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mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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Congrats for being perfect! :)
It's interesting how he avoided answering my questions to determine if he believes that he lives a sinless, without fault of defect, flawless perfect life, 100% of the time, just as Jesus lived. ;)
 
May 20, 2016
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The NT was written in Greek then later translated into multiple different languages (including English). You are picking out your pet English translation and ignoring the Greek then taking these verses to the extreme to teach sinless perfection, which the Bible does not teach. I already thoroughly explained the truth to you in post #94. You need to read 1 John 1:5-2:2. Also, sinless perfectionists get tripped up by the word "perfect" which comes from teloioi, end, goal, limit. It can be used as the goal set before us, the absolute standard of our Heavenly Father. The word is used also for relative perfection as of adults compared with children.

So absolute perfection for us will not become a reality until Christ returns and then we will be made perfect with Christ. Yet teleioi is also used to refer to the maturity of an adult, which is the end or aim to which the child points. Thus it denotes those who have attained the full development of innate powers, in contrast to those who are still in the undeveloped state (children).

James 1:4 says - But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing.

James 3:2 says - For we all stumble in many things. If anyone does not stumble in word, he is a perfect man, able also to bridle the whole body.

James 2:22 says - Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? The NASB says "was perfected," the ESV says "faith was completed by his works."

So depending on how the word "perfect" is used in Scripture, it may refer to "absolute perfection" or "relative perfection."

You never did answer my questions: Do you believe that you are sinless, without fault of defect, flawless, 100% of the time? Is that what you are trusting in for salvation? Sinless perfect performance on your part?
Jesus gave us what he meant by perfect. Perfect to Jesus means being as his Father in heaven is. It is so sad that the only way you can live God’s Word is to rewrite it.
(Matthew 5:48) “Even the pagans do as much, do they not? You must therefore be perfect just as your heavenly Father is perfect.”
 
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Congrats for being perfect! :)
Your sarcasm does not say much good for you. Besides a Spiritual Christian becomes a Child of God only through the power of God. God get all the glory and honor for him or her being a Child of God.

(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”

 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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Jesus gave us what he meant by perfect. Perfect to Jesus means being as his Father in heaven is. It is so sad that the only way you can live God’s Word is to rewrite it.
(Matthew 5:48) “Even the pagans do as much, do they not? You must therefore be perfect just as your heavenly Father is perfect.”
Do you claim to be perfect "in the sense" that you are sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, 100% of the time, exactly like God the Father?
 
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Do you claim to be perfect "in the sense" that you are sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, 100% of the time, exactly like God the Father?
Jesus Christ our Lord and God proclaimed me clean, and keeps me clean. I don’t claim to be anything but a Christian/a follower of Jesus Christ our Lord and God. If I do any wrong doing, Jesus will tell me, and he is not accusing me of any wrongdoings.
I claim to be a Christian. That alone should tell those who claim to also be Christians that I am without sin.

When people use a verse such as 1 John 1:8-10 trying to say it is a lie to say one no longer sins, it is such a misunderstanding of what John said. If it was true what those people wanted to believe, then they are making scripture contradicting its self. I know scripture does not contradict its self.

(1 John 1: 8-10)[SUP] “[/SUP]If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.”


You need to see John was saying if one says he or she says they have never sinned they are liars.


If one is forgiven of all unrighteousness are they not then sinless?

Could they then be liars if they say they are sinless?
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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Jesus Christ our Lord and God proclaimed me clean, and keeps me clean. I don’t claim to be anything but a Christian/a follower of Jesus Christ our Lord and God. If I do any wrong doing, Jesus will tell me, and he is not accusing me of any wrongdoings.
Do you claim to be perfect "in the sense" that you are sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, 100% of the time, exactly like God the Father? *The question requires a YES or NO answer. Also, God the Father has not done anything wrong.

I claim to be a Christian. That alone should tell those who claim to also be Christians that I am without sin.
Can you please explain to me how you became a Christian?

Claiming to be without sin tells me that you are deceived (1 John 1:8).

When people use a verse such as 1 John 1:8-10 trying to say it is a lie to say one no longer sins, it is such a misunderstanding of what John said. If it was true what those people wanted to believe, then they are making scripture contradicting its self. I know scripture does not contradict its self.
1 John 1:8-10 is crystal clear and there are no contradictions in the Bible.

(1 John 1: 8-10)[SUP] “[/SUP]If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.”
If we claim to be without sin, (as you do) we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. *Take heed to those words.

You need to see John was saying if one says he or she says they have never sinned they are liars.
John is saying if one not only says they have not sinned (vs. 10) but also have no sin. In verse 8 it's a matter of recognizing sin in our lives and in verse 10 it's a matter of denying that we have ever sinned at all.

If one is forgiven of all unrighteousness are they not then sinless?
Not in of themselves, but believers receive the remission of sins and are accounted as righteous in Him (Acts 10:43; Philippians 3:9).

Could they then be liars if they say they are sinless?
If they claim to be sinless (in of themselves) yes, they are liars. I see that you are promoting your false doctrine of sinless perfection on the Carm Discussion Forum as well.
 
Mar 11, 2016
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abigail.pro
Your sarcasm does not say much good for you. Besides a Spiritual Christian becomes a Child of God only through the power of God. God get all the glory and honor for him or her being a Child of God.

(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”

Thou shall not judge.
 
May 20, 2016
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Do you claim to be perfect "in the sense" that you are sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, 100% of the time, exactly like God the Father? *The question requires a YES or NO answer. Also, God the Father has not done anything wrong.

Can you please explain to me how you became a Christian?

Claiming to be without sin tells me that you are deceived (1 John 1:8).

1 John 1:8-10 is crystal clear and there are no contradictions in the Bible.

If we claim to be without sin, (as you do) we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. *Take heed to those words.

John is saying if one not only says they have not sinned (vs. 10) but also have no sin. In verse 8 it's a matter of recognizing sin in our lives and in verse 10 it's a matter of denying that we have ever sinned at all.

Not in of themselves, but believers receive the remission of sins and are accounted as righteous in Him (Acts 10:43; Philippians 3:9).

If they claim to be sinless (in of themselves) yes, they are liars. I see that you are promoting your false doctrine of sinless perfection on the Carm Discussion Forum as well.
About saying one is sinless I will give you Paul’s answer.
(1 Corinthians 4:4-5) “True, my conscience does not reproach me at all, but that does not prove that I am acquitted: the Lord alone is my judge. There must be no passing of premature judgment. Leave that until the Lord comes: he will light up all that is hidden in the dark and reveal the secret intentions of men's hearts. Then will be the time for each one to have whatever praise he deserves, from God.”
Notice he said his conscience does not reproach him. Paul had the mind of Jesus Christ, and if God had anything to reproach Paul he would have known.

You asked how I became a Christian. That is a good question, and the answer is short, but the explanation may be long. I began to be a Christian the same way everyone does, God called me.
(Matthew 22:14) “For many are called, but few are chosen.”
Jesus called me when I was a child, and his call always had me wanting to do his will. But doing his will just was not possible for me to do all the time. My mistake was that I accepted the teachings of the Church.
The Churches teaching kept me away from the truth. For years I prayed to never sin again, and even asked God to let me die before I would sin again. But no I did not die, nor was I able to always do God’s Will.
I continued my mistake, and got very involved in my church. I went to Mass, and Communion every day. Taught adult information classes for the church. Was even the president of the churches social club. But all of that did not give me the power to do God’s Will.
My understanding is that most all people who claim to be Christians have a similar story to tell. But I believe most people like what their church teaches, and truly don’t want to live God’s Will.

After trying so hard to do God’s Will for the first forty years of my life, with not much success, Jesus began to answer my prayers. Jesus began by telling me he loved me, and I was to open up my hart and let his light shine. Jesus also began to ask me to be a minister for him, but for me a minister was being a priest. I was married, and had two children at the time, so I assumed Jesus meant just to get more involved in the church. God let me believe my assumption for two years.

Then I was given the Holy Spirit who began to teach me, and gave me the grace/power to do God’s Will. It took me two years before I actually understood that my assumption about what Jesus’ call to the ministry was wrong.
During those two years I became a Christian. The Holy Spirit gave me the grace to be able to always do God’s
 
M

Melissabrazil

Guest
Hello, i am new around here.. nice to meet you all. I wish God blesses us!!!
 
S

SalvationSoldier

Guest
Saved does not mean one will go the heaven, and you have no scripture that tells you it does.
Jesus told us who will come to heave with him.
(Matthew 7:21) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”
Welcome. I love your zeal for the Lord. I just wanted to point out I believe you may be confusing salvation with sanctification. People all people have sinned and fall short of the glory of GOD. Some have more sins of commission while others have more sins of omission. Being that Gods standard is perfection and the word sin literally mean to miss the mark I personally do not believe that anyone is sinless. I do believe as followers of Christ we should sin less. Even the apostles who walked with Christ sinned. Romans 7:15. I have found that no one cares what you know until they know you you care. You can not judge the heart of another person. You can judge their fruit but through social networking you can not get an accurate idea of their fruit. As the Scriptures say, "No one is righteous—not even one." (Rom. 3:10,)
For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard. (Rom. 3:23, )
We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. (Is. 64:6)
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. (Eph. 2:8-90
GODs word is met for the uplifting and edification of His body. No one is going to take correction from someone who does not approach them in live. I pray that you take the chance to show people your heart so that you do not push people away from God.
 
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Welcome. I love your zeal for the Lord. I just wanted to point out I believe you may be confusing salvation with sanctification. People all people have sinned and fall short of the glory of GOD. Some have more sins of commission while others have more sins of omission. Being that Gods standard is perfection and the word sin literally mean to miss the mark I personally do not believe that anyone is sinless. I do believe as followers of Christ we should sin less. Even the apostles who walked with Christ sinned. Romans 7:15. I have found that no one cares what you know until they know you you care. You can not judge the heart of another person. You can judge their fruit but through social networking you can not get an accurate idea of their fruit. As the Scriptures say, "No one is righteous—not even one." (Rom. 3:10,)
For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard. (Rom. 3:23, )
We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. (Is. 64:6)
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. (Eph. 2:8-90
GODs word is met for the uplifting and edification of His body. No one is going to take correction from someone who does not approach them in live. I pray that you take the chance to show people your heart so that you do not push people away from God.
No I am not the one who is confused. Salvation does not mean one will enter the kingdom of God. Also one has to believe in Jesus, and that means be in Jesus to enter the kingdom of God.

(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”

Jesus told us who would go with him into his kingdom, but people choose to ignore what Jesus said about that.

(Matthew 7:21) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”
(John 12:47-48) “If anyone hears my words and does not keep them faithfully, it is not I who shall condemn him, since I have come not to condemn the world, but to save the world: he who rejects me and refuses my words has his judge already: the word itself that I have spoken will be his judge on the last day.”
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”

this fills me with such joy, and love for all people!

does it do the same for you?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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No I am not the one who is confused. Salvation does not mean one will enter the kingdom of God. Also one has to believe in Jesus


you expect a bunch of saved people to go to hell?
and that one can be saved without believing in Jesus?

but you don't think you are confused.

interesting! hmm!

thank you SOO much!!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”

WOW isn't this wonderful ??

i am ETERNALLY GRATEFUL to God because of this.

He is faithful to the end, even when i am faithless - and to the one who does nothing but believes in the One who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness.

hallelujah!!

can i get an "AMEN" Jacklove??

wonderful. simply beyond words
:D:):D:):D:):D:):D:):D:):D
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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no response huh? but i see you are viewing this page the whole time, for several hours.

i assume you must be busily forgiving sinners and loving mercy. must have been urgently called away by someone in need of being shown grace and lovingkindness, so that you forgot to log off.

i'll just leave you to it then. :)
 

slave

Senior Member
Mar 20, 2015
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A Christian knows Jesus is his or her Lord and God. A Christian does not sin. A Christian keep all of God’s Commandments.

God’s Commandments are all the Words of the New Testament.


A Christian lives as Jesus lived.


(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”


I know from God that the Christian Bible is the written Word of God.
A Christian is a Child-like person who has been loved by God and is in love with their Father thru Jesus Christ, whom they also love, and whom loves us first in the God-head. A Christian is one whom can conquer all things outside of this Father's relationship, because their Father protects and loves them dearly. Yes, God is about His purposes, and His purposes in us I do agree, but every seventh day God wants us to be reminded to "Stop" to rest in all He has given you in nature and in Himself and do nothing but enjoy it for He is in charge and can take care of everything outside of our effort. When God asks us to do His will it is to share in His glory, not burden us with a task. Welcome to CC John, it is my pleasure to meet you. I along with you want to obey God; to share in His glory for He loves us so, and I love Him back. May God richly bless you here. My name is Dan.


* "Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say rejoice!" (Philippians 4:4).
 
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slave

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Mar 20, 2015
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Ps). Sharing in His glory means to be broken as He is broken, to love one another as He first loved us and gave His life for us. When I see it that way, my brokeness events a changed life from sin, because Jesus conquered death on the Cross; and at the right hand is finishing His work in us.
 
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