Science and Religion Thread

[Human]

Wrong and wrong. He is a progressive creationist who accepts microevolution but not macroevolution (e.g. Darwinian speciation). Read the book.

Interview excerpt with Dr Andrews on the book ''Who Made God'', which you asserts refutes Darwinian speciation in favour of ''progressive creationism'':

Could you share a brief overview of your understanding of creation? Old earth creationism? Young earth creationism? Intelligent design?
I deliberately avoid dealing with these matters in “Who made God?” because this is not a book about creationism but about two conflicting paradigms — atheistic and biblical world-views respectively.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

It's true that his book is not a myopic treatise on creationism versus Darwinian evolution but he tackles creationism, theistic evolution, intelligent design, etc... in his book both by name and applicability during his course of normalizing the much larger conflict.

I said you were wrong in stating Andrews doesn't "talk about creationism at all" for the simple fact that he does too both in the book and apart from it.

I said you were wrong in stating Andrews is an "evolutionist" (e.g. Darwinian evolution) because he certainly is not. Edgar served as the president for the Biblical Creation Society and is described by historian of creationism Ronald Numbers (winner of the prestigious George Sarton Medal) as the United Kingdom's "most respected creationist scientist of the late twentieth century."

Well, now you know. Peace.

Interview excerpt with Dr Andrews on the book ''Who Made God'', which you asserts refutes Darwinian speciation in favour of ''progressive creationism'':

Could you share a brief overview of your understanding of creation? Old earth creationism? Young earth creationism? Intelligent design?
I deliberately avoid dealing with these matters in “Who made God?” because this is not a book about creationism but about two conflicting paradigms — atheistic and biblical world-views respectively.

 

[Human]

It's true that his book is not a myopic treatise on creationism versus Darwinian evolution but he tackles creationism, theistic evolution, intelligent design, etc... in his book both by name and applicability during his course of normalizing the much larger conflict.

I said you were wrong in stating Andrews doesn't "talk about creationism at all" for the simple fact that he does too both in the book and apart from it.

I said you were wrong in stating Andrews is an "evolutionist" (e.g. Darwinian evolution) because he certainly is not. Edgar served as the president for the Biblical Creation Society and is described by historian of creationism Ronald Numbers (winner of the prestigious George Sarton Medal) as the United Kingdom's "most respected creationist scientist of the late twentieth century."

Well, now you know. Peace.

Then I'm wrong on that point. Still though, in your own words, can you give me a succinct breakdown of what you understand ''mainstream scientists'' claim evolution by natural selection entails both functionally and mechanically, and how these are incorrect, or at least how ''progressive evolution'' provides an adequate alternative explanation for the divergence (or perhaps separation) of different species, then that would be helpful.

As far as I understand it, the only difference between ''progressive evolution'' as in Dr Andrews' terms, and ''mainstream evolution'', is that ''progressive evolution'' asserts God as the mechanism for the ''spark of life'' that gave rise to evolution as modern mainstream scientists interpret it. In which case, I could as easily say Quatzelcoatl was responsible.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Reading the book is far more desirable and saves me a lot of typing.

It was as easy as locating it on worldcat.org, logging into my free online public county library account using my library card #, and placing a hold to have them transfer it to the public library closest to me where I picked it up and read it.

I do this all the time and it saves me a fortune in book costs. Do it now. Oh, and you're welcome.

Then I'm wrong on that point. Still though, in your own words, can you give me a succinct breakdown of what you understand ''mainstream scientists'' claim evolution by natural selection entails both functionally and mechanically, and how these are incorrect, or at least how ''progressive evolution'' provides an adequate alternative explanation for the divergence (or perhaps separation) of different species, then that would be helpful.

As far as I understand it, the only difference between ''progressive evolution'' as in Dr Andrews' terms, and ''mainstream evolution'', is that ''progressive evolution'' asserts God as the mechanism for the ''spark of life'' that gave rise to evolution as modern mainstream scientists interpret it. In which case, I could as easily say Quatzelcoatl was responsible.

 

[Human]

Reading the book is far more desirable and saves me a lot of typing.

It was as easy as locating it on worldcat.org, logging into my free online public county library account using my library card #, and placing a hold to have them transfer it to the public library closest to me where I picked it up and read it.

I do this all the time and it saves me a fortune in book costs. Do it now. Oh, and you're welcome.

The nearest library that has it is 53 miles away, and my university doesn't hold a copy. Another time, perhaps.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Seriously? I've got almost twenty public libraries and a good number of private libraries within that distance. I walk a few blocks to the closest city public library where I pick up books for free Worldcat.org locates that are then delivered for free.

You must be out in the sticks. The solution for that is to obtain a library card for your closest public library. This will give you access to the ebook digital repository and you can "check out" the book in ebook format and read it using whatever free software application your public library system provides (my local public library uses Overdrive, for example). Cheers.

The nearest library that has it is 53 miles away, and my university doesn't hold a copy. Another time, perhaps.

 

[Human]

Seriously? I've got almost twenty public libraries and a good number of private libraries within that distance. I walk a few blocks to the closest city public library where I pick up books for free Worldcat.org locates that are then delivered for free.

You must be out in the sticks. The solution for that is to obtain a library card for your closest public library. This will give you access to the ebook digital repository and you can "check out" the book in ebook format and read it using whatever free software application your public library system provides (my local public library uses Overdrive, for example). Cheers.

I'm not out in the sticks. I'm in the middle of a city. It's just that few libraries probably stock that book. I have a uni library with a massive collection, but that book isn't in it.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Multiple copies of it are available in the public library system I'm signed into. If your local public library doesn't have a book on the shelf, typically you can have your local public library find it in their larger public library system and transfer it over for pick up as I stated.

I'm sorry you're having a difficult time finding it where you live as it's a book you should read and I say that with sincerity. You may want to search the Online Computer Library Center, Inc. (OCLC) database https://www.oclc.org/en-US/contacts/libraries.html and see if another library system near you can help. Also, you can contact the OCLC and see if they can assist: https://www.oclc.org/en-US/contacts.html

And note that it's for sale used on Amazon, in hardcover, for only 78 cents plus $3.99 shipping thru brit-books-usa which is a good price (especially if you qualify for free shipping ).

I'm not out in the sticks. I'm in the middle of a city. It's just that few libraries probably stock that book. I have a uni library with a massive collection, but that book isn't in it.

 

[akmetr84]

Aahh. The lumpers and splitters debate. Always a hotly contested topic in the realms of classification.Im for fewer categories, hence them being lumped. The overlap between science and philosophy and religion is large. I feel to make them discreet does no justice to their connectedness - though for sure many topics may be handled in isolation it could give a limited picture. Given the way our minds wander I think it wouldnt work to attempt a philosophy/religion-free science zone, would cripple some potentially interesting discussions and leave many others with no proper home because they cross the boundaries.The technology section however could serve very well for that type of discussion youre looking for, and is relatively underutilised.

 

[Ugly]

Aahh. The lumpers and splitters debate. Always a hotly contested topic in the realms of classification.Im for fewer categories, hence them being lumped. The overlap between science and philosophy and religion is large. I feel to make them discreet does no justice to their connectedness - though for sure many topics may be handled in isolation it could give a limited picture. Given the way our minds wander I think it wouldnt work to attempt a philosophy/religion-free science zone, would cripple some potentially interesting discussions and leave many others with no proper home because they cross the boundaries.The technology section however could serve very well for that type of discussion youre looking for, and is relatively underutilised.

This makes 3 out of 3 posts where i have no idea what you're talking about.
And the 'technology' section is for people to ask questions they're having about their own phones, computers, the site, etc... not a discussion forum to chat on various topics. So it is utilized exactly how it's intended to be.

 

[blue_ladybug]

if you want a religion thread,go to the bible forum. Plenty of religion discussions in there..