Amillennialists...Here's a chance to state your case.

I'm related to the Seed spiritually.

The war is spiritual. No need to ignore these facts.

When the women went to the tomb Of our Lord they believed the Gardener had moved his body, John 20:15. Peter said he was going fishing,John 21:3 . Thomas said he would not believe unless he sees the nail holes and...,John 20 :25....

When they saw Jesus they thought he was a spirit,Luke 24:37. We were hoping he was but... https://biblehub.com/interlinear/luke/24-21.htm and others...

You cannot understand Matthew 24:3 without first understanding this.

Yes we do not wrestle against flesh and blood. Not sure what is meant by spiritualize something away.? Did you mean offer a spiritual understanding of that parable as you did?

It's like a fork in the road in the Scriptures,so to speak,,, and the answer the Lord gave them is then lost in preconceived notions among the different camps. And it is understood by understanding that the scriptures say that they did not understand, https://biblehub.com/luke/18-34.htm ,,, https://biblehub.com/mark/9-32.htm ect.,,,,,

Can't understand what without first understanding the other?

What they ask him. Then the answer he gave makes sense. Look at post 462 and 464...

Just as God allowed Satan to test Job he allowed him to set up modern Israel. It is part of Bible Prophecy in that it is part of the
strong delusion involving the antichrist. The Bible teaches that a remnant of Israel will be saved not because of ethnic considerations
but of belief in Christ as Lord and Messiah. It says they will look upon him who they pierced. This happens at Christs second coming

Hey Melach, we all have clear charts. If you want to see the 4 different camps the chart below does just that.

I feel as if outside the camps...

I feel more comfortable though with the light blue it's closer to Millennialism.

That is also called Historic Premillennialsm. That is my belief also.

What do you think they ask the Lord in Matthew 24:3(in light of post # 462 & 464)?

Hi thanks, sorry

So then are you saying Jesus hides the spiritual understanding and that is the key to understanding Mathew 24 ?

Is the idea of the second coming, Christ coming in the flesh for another outward demonstration of the unseen work of pouring out His Spirit? Or is the second coming something different and he will come like a thief in the night as in the day of Noah. But this time its the end of the world?

No,,, I'm not saying Jesus is hiding anything. Everyone thinks that the disciples are asking about his second coming so in post 462 and 464 I gave some Scriptures from after the Crucifixion showing the reactions of the same disciples to him being killed. Jesus does mention his return in the answer he gave but they did not understand he was going to be killed at that time and so I gave the scriptures from the bible showing this also. They ask about the sign of his coming as the Messiah/king and they thought he was not going to die
but was there to stay.

Rare few I think understand what you said and since they don't they follow after and see as Holy the substitute and support it.

In ad66-70 the Jews did not believe the Lord was the Messiah and decided to take matters into their own hands and remove the authority of the forth beast and it ended in disaster. From the mid to late 1800's till now in similar fashion many were/are tired of waiting for his return and again have decided to take matters into their own hands and set up and build the things they think are suppose to be there(here) and it will end in disaster because they should have been patient and waited.

That puzzles me? Waited for what another demonstration? I think Noah was waiting but the end still came like a thief in the night.

This is A.H. book 5,chapter 25.4-5 they build this for him and when he comes they and all who give support to this receive him as if he were Christ.

4. The Lord also spoke as follows to those who did not believe in Him: "I have come in my Father's name, and ye have not received Me: when another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive," calling Antichrist "the other," because he is alienated from the Lord. This is also the unjust judge, whom the Lord mentioned as one "who feared not God, neither regarded man," to whom the widow fled in her forgetfulness of God,-that is, the earthly Jerusalem,-to be avenged of her adversary. Which also he shall do in the time of his kingdom: he shall remove his kingdom into that [city], and shall sit in the temple of God, leading astray those who worship him, as if he were Christ. To this purpose Daniel says again: "And he shall desolate the holy place; and sin has been given for a sacrifice, and righteousness been cast away in the earth, and he has been active (fecit), and gone on prosperously." And the angel Gabriel, when explaining his vision, states with regard to this person: "And towards the end of their kingdom a king of a most fierce countenance shall arise, one understanding [dark] questions, and exceedingly powerful, full of wonders; and he shall corrupt, direct, influence (faciet), and put strong men down, the holy people likewise; and his yoke shall be directed as a wreath [round their neck]; deceit shall be in his hand, and he shall be lifted up in his heart: he shall also ruin many by deceit, and lead many to perdition, bruising them in his hand like eggs." And then he points out the time that his tyranny shall last, during which the saints shall be put to flight, they who offer a pure sacrifice unto God: "And in the midst of the week," he says, "the sacrifice and the libation shall be taken away, and the abomination of desolation [shall be brought] into the temple: even unto the consummation of the time shall the desolation be complete." Now three years and six months constitute the half-week.

5. From all these passages are revealed to us, not merely the particulars of the apostasy, and [the doings] of him who concentrates in himself every satanic error, but also, that there is one and the same God the Father, who was declared by the prophets, but made manifest by Christ. For if what Daniel prophesied concerning the end has been confirmed by the Lord, when He said, "When ye shall see the abomination of desolation, which has been spoken of by Daniel the prophet" (and the angel Gabriel gave the interpretation of the visions to Daniel, and he is the archangel of the Creator (Demiurgi), who also proclaimed to Mary the visible coining and the incarnation of Christ), then one and the same God is most manifestly pointed out, who sent the prophets, and made promise of the Son, and called us into His knowledge.

What are your thoughts about what Jesus was saying in Matthew 24:15 (the part in bold) -

"Therefore when you shall see 'the abomination [singular] of desolation,' having been spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place--the one reading, let him understand--"

[Q: what would be "the holy place" ? (at that future time)]



I believe this must speak to the "abomination [singular]" in Daniel chpt 12 [this is not to say that Dan9:27 is wholly unrelated, but the word is plural there] -

Dan12 [kjv] - "And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination [singular] that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days."

Dan12 [bsb] - "11 And from the time the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination [singular] of desolation set up, there will be 1,290 days."


What do you believe Jesus is referring to by saying [see] "standing in the holy place" ? (and Daniel's words which say "set up").

And do you see this as relating to 2Th2:4?


[I'm asking those who blv this is future, as I do]