Equality

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Feb 10, 2008
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#1
Lightning, I believe that we are created equally. Equally, but different. Equal, in that God love's us all the same, and that Jesus died that all might be saved. But we are different, in that each person has different roles.
I was referring more generally (not just man equal to woman or black equal to white), I'm talking about me being equal to you, or you being equal to John.... But I would ask you the same question. Just because God loves us equally (which I don't deny), what leads you to believe that we are all equal? In what ways are we equal?
 
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kayem77

Guest
#2
I don't know what the other thread was about but I think that we are all equal in the way that we have the same sinful human condition. Equality is not the same as Sameness, I'm not the same as you, but I posses equal value as a human and equal potential to become what God wants me to be according to my personal characteristics.
 
Feb 10, 2008
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I don't know what the other thread was about but I think that we are all equal in the way that we have the same sinful human condition. Equality is not the same as Sameness, I'm not the same as you, but I posses equal value as a human and equal potential to become what God wants me to be according to my personal characteristics.
Kayem, but what has led you to this belief?
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
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#4
It's simple...we aren't equal. In God's eyes sure we are, but that doesnt seem to be the question. In real life no one is truly equally. Stronger, better looking, smarter, taller and their opposites are all advantages some have over others that do affect public perceptions.
 
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violakat

Guest
#5
So, by whose standards do we measure equality, God's or Man's? If by Man's, then yeah, no when is equal, because I would say that 9 times out 10, we all think we are better than other people. We also have a tendency to rank positions and determine success by wordly standards.

However, if we are judging equality by God's standards, then we are equal in the fact, as Kayem stated, we all sin, and all our sin is of equal in weight in God's sight. And anything we do to try and please God is like filthy rags. Every sin has the potential to send you to Hell, from a lie to a murder. But only God has the ability to wipe away every sin.

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for you are all one in Christ Jesus." Galations 3:28

"But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." Isaiah 64:6
 
Feb 10, 2008
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So, by whose standards do we measure equality, God's or Man's? If by Man's, then yeah, no when is equal, because I would say that 9 times out 10, we all think we are better than other people. We also have a tendency to rank positions and determine success by wordly standards.

However, if we are judging equality by God's standards, then we are equal in the fact, as Kayem stated, we all sin, and all our sin is of equal in weight in God's sight. And anything we do to try and please God is like filthy rags. Every sin has the potential to send you to Hell, from a lie to a murder. But only God has the ability to wipe away every sin.

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for you are all one in Christ Jesus." Galations 3:28

"But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." Isaiah 64:6
Viola, thanks for your response. I have a few more questions.

Galations 3:28 - Do you think this is referring to equality just for christians, or for all?

Isaiah 64:6 - Do you believe that this verse refers to equality on earth or is it more a spiritual equality?
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
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#7
Since Galatians says In Christ I'm going to assuming it's referring to Christians there. For Isaiah I think its just the spiritual state of man because its talking about sin...
 
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kayem77

Guest
#8
Kayem, but what has led you to this belief?

That Jesus died for all of us, not just for some of us. As I said before, I don't think Equality is the same as Sameness. We are all different, but we all have equal value, and we all deserve the same hell and if we are Christians we are all saved only by the grace of God. In the world this is different because the world values a person according to their material posessions or fame, but in God's eyes we are all creatures who need grace but deserve hell. Not sure if this answers your question?

1 Corinthians 4:7 For who makes you different from anyone else? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as though you did not?

If you are talking about mature Christians and ''baby'' Christians I think that would be a matter of exercising the potential that God gave us. I believe we all have potential to use our God-given skills/talents for Him, but sometimes we don't like to do what God is telling us to do, or surrender what we need to surrender.
 
Feb 10, 2008
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That Jesus died for all of us, not just for some of us. As I said before, I don't think Equality is the same as Sameness. We are all different, but we all have equal value, and we all deserve the same hell and if we are Christians we are all saved only by the grace of God. In the world this is different because the world values a person according to their material posessions or fame, but in God's eyes we are all creatures who need grace but deserve hell. Not sure if this answers your question?

1 Corinthians 4:7 For who makes you different from anyone else? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as though you did not?

If you are talking about mature Christians and ''baby'' Christians I think that would be a matter of exercising the potential that God gave us. I believe we all have potential to use our God-given skills/talents for Him, but sometimes we don't like to do what God is telling us to do, or surrender what we need to surrender.
Kayem, in truth I didn't have anything specific in mind. I wasn't sure why people had opinions regarding equality. I was wondering what fed these opinions. I have no reason to believe that we are equal (it is clear we are not the "same").

1 Corinthians 4:7 - To whom does this equality extend?
 

PopClick

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2011
4,056
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#10
I don't know what the other thread was about but I think that we are all equal in the way that we have the same sinful human condition. Equality is not the same as Sameness, I'm not the same as you, but I posses equal value as a human and equal potential to become what God wants me to be according to my personal characteristics.
You know what this reminds me of? Something from Acts chapter 10: ~ "34Opening his mouth, Peter said: “I most certainly understand now that God is not one to show partiality, 35but in every nation the man who fears Him and does what is right is welcome to Him." :D
 
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kayem77

Guest
#11
Kayem, in truth I didn't have anything specific in mind. I wasn't sure why people had opinions regarding equality. I was wondering what fed these opinions. I have no reason to believe that we are equal (it is clear we are not the "same").

1 Corinthians 4:7 - To whom does this equality extend?
So....you see Equality as a sinonym of being the same? I'm a little confused, please explain your definition :)
 
Feb 10, 2008
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#12
So....you see Equality as a sinonym of being the same? I'm a little confused, please explain your definition :)
No, I was saying that it is clear that people are not the same, but that equality is not clear.
 
Aug 2, 2009
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#13
We are all equal in the eyes of God, and it is God who determines our differences..

For there is no partiality with God.
(Romans 2:11 NIV)

It is the one and only Spirit who distributes all these gifts. He alone decides which gift each person should have.
(1 Corinthians 12:11 NLT)

"I wish that all men were as I am. But each man has his own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that."
(1 Corinthians 7:7 NIV)

 
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kayem77

Guest
#14
1 Corinthians 4:7 - To whom does this equality extend?
I think this applies to everyone. We all have gifts and talents, and we as humans tend to boast about them, but then God reminds us that all we have we got from him. If I have something good in me, it's because God gave it to me, so in reality I'm not better than anyone else. All a poor man can have is his faith, all a rich man can have is his possesions and his faith. Take all the posessions from the rich man and he will be as the poor man (assuming they both have faith).
 
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violakat

Guest
#15
Viola, thanks for your response. I have a few more questions.

Galations 3:28 - Do you think this is referring to equality just for christians, or for all?

Isaiah 64:6 - Do you believe that this verse refers to equality on earth or is it more a spiritual equality?
Just got back from Church, so I will look over these verses in a bit. I just want to say though, thanks for starting this thread.
 
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violakat

Guest
#16
Galations 3:28 - Do you think this is referring to equality just for christians, or for all?
Verse 28 is more specifically for those who accept Christ as Savior. However, the passage that surrounds it concerns everyone. In verse 23 we see that until Christ came and died on the Cross, we were all under the Law. I think it may go even further in that until we accept Christ as Savior, we are judged by the law. When we look into Romans 8, we see how Christ became the fullfilment of the Law for us. But for those who chose to reject, they are then condemenend. So jumping back over to Glations 3, starting in verse 26, Paul starts to narrow in on the Christian, specifically that Christ died to save us all, and that we are all one in Him.

Isaiah 64:6 - Do you believe that this verse refers to equality on earth or is it more a spiritual equality?
I believe this verse is dealing with more of a Spiritual Equality. The whole passage this verse is contained in is showing how we as humans compare to God. None of us can stand before a Holy God. It is God only that does great and mighty things. God only that saves. Everything we try to do fails and becomes ugly in the sight of His Holiness.
 

Oncefallen

Idiot in Chief
Staff member
Jan 15, 2011
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#17
I always chuckle when the topic of equality comes up. I think that based on the scriptures posted above and others, that spiritually we are equal before God. Obviously we are all different, even within the church.

4 As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. 2 Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. 3 Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. 4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called ; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
7 But to each one of us grace has been given as Christ apportioned it. 8 This is why it[a] says:
“When he ascended on high,
he took many captives
and gave gifts to his people.”[b]

9 (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions[c]? 10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.) 11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12 to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.
14 Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of people in their deceitful scheming. 15 Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ. 16 From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.


The first part of the above passage shows equality, the second part difference.


12 Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by[c] one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free —and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. 14 Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many.
15 Now if the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body.
21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!” 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.
27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? 31 Now eagerly desire the greater gifts.


Once again, equality in importance, yet difference in roles.


Just because God gives one gender different roles in the family and in the church does not make them better, just different.


Even in the secular world you could say the same thing to a degree. Within the company I work for there is the owner, myself who supervises the work, and others who work under me. You could say that we are all equal in importance yet different. Sure we all make different incomes, but without the owner securing the jobs, no one works. Without myself supervising and coordinating the work, it wouldn't get done in a timely profitable fashion which would put my boss out of business, and all of us out of work. Without the guys below me, the work would never get done negating the work myself and the owner do.