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Thread: Is hell justifyed?

  1. #21
    Senior Member maxwel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zray View Post
    Haha, you caught me. Though as said above this wasnt a valid question. This is one of the many things that athiests say is a problem with religion. I wanted to see how Christians would respond. So what do Christians made of the studies that have found correlations between being religous and lower overall intellegence. And yes i know im an asshole.


    1. The studies I've personally seen denigrating the education or intelligence of Christians have all collapsed after just rudimentary examination.

    People often do some kind of skewed study, with a very odd sampling, and then claim this skewed and biased sampling goes on to prove something that even WITH the biased sampling it doesn't even prove. Then it gets picked up in the media, and passed around... because atheists seem to enjoy bashing Christians.

    Atheists often seem to enjoy bashing Christians, just like the OP is doing here: even admitting he KNOWS this is an obnoxious thing to discuss... he still brings it up for discussion anyway.



    2. Even if these studies are correct, and all of us poor bewildered Christians are as dumb as a box of turnips, the studies are still COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT TO CHRISTIANITY.

    Really?

    Logically, nothing ABOUT a person has anything to do with DETERMINING the logical validity of a proposition the person holds.

    - A blind man can be right if he claims the sky is blue.
    - A deaf man can be right if he claims Mozart is a great composer.
    - A person with intellectual disability can be right if he claims that gravity holds us to the earth.

    Nothing ABOUT a person has any logical bearing on the veracity of his proposition.

    If atheists want to refute theism, they need to do more than insult people.
    They need to DISPROVE THE ARGUMENTS.

    If atheists desire to be truly intellectually superior, they might consider engaging in debate with logic, rather than insults.



    3. This is a classic example of an informal logical fallacy called an "ad hominem argument."

    In an ad hominem argument you attack the person, and then claim that by attacking the person you somehow magically refute the person's argument.

    An ad hominem argument is a classic logical fallacy.
    And claiming that Christianity is invalidated by positing Christians are ignorant is a classic example of this classic fallacy.

    You don't actually win a rational debate by insulting people.
    You have to refute the arguments.

    Even if you insult people about something which is TRUE,
    you STILL have to refute the arguments.

    Insults have no logical bearing on the validity of an argument.

  2. #22
    Senior Member maxwel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    And no I'm not upset, lol.

    But I do get tired of hearing insults in the place of rational discussion...
    not because the insults bother me,
    but because they're irrational and have nothing to do with the argument.


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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Yes hell is justified, it's fair.

    I think this is a good chapter on the topic of God's supremely just way of judgement. A good chapter for the study of why some will get to paradise, why some will be condemned to hell, and the nature of repentance and the nature of falling away, and also the supreme and just logic of the Lord God.

    Ezekiel 18

    1 The word of the Lord came unto me again, saying,
    2 What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge?
    3 As I live, saith the Lord God, ye shall not have occasion any more to use this proverb in Israel.
    4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
    5 But if a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right,
    6 And hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, neither hath defiled his neighbour's wife, neither hath come near to a menstruous woman,
    7 And hath not oppressed any, but hath restored to the debtor his pledge, hath spoiled none by violence, hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment;
    8 He that hath not given forth upon usury, neither hath taken any increase, that hath withdrawn his hand from iniquity, hath executed true judgment between man and man,
    9 Hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord God.
    10 If he beget a son that is a robber, a shedder of blood, and that doeth the like to any one of these things,
    11 And that doeth not any of those duties, but even hath eaten upon the mountains, and defiled his neighbour's wife,
    12 Hath oppressed the poor and needy, hath spoiled by violence, hath not restored the pledge, and hath lifted up his eyes to the idols, hath committed abomination,
    13 Hath given forth upon usury, and hath taken increase: shall he then live? he shall not live: he hath done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood shall be upon him.
    14 Now, lo, if he beget a son, that seeth all his father's sins which he hath done, and considereth, and doeth not such like,
    15 That hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, hath not defiled his neighbour's wife,
    16 Neither hath oppressed any, hath not withholden the pledge, neither hath spoiled by violence, but hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment,
    17 That hath taken off his hand from the poor, that hath not received usury nor increase, hath executed my judgments, hath walked in my statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
    18 As for his father, because he cruelly oppressed, spoiled his brother by violence, and did that which is not good among his people, lo, even he shall die in his iniquity.
    19 Yet say ye, Why? doth not the son bear the iniquity of the father? When the son hath done that which is lawful and right, and hath kept all my statutes, and hath done them, he shall surely live.
    20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
    21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
    22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
    23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord God: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?
    24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
    25 Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal?
    26 When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die.
    27 Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive.
    28 Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
    29 Yet saith the house of Israel, The way of the Lord is not equal. O house of Israel, are not my ways equal? are not your ways unequal?
    30 Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord God. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin.
    31 Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
    32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord God: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    I just hope Zray answers my question before he gets banned. Trolls always come in and blast their troll questions but they never answer any. I have never gotten an answer out of a troll to my question, but Zray seems like a troll who will actually converse instead of just spewing pre-fab troll lines.
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    Senior Member hornetguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    So what do Christians made of the studies that have found correlations between being religous and lower overall intellegence.
    Let's get something straight, here.....

    stupid 1.png

    stupid.png

    No man is really saved unless he is in his heart obedient to Christ. C.H. Spurgeon

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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    The answer is i cant object to anything god does, nor can i object to something which from my frame of reasoning does not exist. A god can do anything he damn well pleases, though as i stated above i didnt create this thread just to troll. It was to see christans reactions and responses to common critism athiests use. For me this was more of a trial run to see how my arguements would play out. While i did find this greatly entertaining to reason with people with other beliefs i also gained some better understanding of Christianity and how most athiests use critism that doesnt hold up logically. Lastly one more question where is hell? (Not a troll i just never got a valid answer before)

  7. #27
    Senior Member Ahwatukee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Lastly one more question where is hell? (Not a troll i just never got a valid answer before)
    Greetings Zray,

    There are three Greek words translated as Hell:

    Tartartus: used only once in in 2 Peter 2:4 in reference to those angels that sinned, which is most likely referring to those angels who took wives from the progeny of men and whose offspring became giants. Where they will remain in gloomy darkness until the great white throne judgment. Though the word Tartarus is not used, I believe that Jude males reference to these same angels when he said:

    "And the angels who did not stay within their own domain, but abandoned their proper dwelling, He keeps under darkness, in eternal chains for judgment on that great day." Jude 6

    Sheol/Hades: Referred to as the abode of departed spirits of the unrighteous, which is in the depths of the earth. This is the same place that the rich man of Lazarus fame went to and was/is in torment in flame. After the millennium, those in Sheol/Hades will be resurrected and will stand before God at the great white throne judgment, where they will be held accountable for every sin they ever committed. (Luke 16:19-31, Rev.20:11-15)

    Gehenna: Also called the lake of fire and the second death. This is the final place of punishment for all whose names are not written in the book of life, the location of which is not revealed, but most definitely will not be on this earth. Below is a list of all the references to Sheol and Hades.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Job 14:13 - If only you would hide me in Sheol and conceal me till your anger has passed! If only you would set me a time and then remember me!

    Job 17:13-16 - If I look for Sheol as my home, I make my bed in the darkness; If I call to the pit, ‘You are my father’; To the worm, ‘my mother and my sister’; Where now is my hope? And who regards my hope? “Will it go down to the bars of Sheol? Shall we descend together into the dust?”? Shall we together go down into the dust?”

    Job 21:12-13 - They sing to the timbrel and harp and rejoice at the sound of the flute. “They spend their days in prosperity, and suddenly they go down to Sheol.

    Job 24:19 - Drought and heat consume the snow waters, so does Sheol those who have sinned.

    Job 26:6 - Naked is Sheol before Him, And Abaddon has no covering.

    Psalm 6:4-5 - Return, O LORD, rescue my soul; Save me because of Your lovingkindness. For there is no mention of You in death; In Sheol who will give You thanks?

    Psalm 9:17 - The wicked will return to Sheol, Even all the nations who forget God.

    Psalm 16:10 - For You will not abandon my soul to Sheol; Nor will You allow Your Holy One to undergo decay.

    Psalm 18:5 - The cords of Sheol surrounded me; The snares of death confronted me.

    Psalm 30:3 - O LORD, You have brought up my soul from Sheol; You have kept me alive, that I would not go down to the pit.

    Psalm 31:17 - Let me not be put to shame, O LORD, for I call upon You; Let the wicked be put to shame, let them be silent in Sheol.”

    Psalm 49:14 - As sheep they are appointed for Sheol; Death shall be their shepherd; And the upright shall rule over them in the morning, And their form shall be for Sheol to consume So that they have no habitation.”

    Psalm 49:15 - But God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol, For He will receive me. Selah.”

    Psalm 55:15 - Let death come deceitfully upon them; Let them go down alive to Sheol, For evil is in their dwelling, in their midst.[/quote]

    Psalm 86:13 - For Your lovingkindness toward me is great, And You have delivered my soul from the depths of Sheol

    Psalm 88:3 - For my soul has had enough troubles, And my life has drawn near to Sheol

    Psalm 89:48 - What man can live and not see death? Can he deliver his soul from the power of Sheol? Selah.

    Psalm 116:3 - The cords of death encompassed me and the terrors of Sheol came upon me; I found distress and sorrow.

    Psalm 139:8 - If I ascend to heaven, You are there; If I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there.

    Psalm 141:7 - As when one plows and breaks open the earth, our bones have been scattered at the mouth of Sheol.

    Prov.1:12 - Let us swallow them alive like Sheol, Even whole, as those who go down to the pit;

    Prov.5:5 - Her feet go down to death, Her steps take hold of Sheol

    Prov.7:27 - Her house is the way to Sheol, Descending to the chambers of death

    Prov.9:18 - But he does not know that the dead are there, that her guests are in the depths of Sheol

    Prov.15:11 - Sheol and Abaddon lie open before the LORD, How much more the hearts of men!

    Prov.15:24 - The path of life leads upward for the wise That he may keep away from Sheol below.

    Prov.23:13-14 - Do not hold back discipline from the child, although you strike him with the rod, he will not die. You shall strike him with the rod and rescue his soul from Sheol.

    Prov.27:20 - Sheol and Abaddon are never satisfied, Nor are the eyes of man ever satisfied.

    Eccl.9:10 - Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might; for there is no activity or planning or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol where you are going.

    Songs 8:6 - Put me like a seal over your heart, Like a seal on your arm. For love is as strong as death, Jealousy is as severe as Sheol; Its flashes are flashes of fire, The very flame of the LORD.

    Isa.5:14 - Therefore Sheol has enlarged its throat and opened its mouth without measure; and Jerusalem’s splendor, her multitude, her din of revelry and the jubilant within her, descend into it.

    Isa.14:9 - Sheol from beneath is excited over you to meet you when you come; It arouses for you the spirits of the dead, all the leaders of the earth; It raises all the kings of the nations from their thrones.

    Isa.14:11 - Your pomp and the music of your harps Have been brought down to Sheol; Maggots are spread out as your bed beneath you And worms are your covering

    Isa.14:15 - Nevertheless you will be thrust down to Sheol, To the recesses of the pit

    Isa.28:15 - Because you have said, "We have made a covenant with death, And with Sheol we have made a pact. The overwhelming scourge will not reach us when it passes by, For we have made falsehood our refuge and we have concealed ourselves with deception."

    Isa.28:18 - Your covenant with death will be canceled, and your pact with Sheol will not stand; When the overwhelming scourge passes through, Then you become its trampling place.

    Isa.38:10 - I said, "In the middle of my life I am to enter the gates of Sheol; I am to be deprived of the rest of my years."

    Isa.38:18 - For Sheol cannot thank You, Death cannot praise You; Those who go down to the pit cannot hope for Your faithfulness.

    Isa.57:9 - "You have journeyed to the king with oil And increased your perfumes; You have sent your envoys a great distance And made them go down to Sheol.

    Ezk.31:15-17 - Thus says the Lord GOD, "On the day when it went down to Sheol I caused lamentations; I closed the deep over it and held back its rivers. And its many waters were stopped up, and I made Lebanon mourn for it, and all the trees of the field wilted away on account of it. I made the nations quake at the sound of its fall when I made it go down to Sheol with those who go down to the pit; and all the well-watered trees of Eden, the choicest and best of Lebanon, were comforted in the earth beneath. “They also went down with it to Sheol to those who were slain by the sword; and those who were its strength lived under its shade among the nations.


    Ezk.32:21 - The strong among the mighty ones shall speak of him and his helpers from the midst of Sheol, 'They have gone down, they lie still, the uncircumcised, slain by the sword

    Ezk.32:27 - Nor do they lie beside the fallen heroes of the uncircumcised, who went down to Sheol with their weapons of war and whose swords were laid under their heads; but the punishment for their iniquity rested on their bones, though the terror of these heroes was once in the land of the living.

    Hosea 13:14 - Shall I ransom them from the power of Sheol? Shall I redeem them from death? O Death, where are your thorns? O Sheol, where is your sting? Compassion will be hidden from My sight.

    Amos 9:2 - Though they dig into Sheol, From there will My hand take them; And though they ascend to heaven, From there will I bring them down.

    Jonah 2:2 - and he said, "I called out of my distress to the LORD, And He answered me. I cried for help from the depth of Sheol; You heard my voice.

    Hab.2:5 - "Furthermore, wine betrays the haughty man, So that he does not stay at home. He enlarges his appetite like Sheol, And he is like death, never satisfied. He also gathers to himself all nations And collects to himself all peoples.


    Hades:
    Mt.11:23 - And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades. For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day.

    Mt.16:18 - And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it.

    Luke 10:15 - And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades.

    Luke 16:23-24 - In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

    Acts 2:27 - because You will not abandon my soul to Hades, nor will You let Your Holy One see decay. (Note: this verse ties both Psalms 16:10 and Acts 2:27 where the words Sheol and Hades are used interchangeably).

    Acts 2:31 - Having foreseen, he spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that neither was He abandoned into Hades, nor did His flesh see decay.

    Rev.1:18 - I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

    Rev.6:8 - And I looked, and behold, a pale horse, and the one sitting on it, the name of him was Death, and Hades was following with him; and authority was given to them over the fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, and with famine, and with plague, and by the beasts of the earth.

    Rev.20:13 - And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.

    Rev.20:14 - Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.

    Characteristics of:

    • Is down under the earth - Gen.37:35, 42:38, 44:29, 44::31, Num.16:30, 16:33, Deut.32:22, 1 Sam.2:6, 2 kings 2:6, Job 11:7-8, 17:16, Ps.30:3, 86:13, Prov.9:18, 15:24, Isa.5:14, 14:9, 14:11, 14:15, Isa.38:18, Ezk.31:15-17, Ezk.32:21, Ezk.32:27, Mt.11:23, Lk.10:15,



    • Has multiple levels - Deut.32:22, Job 11:7-8,



    • Referred to as the pit - Job 17:13, Ps.30:3, Prov.1:12, Isa.14:15, Isa.38:18, Ezk.31:15-17



    • Has Chambers - Prov.7:27



    • Has Gates/Bars - Job 17:16, Isa.38:10, Mt.16:18



    • A place of torment in fire – Lk.16:23-24



    • Is a literal entity representing the same location – Rev.6:8, 20:14


    Sheol (sheh-ole') The underworld (place to which the spirits of people descend at death)
    Hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranean retreat), including its accessories and inmates -- grave, hell, pit.

    Hades (hah'-dace) The unseen world:
    hádēs (from 1 /A "not" and idein/eidō, "see") – properly, the "unseen place," referring to the (invisible) realm in which the unrighteous dead reside, i.e. the present dwelling place of all the departed (deceased); Hades.
    Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no account of wrongs. Love takes no pleasure in evil, but rejoices in the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Miri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    God doesn’t actually send anyone to “eternal death” hell etc, people
    do it to themselves as they refuse to accept His gift of eternal life.


    Imagine if every person on the planet was inflicted by a fatal disease.
    A cure was found and offered to everyone for free but only some
    accepted it. Who would be responsible for their deaths?

    The sin nature is far more than a lie, theft, bad language, murder, deceit etc.
    It’s endemic in the population. God doesn’t want anyway to face eternal
    death that’s why we have the sacrifice of Jesus, it was so serious that
    God the Son was willing to give up His own life.

    But there is a saying you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it
    drink.


    Isaiah 55:1 NKJV
    [1] "Ho! Everyone who thirsts, Come to the waters; And you who have no money,
    Come, buy and eat. Yes, come, buy wine and milk Without money and without price.



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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zray View Post
    The answer is i cant object to anything god does, nor can i object to something which from my frame of reasoning does not exist. A god can do anything he damn well pleases, though as i stated above i didnt create this thread just to troll. It was to see christans reactions and responses to common critism athiests use. For me this was more of a trial run to see how my arguements would play out. While i did find this greatly entertaining to reason with people with other beliefs i also gained some better understanding of Christianity and how most athiests use critism that doesnt hold up logically. Lastly one more question where is hell? (Not a troll i just never got a valid answer before)
    It sounds like you may be close to splitting. So we can't let you leave without hearing the Gospel. There are no accidents in God's Kingdom. You didn't come here just by chance. Perhaps this is the Holy Spirit YET AGAIN attempting to reach you with God's Grace through His Son. I'd counsel you not to blaspheme the Holy Spirit with a final rejection of Jesus. You don't know when your life will end and it will be too late. This could be His last attempt.

    God wrapped Himself in human flesh in the form of His Son, Jesus Christ. Born of a virgin, conceived by the Holy Spirit, He suffered, was crucified, and died to pay the price for our sin. He rose from the grave after 3 days proving He defeated death.

    Confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him to life, and you WILL be saved.

    I pray in His Name you hear AND believe this gospel.
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    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zray View Post
    The answer is i cant object to anything god does, nor can i object to something which from my frame of reasoning does not exist. A god can do anything he damn well pleases, though as i stated above i didnt create this thread just to troll. It was to see christans reactions and responses to common critism athiests use. For me this was more of a trial run to see how my arguements would play out. While i did find this greatly entertaining to reason with people with other beliefs i also gained some better understanding of Christianity and how most athiests use critism that doesnt hold up logically. Lastly one more question where is hell? (Not a troll i just never got a valid answer before)
    Well if this was a bench-test of trolling techniques...

    1: Make sure you have a good criticism. Don't just copy/paste from a big list of "criticisms atheists use" and hope something hits home. Know the criticism you are using and why it should be effective against Christians. Also it's a bit important that you believe the criticism you are using. Throwing out an argument that you don't personally believe is never anywhere near as effective as arguing from something you really think is true.

    2. Think about what people say in reply to your criticism and make logical rebuttals based on what they actually say. Everybody is tired of trolls that just come in and blast their lines. If you want to be a GOOD troll, start an actual dialog and keep it going. "LOL YOU PEOPLE ARE SO DUMB!" is the lazy way to troll.

    3. Clean up your spelling a bit. Your syntax is better than that of the average troll but you keep slipping typos in. Even in this short post of yours I just quoted there are multiple misspelled words. If you want people to take your trolling seriously and get really engaged in an argument with you, you need to make it look like you are seriously trying to argue the points you bring.

    4. Know what the Bible says. When you are arguing with Christians they will use the Bible a lot. It is not enough to try to prove the Bible is unreliable - even if you did prove it to your satisfaction, they would never believe it. The best trolls know the Bible and can use it against Christians. Even satan himself used scripture to try to argue with Jesus, and frankly satan used it very well, as it would be hard to find better arguments than the ones he used. You don't have to read the whole big Bible, just know the parts that you can use against Christians. And keep a bible app on your phone or something, so when Christians quote verses you can look it up quickly to see what it is they are talking about.

    Go forth young Zray! Go and troll those silly Christians! Troll well young sir!
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  11. #31
    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    *Lynx looks around at all the other forum members glaring at him...

    What? I'm just trying to be helpful! Poor Zray has nothing better to do than troll, he might as well at least do it right... right?

    I didn't even reveal everything I know about being a good troll. I just gave him a few good tips to get started.
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    "Do you sing at church?"
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  12. #32
    Senior Member NotmebutHim's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx View Post
    Well if this was a bench-test of trolling techniques...

    1: Make sure you have a good criticism. Don't just copy/paste from a big list of "criticisms atheists use" and hope something hits home. Know the criticism you are using and why it should be effective against Christians. Also it's a bit important that you believe the criticism you are using. Throwing out an argument that you don't personally believe is never anywhere near as effective as arguing from something you really think is true.

    2. Think about what people say in reply to your criticism and make logical rebuttals based on what they actually say. Everybody is tired of trolls that just come in and blast their lines. If you want to be a GOOD troll, start an actual dialog and keep it going. "LOL YOU PEOPLE ARE SO DUMB!" is the lazy way to troll.

    3. Clean up your spelling a bit. Your syntax is better than that of the average troll but you keep slipping typos in. Even in this short post of yours I just quoted there are multiple misspelled words. If you want people to take your trolling seriously and get really engaged in an argument with you, you need to make it look like you are seriously trying to argue the points you bring.

    4. Know what the Bible says. When you are arguing with Christians they will use the Bible a lot. It is not enough to try to prove the Bible is unreliable - even if you did prove it to your satisfaction, they would never believe it. The best trolls know the Bible and can use it against Christians. Even satan himself used scripture to try to argue with Jesus, and frankly satan used it very well, as it would be hard to find better arguments than the ones he used. You don't have to read the whole big Bible, just know the parts that you can use against Christians. And keep a bible app on your phone or something, so when Christians quote verses you can look it up quickly to see what it is they are talking about.

    Go forth young Zray! Go and troll those silly Christians! Troll well young sir!
    This reminds me of when I wrote a satirical essay in my 11th grade English class about how to be a bad student.
    So you're telling me this is a signature line??

  13. #33
    Senior Member joefizz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx View Post
    Well if this was a bench-test of trolling techniques...

    1: Make sure you have a good criticism. Don't just copy/paste from a big list of "criticisms atheists use" and hope something hits home. Know the criticism you are using and why it should be effective against Christians. Also it's a bit important that you believe the criticism you are using. Throwing out an argument that you don't personally believe is never anywhere near as effective as arguing from something you really think is true.

    2. Think about what people say in reply to your criticism and make logical rebuttals based on what they actually say. Everybody is tired of trolls that just come in and blast their lines. If you want to be a GOOD troll, start an actual dialog and keep it going. "LOL YOU PEOPLE ARE SO DUMB!" is the lazy way to troll.

    3. Clean up your spelling a bit. Your syntax is better than that of the average troll but you keep slipping typos in. Even in this short post of yours I just quoted there are multiple misspelled words. If you want people to take your trolling seriously and get really engaged in an argument with you, you need to make it look like you are seriously trying to argue the points you bring.

    4. Know what the Bible says. When you are arguing with Christians they will use the Bible a lot. It is not enough to try to prove the Bible is unreliable - even if you did prove it to your satisfaction, they would never believe it. The best trolls know the Bible and can use it against Christians. Even satan himself used scripture to try to argue with Jesus, and frankly satan used it very well, as it would be hard to find better arguments than the ones he used. You don't have to read the whole big Bible, just know the parts that you can use against Christians. And keep a bible app on your phone or something, so when Christians quote verses you can look it up quickly to see what it is they are talking about.

    Go forth young Zray! Go and troll those silly Christians! Troll well young sir!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx View Post
    *Lynx looks around at all the other forum members glaring at him...

    What? I'm just trying to be helpful! Poor Zray has nothing better to do than troll, he might as well at least do it right... right?

    I didn't even reveal everything I know about being a good troll. I just gave him a few good tips to get started.
    Or have an avatar of a Lynx and speak your mind is another way to troll!
    NotmebutHim likes this.
    If you don't believe in true love then please don't tell me not to believe in it because I believe it to be real.
    I'm a self proclaimed troll tracker.
    I am hopeless...thankfully though Jesus's grace is sufficient for my weakness.
    I have a tendency to speak through the spirit if you can't handle that get some ear plugs.
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  14. #34
    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by joefizz View Post
    Or have an avatar of a Lynx and speak your mind is another way to troll!
    Nah, that's no good. Real trolling takes a conscious, deliberate effort and a bit of intelligence. Nobody would ever confuse me with a troll... at least not with a GOOD one.
    joefizz likes this.
    "Do you sing at church?"
    "Yes I sing at church. And I sing at work. And I sing at home... and in the car... at the supermarket... at Wal-Mart..."

  15. #35
    Senior Member joefizz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx View Post
    Nah, that's no good. Real trolling takes a conscious, deliberate effort and a bit of intelligence. Nobody would ever confuse me with a troll... at least not with a GOOD one.
    Uh huh...you know I have witnesses lol!
    If you don't believe in true love then please don't tell me not to believe in it because I believe it to be real.
    I'm a self proclaimed troll tracker.
    I am hopeless...thankfully though Jesus's grace is sufficient for my weakness.
    I have a tendency to speak through the spirit if you can't handle that get some ear plugs.
    Quote Originally Posted by WineRose View Post
    Joefizz = Jojo's Bizzare Adventure!
    Quote Originally Posted by Milktalk View Post
    haha joey joe joe - a roo!



  16. #36
    Senior Member joefizz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by joefizz View Post
    Uh huh...you know I have witnesses lol!
    Seoul search for instance,hahaha!
    If you don't believe in true love then please don't tell me not to believe in it because I believe it to be real.
    I'm a self proclaimed troll tracker.
    I am hopeless...thankfully though Jesus's grace is sufficient for my weakness.
    I have a tendency to speak through the spirit if you can't handle that get some ear plugs.
    Quote Originally Posted by WineRose View Post
    Joefizz = Jojo's Bizzare Adventure!
    Quote Originally Posted by Milktalk View Post
    haha joey joe joe - a roo!



  17. #37
    Senior Member seoulsearch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by joefizz View Post
    Seoul search for instance,hahaha!
    I don't know about a troll, but Lynx is definitely a certified goblin:




    Some time ago, Lynx and I had an all-out verbal sparring over whether this "goblin's" ears look more like a rabbit (according to Seoulsearch) or a fox (according to Lynx.)

    Please, cast your votes now.

    Er... I mean... Sorry for the derail.

    I just heard my name and thought I'd pop in.

    Do carry on.
    Miri and NotmebutHim like this.
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  18. #38
    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    There is no derail. The OP admitted it was trolling, or something like a field test of trolling anyway. With no real topic, there is no derail.

    I'm going to talk about chocolate for a while. I wish I could get really good chocolate here. Southwest Tennessee is a wonderful place to live, never gets incredibly hot or cold, nice people here, but it's a gastronomic wasteland. Of course I'm staying here because the good vastly outweighs the bad... well, the lack-of-good in all food matters... but I do wish I could get some good chocolate at the local grocery store.
    NotmebutHim likes this.
    "Do you sing at church?"
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  19. #39
    Senior Member maxwel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zray View Post
    The answer is i cant object to anything god does, nor can i object to something which from my frame of reasoning does not exist. A god can do anything he damn well pleases, though as i stated above i didnt create this thread just to troll. It was to see christans reactions and responses to common critism athiests use. For me this was more of a trial run to see how my arguements would play out. While i did find this greatly entertaining to reason with people with other beliefs i also gained some better understanding of Christianity and how most athiests use critism that doesnt hold up logically. Lastly one more question where is hell? (Not a troll i just never got a valid answer before)


    You still aren't refuting the arguments.

    You're just whining and name calling.




    This is what atheists do when they suddenly realize they can't actually win a debate.








    Last edited by maxwel; 5 Days Ago at 11:04 AM.

  20. #40
    Senior Member Lynx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is hell justifyed?

    Quote Originally Posted by maxwel View Post
    You still aren't refuting the arguments.

    You're just whining and name calling.




    This is what atheists do when they suddenly realize they can't actually win a debate.








    Easy there, hold your fire Tex. He already admitted he was a troll and an atheist, and he already said he could not refute the counter arguments.

    And near as I can see he didn't even call anybody any names... You sure called somebody a whiny name caller though.
    RickyZ likes this.

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