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Thread: Atheism By Default

  1. #1
    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Atheism By Default

    I have recently been witnessing to 2 of my cousins, one who showed signs of seeking and the other who appeared to just enjoy disrupting the conversation. I at least expected some substance to their argument but I came away with the conclusion that theirs, along with many other atheists I encounter are simply atheist by default. They do not study an alternative to the evolution theory the world puts about, they couldn't be bothered to look for their own data and were too lazy to look at a link I gave them, a link showing the improbability of our earth happening upon the ability to support life, if they did they would be astounded by their findings. They just threw the same tired old arguments at me - they had no information to back-up their beliefs.

    I'm trying not to put all atheists in the "stupid" category but it's hard not to. Some of the most intelligent people I know are creationists and those who's books I read; an astrophysicist, a bio-chemist, physicist, nano-technician, and a dear friend who is an architect - hardly the "dunce's" corner is it?

    A few points:

    1. The big bang theory doesn't exclude the need for God.
    2. Cause and effect means that everything cannot come from nothing.
    3. Faith isn't blind faith but reasoned faith.
    4. Evolution is just a theory the world would have us believe is fact.
    5. Even Darwin admitted he didn't have all the answers.
    6. If we came from apes why do apes still exist?
    7. As apes do exist where are all the "in between" stages of man's evolution?
    8. From where did man receive his his ability to reason and his intelligence?
    9. Atheism is a choice to be god of our own lives so we don't have to hold ourselves accountable for the things we do.
    10. How can God be evil if He doesn't exist?

    I put most of these points to my cousins and all they could do was mock me! Well "they" mocked Jesus too as He hung from the cross. So who exactly is the fool? Psalm 14:1
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    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Atheist by default? Wutt?
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    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    Atheist by default? Wutt?
    Well yes, they are atheist because they haven't bothered looking at any alternative.












    “Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who sets the planets in motion.” - Isaac Newton

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    Senior Member Miri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    I am reading a book at the moment called the Invisible King and His Kingdom.

    The following is an extract which pretty much explains why atheists cannot see.


    Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come,
    He answered them and said, “The kingdom of God does not come with observation.”
    —LUKE 17:20

    The Pharisees were looking for an observable kingdom. These Pharisees expected a visible,
    temporal kingdom. They were looking for a worldly kingdom. They could not understand the
    nature of the kingdom that Jesus preached. They were carnal and earthly; Jesus was spiritual
    and heavenly.

    The kingdom was in their midst, and they could not discern it. Healing and deliverance were
    signs that the kingdom had come nigh.

    The reason mortal man finds it difficult to absorb this subject is because of the limited perception
    we have for the world of the unseen. The world of the unseen is a spiritual dimension, and we
    have only the five senses of human nature (seeing, hearing, feeling, smelling, and tasting).

    These senses are the physiological methods of perception. The word perception is derived from
    the Latin words perceptio and percipio and means “receiving, collecting; action of taking possession;
    apprehension with the mind or senses.”1 Jesus understood this human limitation when He walked on
    Earth.

    When Nicodemus asked Jesus to explain the kingdom of God, Jesus replied, “If I tell you things that are
    plain as the hand before your face and you don’t believe me, what use is there in telling you of things
    you can’t see, the things of God?” (John 3:12, THE MESSAGE). Later, when He was speaking to the disciples
    about His imminent departure from them, He said to them, “You are from beneath; I am from above.
    You are of this world; I am not of this world” (John 8:23).


    Pray that the Holy Spirit will move in the heart of your cousins and they will respond. Because
    physical fleshy human beings cannot understand of their own accord. But they also have to be
    willing to do the seeking as well. I have prayed as well.
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    He is God and we are not.


    Quote Originally Posted by notmyown View Post
    Miri, for being Mary Poppins. (inside joke, but no, really! she's kind and no nonsense!)

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    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Miri View Post
    I am reading a book at the moment called the Invisible King and His Kingdom.

    The following is an extract which pretty much explains why atheists cannot see.


    Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come,
    He answered them and said, “The kingdom of God does not come with observation.”
    —LUKE 17:20

    The Pharisees were looking for an observable kingdom. These Pharisees expected a visible,
    temporal kingdom. They were looking for a worldly kingdom. They could not understand the
    nature of the kingdom that Jesus preached. They were carnal and earthly; Jesus was spiritual
    and heavenly.

    The kingdom was in their midst, and they could not discern it. Healing and deliverance were
    signs that the kingdom had come nigh.

    The reason mortal man finds it difficult to absorb this subject is because of the limited perception
    we have for the world of the unseen. The world of the unseen is a spiritual dimension, and we
    have only the five senses of human nature (seeing, hearing, feeling, smelling, and tasting).

    These senses are the physiological methods of perception. The word perception is derived from
    the Latin words perceptio and percipio and means “receiving, collecting; action of taking possession;
    apprehension with the mind or senses.”1 Jesus understood this human limitation when He walked on
    Earth.

    When Nicodemus asked Jesus to explain the kingdom of God, Jesus replied, “If I tell you things that are
    plain as the hand before your face and you don’t believe me, what use is there in telling you of things
    you can’t see, the things of God?” (John 3:12, THE MESSAGE). Later, when He was speaking to the disciples
    about His imminent departure from them, He said to them, “You are from beneath; I am from above.
    You are of this world; I am not of this world” (John 8:23).


    Pray that the Holy Spirit will move in the heart of your cousins and they will respond. Because
    physical fleshy human beings cannot understand of their own accord. But they also have to be
    willing to do the seeking as well. I have prayed as well.
    Thank you Miri, yes I have been praying about this too.

    I'm currently reading John's Gospel, this is the 3rd time I have read it but this time the detail is incredible - detail I've not noticed before. Jesus boldly calling Himself God for one thing but much more than this.

    Your average atheist will say "if there is a God, why doesn't he show up". What kind of question is this? Does He have to show up for every generation and be re-crucified for them? We have a book FULL of eye-witness accounts yet still they do not believe.
    wwjd_kilden and Miri like this.












    “Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who sets the planets in motion.” - Isaac Newton

  6. #6
    wwjd_kilden
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Never discuss with an atheist, they will have answers to every one of those points of yours, that make no sense, but that they think make sense.

    trust me, I've tried- I end up accused of being ignorant of science and of being crazy....

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    Senior Member Magenta's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

    We are all born enemies to God in Adam, which is why we
    need to be spiritually born again into the second Adam.

    1John 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin.

    Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the
    world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men,
    for that all have sinned:


    Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death..

    Romans 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
    11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
    12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become
    unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.


    Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God:
    for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.


    God is angry with the wicked every day. (Psalm 7:11)

    They are like Pharaoh who said, Who is the Lord,
    that I should obey his voice? Exodus 5:2.


    What is the Almighty, that we should serve him? and what
    profit should we have, if we pray unto him? (Job 21:15)


    Psalms 10:4 The wicked, through the pride of his countenance,
    will not seek after God: God is not in all his thoughts.


    Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

    Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

    http://www.sounddoctrine.net/Nick/enemies_%20God.htm
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    Embrace the Grace and Rejoice in His Everlasting Mercy and Love

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    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    My brother is your typical atheist, he spends his entire life going from woman to woman in search for a perfect wife to look after him and supply his "needs" if you get my drift - each letting him down, each only interested in what he can give them. As I explained to my cousins; it is pointless for a person to expect his/her spouse to make them happy - it's unfair and unrealistic and puts strain on a marriage. We each have a God-shaped hole in our lives only He can fill. Happiness is possible without God but Joy will be impossible without Him.

    My brother is an angry short-tempered man. I never see him smile, he has an underlying sadness and apparently no time to consider God.
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    “Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who sets the planets in motion.” - Isaac Newton

  9. #9
    MollyConnor
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    I've noticed that the students in school who are atheists (which are many) are just following the crowd. They're not leaders and they can't think for themselves. Ironically they may be academically smart, but once they go out into the real world, they can't function. I know several who are like that. Most of them just keep going back to college (Masters or PhD programs) so that they don't have to deal with anything but academia.

    They're depressed, angry, have an entitled attitude and not very fun to be around.

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    Senior Member breno785au's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Amazing-Grace View Post
    I have recently been witnessing to 2 of my cousins, one who showed signs of seeking and the other who appeared to just enjoy disrupting the conversation. I at least expected some substance to their argument but I came away with the conclusion that theirs, along with many other atheists I encounter are simply atheist by default. They do not study an alternative to the evolution theory the world puts about, they couldn't be bothered to look for their own data and were too lazy to look at a link I gave them, a link showing the improbability of our earth happening upon the ability to support life, if they did they would be astounded by their findings. They just threw the same tired old arguments at me - they had no information to back-up their beliefs.

    I'm trying not to put all atheists in the "stupid" category but it's hard not to. Some of the most intelligent people I know are creationists and those who's books I read; an astrophysicist, a bio-chemist, physicist, nano-technician, and a dear friend who is an architect - hardly the "dunce's" corner is it?

    A few points:

    1. The big bang theory doesn't exclude the need for God.
    2. Cause and effect means that everything cannot come from nothing.
    3. Faith isn't blind faith but reasoned faith.
    4. Evolution is just a theory the world would have us believe is fact.
    5. Even Darwin admitted he didn't have all the answers.
    6. If we came from apes why do apes still exist?
    7. As apes do exist where are all the "in between" stages of man's evolution?
    8. From where did man receive his his ability to reason and his intelligence?
    9. Atheism is a choice to be god of our own lives so we don't have to hold ourselves accountable for the things we do.
    10. How can God be evil if He doesn't exist?

    I put most of these points to my cousins and all they could do was mock me! Well "they" mocked Jesus too as He hung from the cross. So who exactly is the fool? Psalm 14:1
    Have hope and believe in them, believe they can be saved (Tis hard I know) for I used to be that exact same person.
    Amazing-Grace likes this.
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    Senior Member AbigailZeke's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    It's true though. It is harder to prove a Muslim wrong, than an Atheist.
    How blessed is the person whose sins the Lord will never charge against him! – Psalm 32:2, Romans 4:8
    For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. – Romans 10:4
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    Senior Member jsr1221's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    To be fair, we all have been athiests. I don't believe anyone that says they've been a Christian all their lives. If that would be the case, then folks have gone through their life without questioning or looking into anything that has been said to them. But back to the op, to call them stupid is a lil much. As stated earlier, we were nonbelievers at one point. It'd be better to pray for them privately and show them grace and love through your actions.

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    Senior Member AbigailZeke's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Some are born agnostics
    Amazing-Grace likes this.
    How blessed is the person whose sins the Lord will never charge against him! – Psalm 32:2, Romans 4:8
    For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. – Romans 10:4
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    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AbigailZeke View Post
    Some are born agnostics
    Yeah I used to be agnostic although to be fair I kind of knew there was more to it but allowed myself to be talked out of it as a child. God had been calling me all of my life pretty much.
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    “Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who sets the planets in motion.” - Isaac Newton

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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Amazing-Grace View Post
    I have recently been witnessing to 2 of my cousins, one who showed signs of seeking and the other who appeared to just enjoy disrupting the conversation. I at least expected some substance to their argument but I came away with the conclusion that theirs, along with many other atheists I encounter are simply atheist by default. They do not study an alternative to the evolution theory the world puts about, they couldn't be bothered to look for their own data and were too lazy to look at a link I gave them, a link showing the improbability of our earth happening upon the ability to support life, if they did they would be astounded by their findings. They just threw the same tired old arguments at me - they had no information to back-up their beliefs.

    I'm trying not to put all atheists in the "stupid" category but it's hard not to. Some of the most intelligent people I know are creationists and those who's books I read; an astrophysicist, a bio-chemist, physicist, nano-technician, and a dear friend who is an architect - hardly the "dunce's" corner is it?

    A few points:

    1. The big bang theory doesn't exclude the need for God.
    2. Cause and effect means that everything cannot come from nothing.
    3. Faith isn't blind faith but reasoned faith.
    4. Evolution is just a theory the world would have us believe is fact.
    5. Even Darwin admitted he didn't have all the answers.
    6. If we came from apes why do apes still exist?
    7. As apes do exist where are all the "in between" stages of man's evolution?
    8. From where did man receive his his ability to reason and his intelligence?
    9. Atheism is a choice to be god of our own lives so we don't have to hold ourselves accountable for the things we do.
    10. How can God be evil if He doesn't exist?

    I put most of these points to my cousins and all they could do was mock me! Well "they" mocked Jesus too as He hung from the cross. So who exactly is the fool? Psalm 14:1
    Some good thoughts. Just my two cents:

    1. There are many problems with the Big Bang Theory and it doesn't gel with the Creation account we're given.

    4. In Science, the word 'theory' takes on a different meaning. But as the scientific method is a Christian invention and evolution is nonsense, it doesn't really matter.

    6. If we are descended from the common ancestor of apes, why do apes still exist? isn't a good question, no matter how stupid evolution is.

    10. One better. If God doesn't exist and truth is relative, and good and evil don't exist, how can atheists deem anyone or anything to be good or evil?
    Last edited by Tintin; September 21st, 2016 at 01:50 AM.

  16. #16
    MollyConnor
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tintin View Post
    Some good thoughts. Just my two cents:

    1. There are many problems with the Big Bang Theory and it doesn't gel with the Creation account we're given.

    4. In Science, the word 'theory' takes on a different meaning. But as the scientific method is a Christian invention and evolution is nonsense, it doesn't really matter.

    6. If we are descended from the common ancestor of apes, why do apes still exist? isn't a good question, no matter how stupid evolution is.

    10. One better. If God doesn't exist and truth is relative, and good and evil don't exist, how can atheists deem anyone or anything to be good or evil?
    Why is 6 not a good argument/question?
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MollyConnor View Post
    Why is 6 not a good argument/question?
    Molly,

    “If we evolved from apes, why are there still apes today?”

    In response to this statement, some evolutionists point out that they don’t believe that we descended from apes, but that apes and humans share a common ancestor. However, the evolutionary paleontologist G.G. Simpson had no time for this “pussyfooting”, as he called it. He said, “In fact, that earlier ancestor would certainly be called an ape or monkey in popular speech by anyone who saw it. Since the terms ape and monkey are defined by popular usage, man’s ancestors were apes or monkeys (or successively both). It is pusillanimous if not dishonest for an informed investigator to say otherwise.”

    However, the main point against this statement is that many evolutionists believe that a small group of creatures split off from the main group and became reproductively isolated from the main large population, and that most
    changes happened in the small group which can lead to allopatric speciation (a geographically isolated population forming a new species). So there’s nothing in evolutionary theory that requires the main group to become extinct.

    It’s important to note that allopatric speciation is not the sole property of evolutionists—creationists believe that most human variation occurred after small groups became isolated (but not speciated) at Babel, while Adam and Eve probably had mid-brown skin color. The quoted erroneous statement is analogous to saying ‘If all people groups came from Adam and Eve, then why are mid-brown people still alive today?’

    So what’s the difference between the creationist explanation of people groups (‘races’) and the evolutionist explanation of people origins? Answer: the former involves separation of already-existing information and loss of information through mutations; the latter requires the generation of tens of millions of ‘letters’ of new information.

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    Arguments we think creationists should NOT use - creation.com

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    Senior Member Yeraza_Bats's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AbigailZeke View Post
    It's true though. It is harder to prove a Muslim wrong, than an Atheist.
    I dunno, Islam is pretty easy to disprove : p

    Quran 5:75 tells us Christ was no more than a prophet. But Christ called Himself the "Son of Man" multiple times. If you read the bible, youd (not as in actually you personally : p) see that the Son of Man comes from Daniel 7,one who "appears as a son of man" who stands in the presence of God who reigns over the world forever and ever and is worshiped by all people. Meaning Christ claimed to be more than a prophet. Whether or not He was speaking the truth, Muhammad was still wrong and that makes him a false prophet : p

    (Thats why they tell us Paul went and changed the entire bible with no one noticing, even allah : p)
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    Senior Member Amazing-Grace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    Yes the Quran isn't as old as the Bible and given much of it matches, I'd say that parts of it has more than likely been copied from the Bible.












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    Default Re: Atheism By Default

    The comments that make me the most angry are those that associate all religions with terrorism and hatred. I really don't see why Christians get associated with extreme Islam.
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    “Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who sets the planets in motion.” - Isaac Newton

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