God won't violate man's will?

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Pilgrimshope

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
#21
Sep 2, 2020
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#21
ForestGreenCook said:
Can I have a scripture reference to that statement?
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“And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1:26-28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD's:

But the earth hath he given to the children of men.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭115:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; and hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; that they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭17:24, 26-27‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#22
Jul 8, 2018
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#22
Nehemiah6 said:
Would that be violating man's will? If you ask for something then you are willing to accept it.
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The truth of the scriptures is, that the natural man, according to 1 Cor 2:14 will not ask a spiritual God for anything that is of a spiritual nature, thinking them to be foolishness.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#23
Jul 3, 2015
56,478
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#23
ForestGreenCook said:
There is a deliverance=salvation, here on earth, that is received by those that have been born again, when they come unto a knowledge of the truth.
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Hello Forest... the verse says that God wants everyone to come to the knowledge of the truth. Jesus Christ is the Truth; knowing Jesus equals possessing eternal life equal = salvation.
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#24
Jul 8, 2018
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#24
Pilgrimshope said:
“and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭2:2‬ ‭
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Scripture prove scripture, there are no contradictions of scripture in the inspired word of God.

The "world" in 1 John 2:2, is the same "world" that is listed in John 3:16, which is the world of believers. (Thayer's concordance definition; of the world in John 3:16: Any aggregate or general collection of particles of any sort . Used of believers only; John 1:29, 3:16, 3:17, 6:33, 12:47, 1 Cor 4:9, 2 Cor 5:19.

A world that cannot receive the Spirit truth is not the same world as described in John 3:16 (John 14:17)

A world that hates those who believe is not the same world described in John 3:16 ( John 15:18-19)

A world that will rejoice when they shall no more see Jesus is not the same world in John 3:16 (John 16;19-20)

A world that Jesus will not pray for is not the world of John 3:16 (John 17:9)

A world that hates the believers of John 3:16, because they are not a part of their world (John 17:14)

A world that Jesus tells us not to be conformed to is not the same world in John 3:16 (Rom 12:2)

A present evil world is not the same world of John 3:16 (Gal 3:4)
 
Pilgrimshope

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
#25
Sep 2, 2020
12,956
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#25
ForestGreenCook said:
Scripture prove scripture, there are no contradictions of scripture in the inspired word of God.

The "world" in 1 John 2:2, is the same "world" that is listed in John 3:16, which is the world of believers. (Thayer's concordance definition; of the world in John 3:16: Any aggregate or general collection of particles of any sort . Used of believers only; John 1:29, 3:16, 3:17, 6:33, 12:47, 1 Cor 4:9, 2 Cor 5:19.

A world that cannot receive the Spirit truth is not the same world as described in John 3:16 (John 14:17)

A world that hates those who believe is not the same world described in John 3:16 ( John 15:18-19)

A world that will rejoice when they shall no more see Jesus is not the same world in John 3:16 (John 16;19-20)

A world that Jesus will not pray for is not the world of John 3:16 (John 17:9)

A world that hates the believers of John 3:16, because they are not a part of their world (John 17:14)

A world that Jesus tells us not to be conformed to is not the same world in John 3:16 (Rom 12:2)

A present evil world is not the same world of John 3:16 (Gal 3:4)
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It seems like scripture can be ignored though lol
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#26
Jul 8, 2018
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#26
Magenta said:
Hello Forest... the verse says that God wants everyone to come to the knowledge of the truth. Jesus Christ is the Truth; knowing Jesus equals possessing eternal life equal = salvation.
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Truth of the gospel is spiritual truth. You do realize, I hope, that the natural person, before they have been born spiritually, cannot receive anything that is of a spiritual nature (1 Cor 2:14).
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#28
Jul 18, 2017
24,637
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#28
ForestGreenCook said:
The truth of the scriptures is, that the natural man, according to 1 Cor 2:14 will not ask a spiritual God for anything that is of a spiritual nature, thinking them to be foolishness.
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You are using the wrong Scripture for the wrong reasons, because your doctrine is false. God has given the Gospel for THE LOST to hear and believe. But do you care? If the lost could not hear and believe then why would God give the lost world the Gospel? Do you see your silliness?
 
Foghorn

Foghorn

Active member
#30
May 6, 2024
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christcentered.community.forum
#30
Pilgrimshope said:
If they are praying for God to save them thier Will is bieng exhibited
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Their wills are being exhibited?

According to synergists if your praying for someone to be saved your asking God to do so against their will. And according to synergists God don’t violate man’s will.

So why ask God to do what He won’t do? You’re better off just begging the lost sinner to believe, that is if you want to remain consistent.
 
PennEd

PennEd

Senior Member
#31
Apr 22, 2013
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#31
ForestGreenCook said:
Jesus's death is not sufficient for all, only those that God called, and gave to Christ to redeem them from their sins (John 6:37-39).
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Of course God “violates” man’s will, because our will is to sin. And He gave us the faith to accept His Son, and THEN we have free will not to sin.

But what you have said here is a bridge way too far.
 
Omegatime

Omegatime

Well-known member
#32
Apr 29, 2023
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#32
Foghorn said:
If God cannot violate man’s will, why do synergists pray for God to save them? Are synergists confused?

Shouldn't you rather beg the person to believe?
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define synergists please
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#33
Jul 3, 2015
56,478
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#33
ForestGreenCook said:
Truth of the gospel is spiritual truth. You do realize, I hope, that the natural person, before they have been born spiritually, cannot receive anything that is of a spiritual nature (1 Cor 2:14).
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We have discussed this before, Forest. Many are spiritually seeking truth in their own way, and sure, they are rejecting the Bible and Biblical God, but that doesn't mean they reject all things of a spiritual nature. Jesus Christ is the embodiment of Truth, and it is promised to those who diligently seek that they shall find.
 
Pilgrimshope

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
#34
Sep 2, 2020
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#34
Foghorn said:
Their wills are being exhibited?

According to synergists if your praying for someone to be saved your asking God to do so against their will. And according to synergists God don’t violate man’s will.

So why ask God to do what He won’t do? You’re better off just begging the lost sinner to believe, that is if you want to remain consistent.
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Their wills are being exhibited?

yeah thier Will for God to save them is being exhibited when they ask him to save them …..
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#35
Jul 8, 2018
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#35
Nehemiah6 said:
You are using the wrong Scripture for the wrong reasons, because your doctrine is false. God has given the Gospel for THE LOST to hear and believe. But do you care? If the lost could not hear and believe then why would God give the lost world the Gospel? Do you see your silliness?
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sheep are referred to in scripture as God's people. Who do you think the "lost sheep of the house of Israel" are?
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#36
Jul 8, 2018
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#36
PennEd said:
Of course God “violates” man’s will, because our will is to sin. And He gave us the faith to accept His Son, and THEN we have free will not to sin.

But what you have said here is a bridge way too far.
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Spiritual faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit. We do not have spiritual faith until we are quickened (born again) with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The natural man, before he has been born again, cannot receive the things of the Spirit.
 
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ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#37
Jul 8, 2018
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#37
Magenta said:
We have discussed this before, Forest. Many are spiritually seeking truth in their own way, and sure, they are rejecting the Bible and Biblical God, but that doesn't mean they reject all things of a spiritual nature. Jesus Christ is the embodiment of Truth, and it is promised to those who diligently seek that they shall find.
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If we have discussed this before, then you know of the scriptures I have presented to you that does not allow a person to that has not been born again to receive the things of the Spirit, that would include all things of a Spiritual nature.

If you can give me a scripture that says the natural person is spiritually seeking the things of the Spirit, I will consider if it will harmonize with the rest of the scriptures.
 
Pilgrimshope

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
#38
Sep 2, 2020
12,956
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#38
Magenta said:
We have discussed this before, Forest. Many are spiritually seeking truth in their own way, and sure, they are rejecting the Bible and Biblical God, but that doesn't mean they reject all things of a spiritual nature. Jesus Christ is the embodiment of Truth, and it is promised to those who diligently seek that they shall find.
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Amen

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭4:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 
Bob-Carabbio

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
#39
Jun 24, 2020
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#39
Foghorn said:
If God cannot violate man’s will, why do synergists pray for God to save them? Are synergists confused?

Shouldn't you rather beg the person to believe?
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EVERYBODY'S "Confused", until such time as they're DRAWN to Christ (Conviction of SIN in my case). The only thing I knew was that I had to repent, and cry out to god for salvation. And then everything changed. BEFORE we're born again, spiritual things are invisible.

And even AFTER they've been born again, they know little or nothing, until a while AFTER they've accepted HIS YOKE, and started to learn of him.
 
Eli1

Eli1

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#40
Apr 5, 2022
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#40
Foghorn said:
If God cannot violate man’s will, why do synergists pray for God to save them? Are synergists confused?

Shouldn't you rather beg the person to believe?
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Synergists pray so God can violate their will.
 
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