Does God desire the salvation of all mankind?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
K

kaylagrl

Guest
If I am not mistaken, I believe that the people that looked upon the serpent of brass were the nation of Israel (God's people) who had been disobedient, and were being chastened by God, with the snake bites, telling them to look upon the brass serpent for healing.

God's born again people, today, also look to Jesus for healing.

Do you think that "those men that love darkness rather than light" are depicted in 1 Cor 2:14, as the natural man?

We are sinners in need of a Savior. But if God "created" a people to be evil, then He cannot justly hold them accountable for what He created them to be. And He would have to apologize to satan, because his sin isn't his fault but Gods.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,758
26,630
113
We are sinners in need of a Savior. But if God "created" a people to be evil, then He cannot justly hold them accountable for what He created them to be. And He would have to apologize to satan, because his sin isn't his fault but Gods.
That does seem to be the fatal flaw of Calvinism: that God would choose to punish with everlasting
torment those who refused His offer of salvation even though that offer was never open to them.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,680
113
So, you didn't think it necessary to define what YOU meant in writing: "God wills all to be saved."

Can you give a specific example of God willing something and what he willed occurred?

And can you give a specific example of God willing something and what He willed did not occur -and what His 'will' meant in that situation?
Sure, not everyone will be saved though God wills them to be saved. Unless you’re going to advocate for Universalism?

God wants all to be saved.
1 Timothy 2
3This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.

Not all will be saved.
Luke 13
23Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”
He said to them, 24“Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,680
113
Then He cannot hold them accountable for what He created man to be. That would be unjust and we know God is just.
It also creates a paradox.

If God created people to be evil, as one said here, then they wouldn’t be evil since they would be doing what God made them to do. If God’s creation performs its intended purpose then it’s automatically good.

Doesn’t make sense, but that’s the foundation of Calvinism. It doesn’t stand to Biblical scrutiny.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,396
1,204
113
So are you saying you can't know whether you are saved and on your way to heaven?

Titus 3:7 - That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs, according to the hope of eternal life

Rom 8:24 - For we are saved by hope, but hope that is seen is not hope, for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

1 Thes 5:8 - But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and for an helmet, the hop of salvation.

Titus 1: 2 - In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began.

Heb 6:18-20 - That by two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, which have fled for refuge to lay holt upon the hope set before us,

which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which entereth into that within the veil, whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

This hope is not a wishful hope, but a sure and steadfast hope.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,396
1,204
113
This needs to be properly interpreted. In the DIVINE FOREKNOWLEDGE OF GOD he already sees those who choose evil over good, who choose to reject the Gospel and reject Christ. So God sees them as vessels of dishonor. He knows in advance who will believe and who will not believe the Gospel. But that is not the same as claiming that God predestines some for damnation. That is Calvinistic Nonsense.

You may be forgetting what God saw by his foreknowledge, that no one would seek him, no, not one.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,680
113
The words what if is indicating what God done.
No.

“What if” is not a synonym for something that’s a foregone conclusion. Romans 9 contains hypothetical scenarios.

“What if” means “a question that asks someone to imagine what might happen or what might have happened.”

source: The Britannica Dictionary
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
15,702
5,578
113
62
No.

“What if” is not a synonym for something that’s a foregone conclusion. Romans 9 contains hypothetical scenarios.

“What if” means “a question that asks someone to imagine what might happen or what might have happened.”

source: The Britannica Dictionary
What if he didn't know that?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
15,702
5,578
113
62
Then I imagine he would adjust his views in light of new information, but a high degree of indoctrination can prevent such things.
It was just a joke on what if. Few people are very amenable to adjusting views or even examining them.
 

MessengerofTruth

Well-known member
Dec 21, 2022
688
432
63
If I am not mistaken, I believe that the people that looked upon the serpent of brass were the nation of Israel (God's people) who had been disobedient, and were being chastened by God, with the snake bites, telling them to look upon the brass serpent for healing.

God's born again people, today, also look to Jesus for healing.

Do you think that "those men that love darkness rather than light" are depicted in 1 Cor 2:14, as the natural man? Would they be included in "whosoever may come"?
2 Tim. 2:24-26
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
3,601
1,092
113
Australia
Thats what the devil want you to believe !
His blood was paid so everyone can be saved.. provision for all of mankind.. but not everyone will be saved because they choose to reject the gift.
........ Men and brethren, what shall we do? ACTS 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Act 3:19 KJV Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
His blood was paid so everyone can be saved.. provision for all of mankind.. but not everyone will be saved because they choose to reject the gift.
........ Men and brethren, what shall we do? ACTS 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Act 3:19 KJV Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Right, why send people to evangelize if they cannot respond to the message.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
3,601
1,092
113
Australia
Backwards, the only way to believe the Gospel is to first be saved.
A deception of the devil is to make people believe they must be good enough, or must be saved enough before they can come to Jesus and receieve the Holy Spirit.

Jesus loves us to come to Him in any state. All we need to do is realize our need. Realize we are sinners needing Jesus..
Rom 5:7-10
7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
You may be forgetting what God saw by his foreknowledge, that no one would seek him, no, not one.

Isaiah 55:6-7
6 Seek the LORD while he may be found; call on him while he is near.
7 Let the wicked forsake their ways and the unrighteous their thoughts. Let them turn to the LORD, and he will have mercy on them, and to our God, for he will freely pardon.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,670
13,072
113
You may be forgetting what God saw by his foreknowledge, that no one would seek him, no, not one.
And that is exactly why the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit all work together to draw ALL men to Christ through the Gospel. Do you know that the Gospel is THE POWER OF GOD UNTO SALVATION? That the Gospel is called "the Word of God", and "the Word of Truth", and that the Word of God is quick and powerful and sharper than any sword? That the Gospel is "the seed" of the New Birth?
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,396
1,204
113

2 Tim 2: 10 - Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation (deliverance) which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

Verse 25 - Timothy is instructing them that oppose themselves (whom are Hy-me-mae-'us and Phi-le''-tus, who concerning the truth have erred, verse 17-18) praying that God will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth. When a born again child repents, he has been delivered (saved here in time) from the error of his ways.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,055
525
113
Then He cannot hold them accountable for what He created man to be. That would be unjust and we know God is just.
Yes He can hold them accountable, He is God and they belong to Him
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,055
525
113
So like ForestGreenCook, you believe faith is not required for salvation. :unsure:
Salvation has no requirements except what Christ Christ met and fulfilled to save His People. If you believe in requirements for salvation by the sinner, thats law, works, merit salvation.