and on your guard; stand firm in your faith your conviction respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, keeping the trust and holy fervor born of faith and a part of it). Act like men and be courageous; grow in strength!

By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for another

I wonder if your words are seen as loving by those who read them

 

[livingbygrace]

I agree completely. But how can you judge someone's heart, and know the reasons that they are posting?

I know we are called not to judge, but if we are honest we each one of us form opinions of each other, those we work with, those at the church we go to etc. We may call this discerning, but to say we form no strong opinions of people would not I suggest be the truth




Why do you demand a different standard for those who "get caught up in the moment" and say things that may be considered as not edifying, and then allow a "lack of perfection" to VW? He is not immune to saying nonedifying things. I know, for I have been the object on a few occasions.


I have not suggested VW, myself or anyone else is perfect, but I do believe it is plain that Red fixates on VW and tries to continually find fault with what he writes.



This is a debate forum, not a preschool nursery. Everyone has their own debate styles, which may include things like sarcasm. John the Baptist, Paul, and even Jesus used sarcasm in their debates with religious leaders in their times. Jesus often healed on the Sabbath with the express purpose of engaging the Pharisees in contentious debate. Would you judge their character by the fact that they may have offended their audiences?

I don't think I would say Jesus was sarcastic myself. I also believe the express reason Christ healed was out of love, mercy and compassion and to prove the power of God, though I accept the result was many times that the Pharisees were shown through debate their error
Thios is a debate forum, but if we are Christians we should be driven by love



As for the pride of being looked up to, all of us have strived with that sin before. I have prayed to God to help me to be humble, and I would imagine that even you have struggled with it.
I do not deny I have struggled with pride.
But if we try and impress on others that we have been raised up as a teacher/preacher of the word, and if we then continually stress the need for humility and love and to speak only to edify others we are beholden to lead by example, otherwise we may be quoted scripture from Matt 23 say

There is no need to single out Red, or anyone else for a sin that is all to common in our society.

Others on this website have singled out Red for the way he often comments to others, if only one person was doing so your point would be more valid

 

[Red33]

By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for another

I wonder if your words are seen as loving by those who read them

You have often tried to get others to condemn me for the things I have said, and maybe some do condemn me in their heart. That is between them and God and God will deal with them His way, not mine or yours. I am not offended when you judge me of not being a disciple. You are free to do so, but it means very little to me and has no place in me. Both you and VW have said much concerning me and what I believe and you, in particular, have made an effort to discredit me with your relentless vain and empty questions as you see fit. Were you motivated by the love of God and did you have my best interest in mind as a brother?

Do people know that both you and VW have accused me of blaspheming the Holy Spirit, charged me with being a Pharisee and rebuked me and wanted nothing to do with me yet you continue to respond to things I post? If some took the time to read all these things (and many were not recovered when the site crashed) they would no doubt think my words were of the devil because in your view, I do not believe the plain words of scripture, I add to scripture and teach man made doctrine. You accuse me of not being edifying but you confine your words to no such thing when it comes to certain of the brethren. You refrain from the local assembly and have nothing good to say of its pastor-teachers who labor in the word and doctrine and lay their life down for the sheep.

You think that you do not need to have someone over you in the Lord because you can't trust any of them because you are persuaded that they are all corrupt. You have lived as an insecure man with a wounded spirit for many years and have never learned to trust God for those that He has raised up in the church. That may be your folly, but for those that gather themselves with others they are rich in faith and the grace of God, edified in the word and built up in the love of God. Those who are not content with the local assembly and try to serve God without it, have little fruit unto God because they have cut themselves from the head, Christ. Serve God as you will, but He is in the midst of His body and is rejoicing over them with singing because He has redeemed them and brought them into a fruitful place that He has hedged and covered them with His wings.

 

[superdave5221]

Others on this website have singled out Red for the way he often comments to others, if only one person was doing so your point would be more valid

I haven't really followed particular authors around in here, and have concentrated more on issues that I found more interesting and pertinent, so I can't really argue with your assessment. I got on to dispute VW's opinion, which I did, and found myself in the middle of a catfight.

I should have butted out, and left it alone, but I didn't. I will now, and I have learned from this encounter to avoid arguments in which I have come in late in the game.

God bless everyone in here, and God help ALL of us to see Truth and display humility and Christian love in our dealings with each other, me included.

 

[livingbygrace]

You have often tried to get others to condemn me for the things I have said, and maybe some do condemn me in their heart. That is between them and God and God will deal with them His way, not mine or yours. I am not offended when you judge me of not being a disciple. You are free to do so, but it means very little to me and has no place in me. Both you and VW have said much concerning me and what I believe and you, in particular, have made an effort to discredit me with your relentless vain and empty questions as you see fit. Were you motivated by the love of God and did you have my best interest in mind as a brother?

Have I ever told you you are possessed by the spirit of antichrist?
If you make statements of your belief should they not be questioned?
You seem to revel in finding fault with others beliefs, why should you be immune when your beliefs are questioned?



Do people know that both you and VW have accused me of blaspheming the Holy Spirit, charged me with being a Pharisee and rebuked me and wanted nothing to do with me yet you continue to respond to things I post? If some took the time to read all these things (and many were not recovered when the site crashed) they would no doubt think my words were of the devil because in your view, I do not believe the plain words of scripture, I add to scripture and teach man made doctrine. You accuse me of not being edifying but you confine your words to no such thing when it comes to certain of the brethren. You refrain from the local assembly and have nothing good to say of its pastor-teachers who labor in the word and doctrine and lay their life down for the sheep.

I have warned you to be careful you do not blaspheme the Holy Spirit. You have discussed with many people I would consider 'Godly people' on this website who say they can speak in tongues. You have suggested they may be being led of the devil. I would call that a very dangerpous thing to do if it is the spirit leading them.

You certainly do add to scriptiure concerning what you believe is neccessary to believe to have eternal life, yes

I did try to avoid conversation with you, yes as the only time you ever wanted to engage in conversation with me was to criticise what I wrote and you seemed to enjoy nothing more than to speak agaonst those who do not go to church. All of these comments were aimed predominantly at myself and VW without you often mentioning our names

If I am honest I am glad I do not attend a church such as yours, I will not again quote many of your beliefs to make my point
You think that you do not need to have someone over you in the Lord because you can't trust any of them because you are persuaded that they are all corrupt.

Please speak truthfully

You have lived as an insecure man with a wounded spirit for many years and have never learned to trust God for those that He has raised up in the church. That may be your folly, but for those that gather themselves with others they are rich in faith and the grace of God, edified in the word and built up in the love of God.

This is a clear example of words recited from the head but not the heart
How can you say you are richer in grace and faith than me? How would you know that?
And you are edified in the word and built up in love?
Then why accuse someone who believes the plain word of possessing the spirit of antichrist?
You may say you are built up in love, but many of your comments do not echo your words






Those who are not content with the local assembly and try to serve God without it, have little fruit unto God because they have cut themselves from the head, Christ.

Untrue. Many who go to church are cut off from God, you should realise that. Many who go to church never witness to anybody, as I would hope you realise
Just because someone does not attend a church does not mean they are cut off from God. And it does not mean that they must have less fruit than those who go to church.
Serve God as you will, but He is in the midst of His body and is rejoicing over them with singing because He has redeemed them and brought them into a fruitful place that He has hedged and covered them with His wings.

Where two or three are gathered together there am I in the midst
If I met and fellowshipped with people in my home who are you to condemn me or find fault with me for not going to a church building?
I learnt a long time ago that many will demand ,more from the Christian than will God, and I will tell you the people I find do this the most
Those who believe knowing the literal words of the Bible are everything. They are proud, believing they understand scripture better than do others, they are proud of standing full square on the Bible and they believe it is for them to speak the literal words of scripture to others.
But I have found people with this approach most lack, true love, mercy and compassion, and do not understand so often the heart of the Gospel.

If we have not love we are simply making a noise

 

[AnandaHya]

1 Corinthians 13: 8 Love never fails ; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away ; if there are tongues, they will cease ; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part ; 10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11 When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child ; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face ; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13 But now faith, hope, love, abide these three ; but the greatest of these is love.

What is Paul talking about here? He is saying that the gifts of prophecy, etc. will be done away with, and only faith, hope, and love will abide. Certainly all of these things existed when he made this statement, so what future event is he talking about in which those "gifts" will be done away?

It cannot be the end of times, when Jesus returns. He says that faith and hope will abide. What need would there be for faith and hope, if Christ has returned? Why would we hope and have need of faith for that which we have?

In verse 10, the word "perfect" in it's Greek context means "complete". In the context of verses 11 and 12, Paul is talking about perfect knowledge, (as opposed to the incomplete or errant knowledge which will be replaced by the perfect knowledge) in our salvation, and in our certainty of Christ's return. That knowledge is contained in the completed New Testament bible. It is not surprising that those who would claim to be prophets would have a disdain for the bible, for it makes them obsolete.

It is certain that no "new" revelations (not contained in the bible) have come from those claiming to be prophets. And that is what prophets do. They reveal God's will to us. Reveal means that which was previously unknown. Since we have a complete knowledge of God's will contained in the bible, along with Holy Spirit to interpret it for us, there is no need today for prophets.

Is it not telling that the bible speaks not of true prophets of God in the last days? The bible mentions only false prophets in the last days.

Hebrews 1: 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

We are fortunate to have a collection of the sayings and doings of the Son. It is called the Gospels.

So according to you the Day of the Lord spoken of in Jeremiah has already occurred and that we see God face to face then? No prophets no prophecy right? What about interpretors and people who speak in tongues those still around in your book?


Acts 2:14-21 (New King James Version)
14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, raised his voice and said to them, “Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and heed my words. 15 For these are not drunk, as you suppose, since it is only the third hour of the day. 16 But this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:
17 ‘ And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God,
That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh;
Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
Your young men shall see visions,
Your old men shall dream dreams.
18 And on My menservants and on My maidservants
I will pour out My Spirit in those days;
And they shall prophesy.
19 I will show wonders in heaven above
And signs in the earth beneath:
Blood and fire and vapor of smoke.
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness,
And the moon into blood,
Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the LORD.
21 And it shall come to pass
That whoever calls on the name of the LORD
Shall be saved.’[a]

 

[AnandaHya]

Which begs the question. Would a true prophet bow to pressures of (what you call non religious people, as if you are their judge)? Jonah ran from God's will for a time, but eventually did His bidding. He feared for his life. It seems that VW can't even take a little criticism. They certainly don't make prophets like they used to!

Perhaps it is more difficult to oppose those wielding the word of God, than it was to preach in Nineveh.

he never said he was a prophet, he just spoke of speaking prophecy while under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

Mockers be wary of your words. For every idle word will be taken into account by God.

Colossians 3:13 AMP

"Be gentle and forbearing with one another and if one has a difference (a grievance or complaint) against another, readily pardoning each other; even as the Lord has (freely) forgiven you, so MUST you also (forgive)"

NOW BE NICE, GOD is watching you.

 

[superdave5221]

he never said he was a prophet, he just spoke of speaking prophecy while under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

Mockers be wary of your words. For every idle word will be taken into account by God.

Colossians 3:13 AMP

"Be gentle and forbearing with one another and if one has a difference (a grievance or complaint) against another, readily pardoning each other; even as the Lord has (freely) forgiven you, so MUST you also (forgive)"

NOW BE NICE, GOD is watching you.

Make sure to take your own advice. VW and I have a long going relationship on here, much of which you are unaware. He has called himself, and admitted many times that he is a prophet.

So before you accuse, make sure and know what you are talking about.

 

[AnandaHya]

wow

i guess you guys might need the rest of the scripture I quoted earlier.

Open your eyes and SEE the attacks and ploys of the Enemy. Do not rip apart your brethren and become eaters of men. Have you no understanding about how the enemy tries and destroy things of the light through judgmental and divisive SPEECH?

If anyone wants to pick on a prophet/prophetess pick on me. If I cry it will be to my Heavenly Father, for I trust no Earthly one.

Isaiah 29:9-16 (New King James Version)

The Blindness of Disobedience

9 Pause and wonder!
Blind yourselves and be blind!
They are drunk, but not with wine;
They stagger, but not with intoxicating drink.
10 For the LORD has poured out on you
The spirit of deep sleep,
And has closed your eyes, namely, the prophets;
And He has covered your heads, namely, the seers.

11 The whole vision has become to you like the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one who is literate, saying, “Read this, please.”
And he says, “I cannot, for it is sealed.”
12 Then the book is delivered to one who is illiterate, saying, “Read this, please.”
And he says, “I am not literate.”
13 Therefore the Lord said:


“ Inasmuch as these people draw near with their mouths
And honor Me with their lips,
But have removed their hearts far from Me,
And their fear toward Me is taught by the commandment of men,
14 Therefore, behold, I will again do a marvelous work
Among this people,
A marvelous work and a wonder;
For the wisdom of their wise men shall perish,
And the understanding of their prudent men shall be hidden.”
15 Woe to those who seek deep to hide their counsel far from the LORD,
And their works are in the dark;
They say, “Who sees us?” and, “Who knows us?”
16 Surely you have things turned around!
Shall the potter be esteemed as the clay;
For shall the thing made say of him who made it,

“ He did not make me”?
Or shall the thing formed say of him who formed it,

“ He has no understanding”?

YouTube - Were You There

 

[phil36]

Make sure to take your own advice. VW and I have a long going relationship on here, much of which you are unaware. He has called himself, and admitted many times that he is a prophet.

So before you accuse, make sure and know what you are talking about.

I will back dave up here, I have also read VW's prophecies..!!!!!???

 

[superdave5221]

I will back dave up here, I have also read VW's prophecies..!!!!!???

Thanks Phil. Mockers. The Enemy. What hypocracy! The venom that comes from someone who is always preaching humility, respect, and love. You may disagree with my opinion Ananda, but that does not make me a mocker and The Enemy. Read Romans 14: 9-13.

 

[AnandaHya]

Make sure to take your own advice. VW and I have a long going relationship on here, much of which you are unaware. He has called himself, and admitted many times that he is a prophet.

So before you accuse, make sure and know what you are talking about.

i am wary of my words and do take my own advice. I did not call you a mocker but warned you if you were mocking not to do so, because I know only in part, I speak in part.

I did not realize he stated he was given that title. My apologies to you both.

the office of prophet is GIVEN by the HOLY SPIRIT and no other. recognized or not it matters not.

you are to judge the spirits and test them.All I say is no matter what you are given as a spiritual gift SPEAK WITH LOVE. Please

1 Corinthians 13 v. 2
though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.

 

[AnandaHya]

Thanks Phil. Mockers. The Enemy. What hypocracy! The venom that comes from someone who is always preaching humility, respect, and love. You may disagree with my opinion Ananda, but that does not make me a mocker and The Enemy. Read Romans 14: 9-13.

ok I apologized sorry it wasn't fast enough. I haven't read VW "prophecies" but I still believe prophecy exist.

the difference is though I know the difference between the word "prophet" and "seer".

One speaks of the PRESENT and the other of the FUTURE. The office of "seers" have been done away with because we have the finished Word of God in the Holy Bible. It is our sword and only offensive weapon besides PRAYER.

We all have things that need healing let us shelter each other and allow God time to heal the wounds instead of picking the scabs?

 

[superdave5221]

ok I apologized sorry it wasn't fast enough. I haven't read VW "prophecies" but I still believe prophecy exist.

the difference is though I know the difference between the word "prophet" and "seer".

One speaks of the PRESENT and the other of the FUTURE. The office of "seers" have been done away with because we have the finished Word of God in the Holy Bible. It is our sword and only offensive weapon besides PRAYER.

We all have things that need healing let us shelter each other and allow God time to heal the wounds instead of picking the scabs?

Amen sister. Shalom.

 

[AnandaHya]

Shalom Superdave,

now i'm going to have to research and comment on your "prophecies" VW,

but after dinner and the kids go to bed.

Blessings to all who walk on the Path that Jesus Christ our Lord and savior has laid out and shown us a perfect example to emulate. Shalom

 

[pickles]

Lest we forget!!!
We are called in the witness to Jesus!
It should never be for one's self that word and witness is given.
The goal is Jesus!
There is no offence, when all that is one's goal, witness, word, is to the glory of God.
Simply because , it is not about I, but Jesus!!!
Will we forget the love we are called to in Jesus Christ is Lord?

May the forgiveness, love and blessings in Jesus Christ is Lord fill all here!
So that the glory of God will shine brightly, for all to see!


In Jesus, God bless.
pickles

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Paul wrote this, but why would he write such a foolish thing,'seeing all the confussion and discord the "gifts" have caused? One group teaches this, and another that, and still another says that there are no gifts any more, and others won't even consider something so subjective, so uncontrollable. But he did write this, that we all should seek the gifts of the Spirit, but especially that we should prophecy. It's scripture, unless Paul was not inspired by the Holy Spirit when he wrote about the "gifts."

There are many reasons to seek the gifts of the Spirit, but there is one that has not been guessed by many, and it involves that embarrassing gift, the one most of us wish has never been mentioned; prophecy. All kinds of reasons are given why we should not prophecy, and every one of them is a rationalization. The reason why we should seek to prophecy is immense in it's ramifications. Simply, that we learn to speak the words we hear from Jesus.

When confronted about the words He spoke, Jesus had a very simple yet powerful explanation; He said that the words He spoke were the things He heard His Father speaking. Just consider this for a moment. He spoke what He heard His Father saying. This is the essence of prophecy.

In almost all of the teachings Jesus gave to His disciples in private, one theme was most often repeated. That as He did, we are to do likewise. This means not only that we are to do the same things He did, but that we are to do them in the very same way that He did them. And in His prayer to His Father, He shows the desire of having us become just as He was, while we remain in this world. "That the world may know that Thou didst love them, even as Thou hast loved Me." one of the things that can be easily said about Jesus during His walk in this world is that the Gather loved Him, because He did whatever Jesus asked Him to do, but one.

So we seek to prophecy in order to walk in the very same way that Jesus did, having His words to speak, because we hear them, and having His love, because we are truly wanting to be His disciples, filled with His Spirit by which we hear His voice.

Do not despise prophecy. Please. And earnestly desire the gifts of the Spirit.

In Christ,

I agree with sister here, it is not the future telling prophecy, but inspiration or use of the word of God. Preaching or teaching from the bible is prophecy. Great stuff huh i like it

 

[Mark777]

I agree with sister here, it is not the future telling prophecy, but inspiration or use of the word of God. Preaching or teaching from the bible is prophecy. Great stuff huh i like it

Scripture never calls teaching prophecy. To do so is to negate the word of God and reduce the manifestation of the Spirit to something that can be done with natural intellect.