Prophecy to the dishearted

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A

Abiding

Guest
#81
#81
VW said:
Thank you for your kind response.

I agree with all that you have said.

the reason for the segregation is that divisions have crept in, and have been in place for a very long time. It started with the saying, "I am of Paul, or Peter, or James."

I don't believe that drawing attention to false teachers and false prophets is profitable.

I don't believe that Jonathan is trying to mislead people away from Christ. I will not make any judgment on him. I believe that the words he gives are in need of refinement, and that he needs to grow in the gift. I believe that if he is hounded that he could fall into deep deception.

I believe that rather than call another false, that if the Spirit does not witness to our hearts about the word, that we judge the word alone, in private, and if lead by the Spirit, then offer a correction of the word, in meekness and gentleness.

It is not an easy thing to prophecy. It never becomes easy, but in the beginning, it is difficult and it is easy to allow some of our spirit to influence the word given. It takes practice to grow out of this, practice in following the Spirit.

In Christ,
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That all completely unbiblical...gifts are not learned, skills are learned, being a false prophet is a skill, not
a gift. Would God give a gift that could lead to his danger? no and you know the scriptures on that. And all this dont judge business is right out of all the books that teach this. Shame on you.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#82
#82
VW said:
We were warned about false prophets, not about people who make a mistake. We do not live in the old covenant, where a prophet must be perfectly correct. In the new covenant, the spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet.

If there were no prophets at all, then Jesus would have said to beware of prophets.
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Only false prophets make mistakes. And the logic about Jesus saying beware of false prophets
1 He said that before the start of the church where there were the prophets.For the foundation.
2 There is absolutely nothing that says in the text that there has to be real prophets to have false ones.

Real Prophets NEVER make mistakes!
 
superdave5221

superdave5221

Senior Member
#83
Jul 28, 2009
1,409
31
48
#83
Abiding said:
That all completely unbiblical...gifts are not learned, skills are learned, being a false prophet is a skill, not
a gift. Would God give a gift that could lead to his danger? no and you know the scriptures on that. And all this dont judge business is right out of all the books that teach this. Shame on you.
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VW has a PhD in prophecy, lol. It kind of makes you wonder, did Jeremiah finish near the top of his class. Was he as good as Isaiah? Can we really have confidence in what they were saying, or were they just learning? When they said, "Thus sayeth the Lord", did they really know what the Lord was saying, or did they not have enought practice yet? After all, it's not easy being a prophet!

I know I shouldn't be sarcastic, and I am trying not to be. But this stuff just begs it! How the self proclaimed prophets in here can have any credibility left is indicative of the success of Satan's efforts to deceive us in the last days.
 
superdave5221

superdave5221

Senior Member
#84
Jul 28, 2009
1,409
31
48
#84
Abiding said:
Only false prophets make mistakes. And the logic about Jesus saying beware of false prophets
1 He said that before the start of the church where there were the prophets.For the foundation.
2 There is absolutely nothing that says in the text that there has to be real prophets to have false ones.

Real Prophets NEVER make mistakes!
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You're absolutely right! Prophets are not perfect. They might make errors in everyday life. But when speaking for God, there can be no error in what is said!

Ezekiel 22: 28 "Her prophets have smeared whitewash for them, seeing false visions and divining lies for them, saying, 'Thus says the Lord GOD,' when the LORD has not spoken.

If the Lord has spoken, it is for sure that there will be no error in what is said.
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#85
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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#85
Red33 said:
The main thing that you block out is that when Christ took our sin upon His body and became sin literally (2Cor 5:21), God poured out His wrath upon His Son on the cross for ALL sin, even the sin of those that would not believe (Is 53:4-10, 2Cor 5:18,19, Jn 12:48). God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their sins and trespasses unto them because they were imputed to His precious body on the cross. God does not impute sin, do you?. If a person dies in their sin without being reconciled to God (Rom 5:10, 2Cor 5:20), it is because they have not been cleansed from the sin that God has paid for and put away through the death, burial and resurrection of His Son.

All those that have not believed upon the Son for salvation will not inherit eternal life because they live in the unrighteousness of their sin and have not received the righteousness of God by faith through Jesus Christ who put away their sin through His blood. Until you get that in your mind and heart through grace and the Holy Spirit, you will continue to have strange thoughts and doctrines that fall short of the finished work of Christ. You want fellowship and communion without the finished work. You want to draw near to the presence of God without the finished work and you want to walk in the Spirit without the finished work. It will not happen and God won't let you or any of us have all that He is without the finished work of Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

Jesus Christ came to bare our sins on His own body and take the blame for our sin. He came not to condemn us for our sin, but through His divine unconditional love He came to take the blame for our guilt. This is the Jesus that came to save sinners and when He put away our sins their in no double jeopardy for sin. We will not be paying or judged for our sins in any form, because we have the blood of Christ that testifies that He paid for them and suffered death on our behalf. That is the gospel we are to preach in all the world to every creature and it has never changed. It is the gospel that has been given to the church that the Holy Spirit testifies to in our heart and guides us into the truth of it, so that we can bare witness and preach it to those that are lost.
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zone

zone

Senior Member
#86
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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#86
eternally-gratefull said:
God will also not speak in error. if he would that would make him no better than any of the pagan Gods people worship!

People are so desperate to prove there are prophets, they will listen and stick up for one who makes errors. and says he speaks from God. This is a sad state of affairs and we were warned about these people!!
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indeed!!!!:)
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#87
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#87
eternally-gratefull said:
A man who claims to be a prophet. And who claims to be speaking from God, and in that speech where the man is "speaking from God" if a mistake is made. The man is claiming the mistake is from God.

Why are you trying to defend a person who claims "God said this" and at least part of this is error? Can God speak error? According to you he can!! This is not a man's mistake. This is a man claiming God said this. And this is a mistake.
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this is worse than a mistake.
repent, i say...try to.
perhaps the Lord will have mercy.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#88
#88
superdave5221 said:
VW has a PhD in prophecy, lol. It kind of makes you wonder, did Jeremiah finish near the top of his class. Was he as good as Isaiah? Can we really have confidence in what they were saying, or were they just learning? When they said, "Thus sayeth the Lord", did they really know what the Lord was saying, or did they not have enought practice yet? After all, it's not easy being a prophet!

I know I shouldn't be sarcastic, and I am trying not to be. But this stuff just begs it! How the self proclaimed prophets in here can have any credibility left is indicative of the success of Satan's efforts to deceive us in the last days.
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I know what you mean i was really trying to cut back on my sarcasm. But
somehow got anointed with a double portion. :)
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#89
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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#89
Red33 said:
Oh yes I do know what I am saying, because it is in your Bible and it has been written for all to read. You refuse to believe the finished work because you need to be able to justify your strange doctrine and your prophecies about sin and judgment when Christ has already been judged for sin. The truth is, our prophet and Savior Jesus Christ already took care of sin and if we sin we have an advocate, which is Jesus Christ the righteousness one. He bore our sin and put it away and now we are justified, not to live in sin but to be free from sin and its effects and penalty.

We don't want to continue in sin, as you presumptuously claim in your self righteousness disposition that you inherited through your religious adamic nature through the fall. You and all your cohorts on this site that have never learned a thing about the finished work nor are you able to apply it to the members of Christ's body and church. Go live your life as you believe and leave the church to the One that redeemed it with His precious blood. Let Him do as He sees fit to present it as a spotless bride without wrinkle or blemish in every local assembly that gathers themselves together unto Him. He is the head of the church and His Spirit is doing a great work in the lives of every member through grace and truth.
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Red33 said:
When we testify of Christ and the gospel, after He has already come and finished the work, we are confirming what has already been accomplished and fulfilled and it must be believed upon by retroactive faith. That is the witness and testimony of the truth from the Spirit and that is the spirit of prophecy.

When we go and preach the gospel, that is the testimony of Christ and the spirit of prophecy, because we speak forth the words of Christ and the testimony of His life that bore our sins on the cross. That testimony has the power of the Holy Spirit unto salvation by grace through faith. That is the testimony that the Spirit witnesses with our spirit that we are the sons of God that have been ordained to bring that message into all the world.
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the finished work

John 17:4
I glorified you on earth, having accomplished the work that you gave me to do.

John 14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give to you. Not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your hearts be troubled, neither let them be afraid.
 
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needmesomejesus

Guest
#90
#90
Words of encouragement is not considered prophecy. The Lord is not revealing anything new to people cause the Bible is complete. Also if you were a true prophet, you wouldn't not only have words of encouragement, but also harsh warning. A true prophet of God will be hated by many.
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
#91
#91
needmesomejesus said:
Words of encouragement is not considered prophecy. The Lord is not revealing anything new to people cause the Bible is complete. Also if you were a true prophet, you wouldn't not only have words of encouragement, but also harsh warning. A true prophet of God will be hated by many.
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would they be sitting behind a computer screen or would they have a ministry where they talk face to face with people around them about Jesus and bring them to Him through repentance (exhortation) or helping them grow through edification or helping them heal through comfort?

well for those who are disheartened I found these Bible verses of comfort when my heart is troubled:

1 Corinthians 15: 58
"So my dear brothers and sisters, be strong and immovable, Always work enthusiastically for the Lord, for you know that nothing you do for the Lord is ever useless."
 
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needmesomejesus

Guest
#92
#92
AnandaHya said:
would they be sitting behind a computer screen or would they have a ministry where they talk face to face with people around them about Jesus and bring them to Him through repentance (exhortation) or helping them grow through edification or helping them heal through comfort?

well for those who are disheartened I found these Bible verses of comfort when my heart is troubled:

1 Corinthians 15: 58
"So my dear brothers and sisters, be strong and immovable, Always work enthusiastically for the Lord, for you know that nothing you do for the Lord is ever useless."
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good point:)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#93
#93
zone said:
this is worse than a mistake.
repent, i say...try to.
perhaps the Lord will have mercy.
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I don't see any repentance. They are on a chat room where no one can see them. where there is no accountability except for maybe us calling them out (which they could care less) and where they think they have an audience. probably because they do not have one at home.

we have one who is in sin because he refuses to "assemble himself together" with th ebody in a church. And another who goes around spouting scripture and puts a few words to it and called it from God., which any 12 year old could do. The difference is a 12 year old could interpret scripture correctly and not make mistakes where this guy can't.

and they want us to listen to them..:rolleyes:
 
jonathanbchristian

jonathanbchristian

Banned
#94
Feb 16, 2011
2,957
24
0
#94
AnandaHya said:
would they be sitting behind a computer screen or would they have a ministry where they talk face to face with people around them about Jesus and bring them to Him through repentance (exhortation) or helping them grow through edification or helping them heal through comfort?

well for those who are disheartened I found these Bible verses of comfort when my heart is troubled:

1 Corinthians 15: 58
"So my dear brothers and sisters, be strong and immovable, Always work enthusiastically for the Lord, for you know that nothing you do for the Lord is ever useless."
Click to expand...

That's like saying why would a Christian be on the computer. Shouldn't Christians all be out telling people the Gospel news? If you don't think a prophet could be on the computer, then what are all the Christians of this site doing in the first place. Everyone is trying to teach or preach the Word of God with every post. Which leads me to another question, if I am supposed to be a prophet because I prophesy. Then do you really believe that everyone who starts a thread is a teacher? Teachers are listed right after prophets as number 3 in the church 1 Corinthians 12:28 "thirdly teachers."
 
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needmesomejesus

Guest
#95
#95
jonathanbchristian said:

That's like saying why would a Christian be on the computer. Shouldn't Christians all be out telling people the Gospel news? If you don't think a prophet could be on the computer, then what are all the Christians of this site doing in the first place. Everyone is trying to teach or preach the Word of God with every post. Which leads me to another question, if I am supposed to be a prophet because I prophesy. Then do you really believe that everyone who starts a thread is a teacher? Teachers are listed right after prophets as number 3 in the church 1 Corinthians 12:28 "thirdly teachers."
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you make a good point.:) but aren't prophets held to a higher standard?
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#96
#96
jonathanbchristian said:

That's like saying why would a Christian be on the computer. Shouldn't Christians all be out telling people the Gospel news? If you don't think a prophet could be on the computer, then what are all the Christians of this site doing in the first place. Everyone is trying to teach or preach the Word of God with every post. Which leads me to another question, if I am supposed to be a prophet because I prophesy. Then do you really believe that everyone who starts a thread is a teacher? Teachers are listed right after prophets as number 3 in the church 1 Corinthians 12:28 "thirdly teachers."
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that one looks sooo tempting, but i wont bother.
its your thread :)
 
superdave5221

superdave5221

Senior Member
#97
Jul 28, 2009
1,409
31
48
#97
AnandaHya said:
would they be sitting behind a computer screen or would they have a ministry where they talk face to face with people around them about Jesus and bring them to Him through repentance (exhortation) or helping them grow through edification or helping them heal through comfort?
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Hello Ananda! Glad to see you are still defending the faith!

I keep seeing this definition of a prophet as someone who is hated. I guess Hitler and Stalin would have made great prophets! George Bush would have been the greatest prophet of our lifetimes! lol

A person who holds the office of prophet, is one who is specially appointed by God to speak for Him. This is the strict sense of the term, the one that is claimed by VW and others.

According to biblical sources, we know the following about prophets:

1. When speaking for God, they cannot be mistaken, as they speak for God.
2. Any future events predicted by them must come to pass.
3. Their prophecy must be consistent, i.e. non contradictory.
4. The prophecy must not contradict the word of God as revealed by Holy Spirit through the inspired word of God found in the bible. Holy Spirit will not contradict Himself.
5. In the past, prophets were instruments of God in revealing His will to them, exhorting Israel as a nation to repent of sins, warning the nation of impending judgement, or in building up the people in times of judgement, such as the captivity.

The above list is not exhaustive, and I am sure you can probably add to it.

The prophets in the O.T. worked with the king and other leaders, who were supposed to be leading the nation in obedience to God's will. When the kings became completely corrupt, then they would often apeal to the people directly. The point is that the prophets worked with the "nation" of Israel. Their purpose was to reveal God's will to the nation's leaders, and/or people, and warn them of the consequences of their continued disobedience.

Let us fast forward to today. Today we have Christ's Church. This church is composed of ALL people who are in a saved relationship with Jesus Christ.

The questions that an honest, intelligent, and open minded person must ask are the following:

1. Do we need prophets today to inform our King (Jesus Christ) of the will of God?
2. Do we need prophets today to add to the word of God when all revelation was revealed to the apostles in the beginning?
3. Do we need prophets to reveal God's will to us when we have the spirit of Christ within us?
4. Do we need prophets to edify us when we have Christ's church?
5. Do we need prophets to teach us how to love God when we have been buried with Christ and redeemed by His precious blood?

Please do not be deceived by those who seek for personal glory, under the guise of sacrificing themselves to the hatred of the world.

 
VW

VW

Banned
#98
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#98
Abiding said:
That all completely unbiblical...gifts are not learned, skills are learned, being a false prophet is a skill, not
a gift. Would God give a gift that could lead to his danger? no and you know the scriptures on that. And all this dont judge business is right out of all the books that teach this. Shame on you.
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That is so wrong.

Even in the old testament there were schools for the prophets.

Dont wag your finger at me. Wag it at yourself.
 
VW

VW

Banned
#99
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#99
eternally-gratefull said:
A man who claims to be a prophet. And who claims to be speaking from God, and in that speech where the man is "speaking from God" if a mistake is made. The man is claiming the mistake is from God.

Why are you trying to defend a person who claims "God said this" and at least part of this is error? Can God speak error? According to you he can!! This is not a man's mistake. This is a man claiming God said this. And this is a mistake.
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I am not defending anyone except from being murdered by a bunch of people who sit in judgment when they are no more perfect than the one they judge.
 
VW

VW

Banned
#100
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#100
Red33 said:
Oh yes I do know what I am saying, because it is in your Bible and it has been written for all to read. You refuse to believe the finished work because you need to be able to justify your strange doctrine and your prophecies about sin and judgment when Christ has already been judged for sin. The truth is, our prophet and Savior Jesus Christ already took care of sin and if we sin we have an advocate, which is Jesus Christ the righteousness one. He bore our sin and put it away and now we are justified, not to live in sin but to be free from sin and its effects and penalty.

We don't want to continue in sin, as you presumptuously claim in your self righteousness disposition that you inherited through your religious adamic nature through the fall. You and all your cohorts on this site that have never learned a thing about the finished work nor are you able to apply it to the members of Christ's body and church. Go live your life as you believe and leave the church to the One that redeemed it with His precious blood. Let Him do as He sees fit to present it as a spotless bride without wrinkle or blemish in every local assembly that gathers themselves together unto Him. He is the head of the church and His Spirit is doing a great work in the lives of every member through grace and truth.
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Yeah, well, seeing as how you tend to ignore all of the parts of the bible about our struggle against sin, and how God will judge our sin, I believe that you need to go back to school, the Holy Spirit school. If you ever read the new testament with your eyes completely open, you would find that over half of it is about not sinning, and the judgment we will face is we do go on sinning.

So tell me, who is teaching false doctrine?
 
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