GOD and science

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spacefreak

Guest
#1
i personolly really like science because nature and the universe is very interesting, my perticuler like is astronomy but i still have my faith so i obviously can't accept some of the theory's like evolution.
what i've always wandered was why is it that astronomers and other scientist never seem to be true true christians.
 
Sep 7, 2012
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#2
Faith and knowledge are two alternating rungs on the ladder of maturity we use each as we grow in our mental acuity. God would have us climb the ladder and become ever more like him. There are times when we just have to let go of faith and rely on science and likewise there are times when we must also let go of science and rely on faith both are essential. Neither can get us where we want to go alone.

Science always leads us to new questions, and when we have those serious questions we start out in faith until again the facts are established. We need a science oriented clergy and a religious oriented science, balance and not isolation.
 
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megaman125

Guest
#3
i personolly really like science because nature and the universe is very interesting, my perticuler like is astronomy but i still have my faith so i obviously can't accept some of the theory's like evolution.
what i've always wandered was why is it that astronomers and other scientist never seem to be true true christians.
The more that people know (or think that they know), the more likely they are to become prideful and take a stance that they don't need God.

I also enjoy looking at God's creation throughout the universe.
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#4
if humans had a proper understanding of God's word and a perfect faith in it then there would be no clash between that and true science..but when humans have a distorted understanding of God's word and a less than perfect faith in God's word and a distorted way of doing science then serious problems and misconceptions arise for both people of faith and scientists
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#5
i personolly really like science because nature and the universe is very interesting, my perticuler like is astronomy but i still have my faith so i obviously can't accept some of the theory's like evolution.
what i've always wandered was why is it that astronomers and other scientist never seem to be true true christians.
There is nothing wrong with science. We all are curious. Science makes life better. However, we must always remember that the Lord created science and is quite capable of suspending, or even changing, scientific laws.
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#6
when God suspends one of His laws it is seen as a miracle..such as time stopping or the parting of a sea or walking on water
 
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Batman007

Guest
#8
i personolly really like science because nature and the universe is very interesting, my perticuler like is astronomy but i still have my faith so i obviously can't accept some of the theory's like evolution.
what i've always wandered was why is it that astronomers and other scientist never seem to be true true christians.
First of all evolution is a fact. Well, it's both a fact and a theory. But it's pretty widely accepted as true.

I think, as far as why most scientists aren't Christians, a lot of the things science show end up contradicting the bible. I'm no scientist, of course, but I imagine it's hard to work in a field that is constantly turning up evidence that most Christians don't agree with. However, as you know because you're interested in science, there are scientists that are Christian. I just don't think they usually take the bible as literal.
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#9
First of all evolution is a fact. Well, it's both a fact and a theory. But it's pretty widely accepted as true.

I think, as far as why most scientists aren't Christians, a lot of the things science show end up contradicting the bible. I'm no scientist, of course, but I imagine it's hard to work in a field that is constantly turning up evidence that most Christians don't agree with. However, as you know because you're interested in science, there are scientists that are Christian. I just don't think they usually take the bible as literal.
evolution is not a fact at all? where do you get that crazy idea from?
 
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Batman007

Guest
#10
evolution is not a fact at all? where do you get that crazy idea from?
Oh, lots of places. And like I said, it's a fact AND theory. Here are just some explaining this:

Evolution is a Fact and a Theory

Evolution Resources from the National Academies

Actionbioscience | Evolution: Fact and Theory

Even Wikipedia, although not a great source. Evolution as fact and theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All these were found with a simple google search. It's not difficult to research if you're willing, although I was happy to do so for you.
 
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AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#11
God and science: Evidence for God from Science

i personolly really like science because nature and the universe is very interesting, my perticuler like is astronomy but i still have my faith so i obviously can't accept some of the theory's like evolution.
what i've always wandered was why is it that astronomers and other scientist never seem to be true true christians.
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#12
evolution is a fact and theory...the two are diametrically opposed...something only becomes a fact if it is indisputable...theories are theories because they are disputable...something is either a fact or a theory...it would be like me taking the fact that you are a human and then saying it is a theory that you are a human so it can then be argued that you are not a human
 
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Batman007

Guest
#13
evolution is a fact and theory...the two are diametrically opposed...something only becomes a fact if it is indisputable...theories are theories because they are disputable...something is either a fact or a theory...it would be like me taking the fact that you are a human and then saying it is a theory that you are a human so it can then be argued that you are not a human
Did you read any of the links I posted?
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#14
not yet because my time has been taken up with some rather urgent issues and I have been studying the arguments of Creationism vs Evolution for the past thirty years..it is thirty years ago tomorrow that I was taught personally by Ken Ham and Dr. Gary Parker the truth
 
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Batman007

Guest
#15
not yet because my time has been taken up with some rather urgent issues and I have been studying the arguments of Creationism vs Evolution for the past thirty years..it is thirty years ago tomorrow that I was taught personally by Ken Ham and Dr. Gary Parker the truth
Ok well I think if you have been studying and arguing creationism and evolution for thirty years you would know this. And I mean no offense by this, but if Ken Ham and Gary Parker are your only sources, you may want to find some credible, well-known scientists to research instead. I'm sure both those men have done great work, but I never think it's a good idea to study something from an outsider's perspective. For example, would you let an atheist teach you about Christianity? I'd guess you'd rather learn about Christianity from a preacher or minister. It's the same thing. An atheist would bring too much of their bias to Christianity, just as a Christian would bring too much of their bias to teach about atheism.
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#16
Ok well I think if you have been studying and arguing creationism and evolution for thirty years you would know this. And I mean no offense by this, but if Ken Ham and Gary Parker are your only sources, you may want to find some credible, well-known scientists to research instead. I'm sure both those men have done great work, but I never think it's a good idea to study something from an outsider's perspective. For example, would you let an atheist teach you about Christianity? I'd guess you'd rather learn about Christianity from a preacher or minister. It's the same thing. An atheist would bring too much of their bias to Christianity, just as a Christian would bring too much of their bias to teach about atheism.
do you know Ken Ham and Gary Parkers credentials and the many many scientists who support them? have you ever visited the site of Creation Science and read through their many many scientific topics? I would be very very surprised if you have..I even typed up an article once for Dr Carl Wieland that he contributed to Creation Science so they let me have a free subscription for a year
 
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Batman007

Guest
#17
do you know Ken Ham and Gary Parkers credentials and the many many scientists who support them? have you ever visited the site of Creation Science and read through their many many scientific topics? I would be very very surprised if you have..I even typed up an article once for Dr Carl Wieland that he contributed to Creation Science so they let me have a free subscription for a year
Ken Ham and Gary Parkers throw out some very misleading ideas about evolution, and some of their statements are blatantly false. I'm gathering many of these statements now and will gladly share them if you want, along with why I consider them incorrect. Keep in mind I'm no scientist, but I think studying all ideas for why we are here is important, especially in regards to faith. I also, on a personal note, believe evolution in no way proves god does or does not exist. I think a lot of Christians have a real problem with evolution because they see it as a replacement for Jesus, when in fact many Christians accept Evolution as a real possibility.

Could you give me a link to this Creation Science site? I will gladly check it out. Also that's really cool that you've been published! That's quite an accomplishment!
 
Sep 10, 2012
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#18
look up Answers in Genesis - Creation, Evolution, Christian Apologetics and I did not write the article for Dr.Carl Wieland...I merely typed it up for him like a secretary and he submitted it to Creation Science so that they could publish it and I think your response to that site will be interesting and so will your arguments against Ken Ham and Dr Gary Parker be interesting
 
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megaman125

Guest
#19
First of all evolution is a fact. Well, it's both a fact and a theory. But it's pretty widely accepted as true.
The amount of people that believe it is true does not make something true.

Also, the theory about what happened "billions of years ago" is not fact. The scientific method is based on repeatable observations and experiements. For that reason, the scientific method cannot be used to prove anything about history.

I think, as far as why most scientists aren't Christians, a lot of the things science show end up contradicting the bible. I'm no scientist, of course, but I imagine it's hard to work in a field that is constantly turning up evidence that most Christians don't agree with. However, as you know because you're interested in science, there are scientists that are Christian. I just don't think they usually take the bible as literal.
There is nothing in actual science that contradicts the Bible.

Ken Ham and Gary Parkers throw out some very misleading ideas about evolution, and some of their statements are blatantly false. I'm gathering many of these statements now and will gladly share them if you want, along with why I consider them incorrect. Keep in mind I'm no scientist, but I think studying all ideas for why we are here is important, especially in regards to faith. I also, on a personal note, believe evolution in no way proves god does or does not exist. I think a lot of Christians have a real problem with evolution because they see it as a replacement for Jesus, when in fact many Christians accept Evolution as a real possibility.
Well, now it depends what type of evolution you're talking about, given that evolution is a giant package, and the word itself is often defined in various ways, usually it's whatever the evolutionist wants to be given the situation. For instance, when people start poking holes in evolution, the evolutionist will always respond with "that's not what evolution is," but that just makes it look like the evolutionists don't know the whole theory of evolution themselves. If I added up everytime that I poked holes in evolution and got the response "that's not what evolution is" then the theory of evolution amounts to nothing.

Back on topic, what many evolutionists fail to do is separate microevolution from macroevolution. Micro has evidence, we've seen this evidence, and it's verifiable with the scientific method. Examples include genetic mutations and adaptations through natural selection. Where Christians frequently have a problem with evolution are on these grounds:

1. The historical claims about evolution, how a single living cell branched off and became every different animal we have today (the common ancestory claims). And there is next to no evidence for this, it just comes to "we need to believe this stuff and assume it's true." But I see no reason to assume it's true.

2. Many evolutionists try to use evolution to deny God (coupling this with the big bang and abiogenesis). They like to claim that it's been proven that the universe, life, and the diversity of life all came into existence without any sort of creator or intelligent designer. Of course, there is no evidence to support such a thing, and that's just the evolutionists' belief system that they're trying to pass off as absolute truth.

3. This belief system with no evidence is taught in schools dogmatically as absolute unquestionable truth, despite the severe lack of evidence supporting it. The double standard comes into play because the Bible is not allowed to be taught in schools, despite having more evidence to support it than the "billions of years ago" belief system.
 
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Batman007

Guest
#20
The amount of people that believe it is true does not make something true.

Also, the theory about what happened "billions of years ago" is not fact. The scientific method is based on repeatable observations and experiements. For that reason, the scientific method cannot be used to prove anything about history.



There is nothing in actual science that contradicts the Bible.



Well, now it depends what type of evolution you're talking about, given that evolution is a giant package, and the word itself is often defined in various ways, usually it's whatever the evolutionist wants to be given the situation. For instance, when people start poking holes in evolution, the evolutionist will always respond with "that's not what evolution is," but that just makes it look like the evolutionists don't know the whole theory of evolution themselves. If I added up everytime that I poked holes in evolution and got the response "that's not what evolution is" then the theory of evolution amounts to nothing.

Back on topic, what many evolutionists fail to do is separate microevolution from macroevolution. Micro has evidence, we've seen this evidence, and it's verifiable with the scientific method. Examples include genetic mutations and adaptations through natural selection. Where Christians frequently have a problem with evolution are on these grounds:

1. The historical claims about evolution, how a single living cell branched off and became every different animal we have today (the common ancestory claims). And there is next to no evidence for this, it just comes to "we need to believe this stuff and assume it's true." But I see no reason to assume it's true.

2. Many evolutionists try to use evolution to deny God (coupling this with the big bang and abiogenesis). They like to claim that it's been proven that the universe, life, and the diversity of life all came into existence without any sort of creator or intelligent designer. Of course, there is no evidence to support such a thing, and that's just the evolutionists' belief system that they're trying to pass off as absolute truth.

3. This belief system with no evidence is taught in schools dogmatically as absolute unquestionable truth, despite the severe lack of evidence supporting it. The double standard comes into play because the Bible is not allowed to be taught in schools, despite having more evidence to support it than the "billions of years ago" belief system.
"There is nothing in actual science that contradicts the Bible"
There are plenty of things in "actual" science that contradict the bible. That's why I'm not a literalist. However, I'm guessing you are so arguing against you will get us nowhere, as we're both probably pretty set in our beliefs, which is fine.

Can you give me some examples of these holes you poked in evolution? Because if they're saying "that's not what evolution is", maybe you're misunderstanding evolution?

Well we've seen macro evolution through the study of fossils. This shows us the transitioning from one species to another via micro evolution.

1) There is plenty of evidence. It's not "assuming it's true", it's taking evidence that we have and forming conclusions. There are fossils and rocks that demonstrate a time frame for life on earth, which is very easily researched. It took roughly 2.5 billion years for the single-celled organisms to evolve into multi-celled organisms, and then another 400 million years or so until small, basic animals were formed. This isn't something that happens over night. It takes a really, really long time. However, evidence suggests that this did, indeed happen. Why on earth would scientists "need to believe this stuff and ASSUME it's true?" They study the earth to learn, not to form conclusions they already have their mind set on.

2) Some people use evolution to try and dispute the existence of god. I think this is ridiculous, personally. I can see how it might be used to dispute young-earth creationists who think the earth is 6000 years old, but evolution is in no way evidence for or against god. Also evolution has absolutely nothing to do with the big bang, and abiogenesis is not proven and really doesn't have a ton to do with evolution, either. When I speak to atheists they say there is no evidence to support god either, which I tend to agree with. That's why people have faith. Atheists just don't understand faith. They'd rather have evidence. Both are fine but they are certainly different.

3) Well this is just plain wrong, at least where I'm from in Missouri. We were taught evolution, but it was not taught as "absolutely unquestionable truth". In fact, we were encouraged to question it. Many people did, and we had classroom discussions about whether it was true or not. In the end NOTHING was forced on us, and kids were welcome to leave the room if they were uncomfortable. Christianity is religion, evolution is science, that's why it's taught in a science classroom and Christianity is taught in religion and geography and philosophy classes.