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A
why are we talking about this as if our thoughts and words will make a whit of difference?
God will reveal it all be it in Heaven or Earth. Why debate things we do not have any control over instead of praising God and doing His work and will on Earth NOW by telling everyone of the Gospel and showing them God's love for the world that He gave His only son?
Why not doing as Jesus commanded us to do?
loose the burdens of the oppressed, feed the hungry, comfort the sorrowful, take in the homeless, clothe the naked, and SPEAK GOD"S words not our own desires or from our own understanding but what will edify, exhort and comfort GOD"S PEOPLE.
Isaiah 58
Fasting that Pleases God
1 “Cry aloud, spare not;
Lift up your voice like a trumpet;
Tell My people their transgression,
And the house of Jacob their sins.
2 Yet they seek Me daily,
And delight to know My ways,
As a nation that did righteousness,
And did not forsake the ordinance of their God.
They ask of Me the ordinances of justice;
They take delight in approaching God.
3 ‘ Why have we fasted,’ they say, ‘and You have not seen?
Why have we afflicted our souls, and You take no notice?’
“ In fact, in the day of your fast you find pleasure,
And exploit all your laborers.
4 Indeed you fast for strife and debate,
And to strike with the fist of wickedness.
You will not fast as you do this day,
To make your voice heard on high.
5 Is it a fast that I have chosen,
A day for a man to afflict his soul?
Is it to bow down his head like a bulrush,
And to spread out sackcloth and ashes?
Would you call this a fast,
And an acceptable day to the LORD?
6 “ Is this not the fast that I have chosen:
To loose the bonds of wickedness,
To undo the heavy burdens,
To let the oppressed go free,
And that you break every yoke?
7 Is it not to share your bread with the hungry,
And that you bring to your house the poor who are cast out;
When you see the naked, that you cover him,
And not hide yourself from your own flesh?
8 Then your light shall break forth like the morning,
Your healing shall spring forth speedily,
And your righteousness shall go before you;
The glory of the LORD shall be your rear guard.
9 Then you shall call, and the LORD will answer;
You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’
“ If you take away the yoke from your midst,
The pointing of the finger, and speaking wickedness,
10 If you extend your soul to the hungry
And satisfy the afflicted soul,
Then your light shall dawn in the darkness,
And your darkness shall be as the noonday.
11 The LORD will guide you continually,
And satisfy your soul in drought,
And strengthen your bones;
You shall be like a watered garden,
And like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail.
12 Those from among you
Shall build the old waste places;
You shall raise up the foundations of many generations;
And you shall be called the Repairer of the Breach,
The Restorer of Streets to Dwell In.
13 “ If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the LORD honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
14 Then you shall delight yourself in the LORD;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the LORD has spoken.”
God will reveal it all be it in Heaven or Earth. Why debate things we do not have any control over instead of praising God and doing His work and will on Earth NOW by telling everyone of the Gospel and showing them God's love for the world that He gave His only son?
Why not doing as Jesus commanded us to do?
loose the burdens of the oppressed, feed the hungry, comfort the sorrowful, take in the homeless, clothe the naked, and SPEAK GOD"S words not our own desires or from our own understanding but what will edify, exhort and comfort GOD"S PEOPLE.
Isaiah 58
Fasting that Pleases God
1 “Cry aloud, spare not;
Lift up your voice like a trumpet;
Tell My people their transgression,
And the house of Jacob their sins.
2 Yet they seek Me daily,
And delight to know My ways,
As a nation that did righteousness,
And did not forsake the ordinance of their God.
They ask of Me the ordinances of justice;
They take delight in approaching God.
3 ‘ Why have we fasted,’ they say, ‘and You have not seen?
Why have we afflicted our souls, and You take no notice?’
“ In fact, in the day of your fast you find pleasure,
And exploit all your laborers.
4 Indeed you fast for strife and debate,
And to strike with the fist of wickedness.
You will not fast as you do this day,
To make your voice heard on high.
5 Is it a fast that I have chosen,
A day for a man to afflict his soul?
Is it to bow down his head like a bulrush,
And to spread out sackcloth and ashes?
Would you call this a fast,
And an acceptable day to the LORD?
6 “ Is this not the fast that I have chosen:
To loose the bonds of wickedness,
To undo the heavy burdens,
To let the oppressed go free,
And that you break every yoke?
7 Is it not to share your bread with the hungry,
And that you bring to your house the poor who are cast out;
When you see the naked, that you cover him,
And not hide yourself from your own flesh?
8 Then your light shall break forth like the morning,
Your healing shall spring forth speedily,
And your righteousness shall go before you;
The glory of the LORD shall be your rear guard.
9 Then you shall call, and the LORD will answer;
You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’
“ If you take away the yoke from your midst,
The pointing of the finger, and speaking wickedness,
10 If you extend your soul to the hungry
And satisfy the afflicted soul,
Then your light shall dawn in the darkness,
And your darkness shall be as the noonday.
11 The LORD will guide you continually,
And satisfy your soul in drought,
And strengthen your bones;
You shall be like a watered garden,
And like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail.
12 Those from among you
Shall build the old waste places;
You shall raise up the foundations of many generations;
And you shall be called the Repairer of the Breach,
The Restorer of Streets to Dwell In.
13 “ If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the LORD honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
14 Then you shall delight yourself in the LORD;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the LORD has spoken.”
The most important thing is to warn people about it the judgement coming not only to the church but also the whole world!
Open your eyes and listen!
Mat 13:16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
Mat 13:17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.
The word of God appeals to many God given senses, such as seeing with your eyes, and hearing with your ears, but Jesus Himself warned us to be careful how we see and hear His word and truth.
Today there seems to be legions and legions of Bible scholars, reformed teachers, Doctors of divinity, mega preachers, and high powered ministries that enthrall a form of godliness but deny its power!
But Jesus made it clear in His great teachings:
2Co 11:3 But I fear, lest perhaps as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ!
The message is simple, Jesus also said a child would perceive the truth more that most scholars who have been so deceived by the reformed doctrines, they cannot see or hear the simplicity that is in Christ.
Mat 18:2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Jesus preached a simple message as well as the profits of old, which was repentance and faith both proven by deeds (conduct, heart purity) over the very popular message multitudes have been deceived by, that tells them they were born sinners, Jesus was their substitute, took their wrath on the cross, and now by just believing as the devils believe, you are eternally secure, all sins pre forgiven, nothing else to do but sit back, enjoy the ride, waiting for the rapture to come and wisk you up into heaven with Christ.
Jesus mainly preached to the simple people of His day, making His powerful message available for all, the simple, and poor in spirit, to see, hear and understand His simple message, that has been totally distorted and confused with an exchange gospel getting sinful mankind saved IN their sins and disobedience. While waiting for God to miraculously make them stop. When in reality God is asking His creation to repent (stop) their sin and rebellion against Him, first as scripture clearly teaches, then seek His mercy, instead of waiting for something that usually never happens! ISA 55-7.
They wait and wait, while their sight and hearing go blind and deaf, they love to quote these high powered Bible scholars and their favorite reformed preachers, who all endorsed many false and pagan teachings making Christianity what it is today! Poor, blind and naked!
1Co 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame!
Tommy
Open your eyes and listen!
Mat 13:16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
Mat 13:17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.
The word of God appeals to many God given senses, such as seeing with your eyes, and hearing with your ears, but Jesus Himself warned us to be careful how we see and hear His word and truth.
Today there seems to be legions and legions of Bible scholars, reformed teachers, Doctors of divinity, mega preachers, and high powered ministries that enthrall a form of godliness but deny its power!
But Jesus made it clear in His great teachings:
2Co 11:3 But I fear, lest perhaps as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ!
The message is simple, Jesus also said a child would perceive the truth more that most scholars who have been so deceived by the reformed doctrines, they cannot see or hear the simplicity that is in Christ.
Mat 18:2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Jesus preached a simple message as well as the profits of old, which was repentance and faith both proven by deeds (conduct, heart purity) over the very popular message multitudes have been deceived by, that tells them they were born sinners, Jesus was their substitute, took their wrath on the cross, and now by just believing as the devils believe, you are eternally secure, all sins pre forgiven, nothing else to do but sit back, enjoy the ride, waiting for the rapture to come and wisk you up into heaven with Christ.
Jesus mainly preached to the simple people of His day, making His powerful message available for all, the simple, and poor in spirit, to see, hear and understand His simple message, that has been totally distorted and confused with an exchange gospel getting sinful mankind saved IN their sins and disobedience. While waiting for God to miraculously make them stop. When in reality God is asking His creation to repent (stop) their sin and rebellion against Him, first as scripture clearly teaches, then seek His mercy, instead of waiting for something that usually never happens! ISA 55-7.
They wait and wait, while their sight and hearing go blind and deaf, they love to quote these high powered Bible scholars and their favorite reformed preachers, who all endorsed many false and pagan teachings making Christianity what it is today! Poor, blind and naked!
1Co 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame!
Tommy
I think "it wont be long" is even truer today (February 12, 2013). There will be a new pope appointed next month. BHO will be in Israel next month. Something to observe and be prepared. I am thinking it is quite possible to see the "abomination that causes desolation". To see that which calls itself "God".
Here is a video to take into consideration just how close the possibility is. After watching this one, I hope you go back and watch the entire series from first video through 7th video. Be pre-warned, I am one that holds to keeping Sabbath and God's 7 Appointments and believe had God not opened my eyes to understand Lev. 23 that I would not be able to understand His Feast Days in the end time. Anyway, the video is open to being fallible. May those who have eyes to see and ears to hear and understand that we are very close to Jesus' Return.
[FONT="]119 Ministries ~ Test Everything - Daniel Unsealed[/FONT]
Here is a video to take into consideration just how close the possibility is. After watching this one, I hope you go back and watch the entire series from first video through 7th video. Be pre-warned, I am one that holds to keeping Sabbath and God's 7 Appointments and believe had God not opened my eyes to understand Lev. 23 that I would not be able to understand His Feast Days in the end time. Anyway, the video is open to being fallible. May those who have eyes to see and ears to hear and understand that we are very close to Jesus' Return.
[FONT="]119 Ministries ~ Test Everything - Daniel Unsealed[/FONT]
Was Heaven Promised To Men?
And Would The Earth Ever Be Desolate?
The Answers may surprise you.
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout with the voice of the Arch-Angel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord". 1Thes.4:16-17.
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, endless tracts, booklets, magazines etc. have been printed all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation. Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false. But what does the bible teach?
The Truth Shall Make You Free.
Dear reader, you are probably one of those who expect to go to heaven with Jesus when he comes the second time, whether you believe in a secret rapture or not. If you are, have you ever-sought proof from the Holy Scriptures? Can you point to any passage or set of passages of scripture, which can properly be construed to mean that the redeemed would go to heaven? It's about time somebody took the time to prove or disprove this doctrine from the word of God. Only "the truth shall make you free". Jn.8:32. Thy word is truth Jn.17:17. Remember also "wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in there at". Mt.7:13.
1 Thes.4: 16-17
One of the passages of scripture usually quoted by the "heaven bound" believers is 1 Thes.4:16-17. Let's look at these verses to see if they teach or prove that believers would go to heaven. V17 says; "Then we ...Shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and so shall we ever be with the Lord." Which part of this verse does it say that the redeemed would go to heaven?
The Lord is descending and the redeemed are caught up, we meet him in the air among the clouds. Is this going back to heaven? No. This is the meeting place. The text says "and so shall we ever be with the Lord". Where ever the Lord goes after we meet him in the air, we would go with him; whether back to heaven, down on the earth (ground) or staying among the clouds. But where would he go? We must find out from the scriptures, this verse does not say.
St John 14:1-3
"Let not your heart be troubled: Ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my father's house are many mansions: if it were not so I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you I will come again and receive you unto myself: that where I am, there you may be also".
This is another text used by the "heaven bound" to justify their claim. Again, let us examine this statement, and make it plain. Jesus exhorted his disciples to believe in him as they believed in God. He said there are many mansions in his father's house, and if that were not a fact, he would have told them. So what he told them was in fact true. The mansions are there- already existing. Jesus said, "I go to prepare a place for you". How would he do this, and what is he doing now? Let the bible speak. In Acts 7:56 we read, "And said, behold, I see the heavens opened and the son of man standing on the right hand of God" . Heb 8:1-2. "Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest who is set on the right hand of the throne of the majesty in the heavens"; Heb 9:11-12 "But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place having obtained, eternal redemption for us". Verse 24 says "For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us".
Verse 15 says "and for this cause he is the mediator of the New Testament". In Col. 3:1 we read "If ye then be risen with Christ seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God". Again in 1 Jn 2:1 we read "My little children, these things I write unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous" ... See also Rom.8:34.
All these scriptures and more tell what Jesus is doing, and how he is preparing a place for us. He is our High Priest, Mediator, Advocate and Intercessor. Pleading our case; forgiving our sins, standing in the breach for us in the presence of the Almighty God, at his right hand. Jesus said "I will come again, and receive you unto myself, that where I am, there ye may be also". One day Jesus will leave the right hand of God and come back to earth. "I will come again....that where I am there ye may be also". When he comes, wherever he will be, there will we be also.
Now some read these verses and then ask; where is Jesus now? When you answer he is in heaven now, the response is well! There is where we will be, because he said that where I am, there ye may be also. This reasoning is worth a query. The question should rather be; where will Jesus be when he comes again? The answer to this question is what we are searching for to find out whether heaven was promised to men or not.
And Would The Earth Ever Be Desolate?
The Answers may surprise you.
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout with the voice of the Arch-Angel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord". 1Thes.4:16-17.
The vast majority of people in our world today, who look for the return of the Redeemer as King of Kings and Lord of Lords, expect to be taken to heaven to spend a thousand years. Some of these expect to return to planet earth at the end of this millennium in heaven. Countless sermons have been preached, endless tracts, booklets, magazines etc. have been printed all exhorting the "faithful" about this great expectation. Those who teach otherwise are dismissed as weird or false. But what does the bible teach?
The Truth Shall Make You Free.
Dear reader, you are probably one of those who expect to go to heaven with Jesus when he comes the second time, whether you believe in a secret rapture or not. If you are, have you ever-sought proof from the Holy Scriptures? Can you point to any passage or set of passages of scripture, which can properly be construed to mean that the redeemed would go to heaven? It's about time somebody took the time to prove or disprove this doctrine from the word of God. Only "the truth shall make you free". Jn.8:32. Thy word is truth Jn.17:17. Remember also "wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in there at". Mt.7:13.
1 Thes.4: 16-17
One of the passages of scripture usually quoted by the "heaven bound" believers is 1 Thes.4:16-17. Let's look at these verses to see if they teach or prove that believers would go to heaven. V17 says; "Then we ...Shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and so shall we ever be with the Lord." Which part of this verse does it say that the redeemed would go to heaven?
The Lord is descending and the redeemed are caught up, we meet him in the air among the clouds. Is this going back to heaven? No. This is the meeting place. The text says "and so shall we ever be with the Lord". Where ever the Lord goes after we meet him in the air, we would go with him; whether back to heaven, down on the earth (ground) or staying among the clouds. But where would he go? We must find out from the scriptures, this verse does not say.
St John 14:1-3
"Let not your heart be troubled: Ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my father's house are many mansions: if it were not so I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you I will come again and receive you unto myself: that where I am, there you may be also".
This is another text used by the "heaven bound" to justify their claim. Again, let us examine this statement, and make it plain. Jesus exhorted his disciples to believe in him as they believed in God. He said there are many mansions in his father's house, and if that were not a fact, he would have told them. So what he told them was in fact true. The mansions are there- already existing. Jesus said, "I go to prepare a place for you". How would he do this, and what is he doing now? Let the bible speak. In Acts 7:56 we read, "And said, behold, I see the heavens opened and the son of man standing on the right hand of God" . Heb 8:1-2. "Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest who is set on the right hand of the throne of the majesty in the heavens"; Heb 9:11-12 "But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place having obtained, eternal redemption for us". Verse 24 says "For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us".
Verse 15 says "and for this cause he is the mediator of the New Testament". In Col. 3:1 we read "If ye then be risen with Christ seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God". Again in 1 Jn 2:1 we read "My little children, these things I write unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous" ... See also Rom.8:34.
All these scriptures and more tell what Jesus is doing, and how he is preparing a place for us. He is our High Priest, Mediator, Advocate and Intercessor. Pleading our case; forgiving our sins, standing in the breach for us in the presence of the Almighty God, at his right hand. Jesus said "I will come again, and receive you unto myself, that where I am, there ye may be also". One day Jesus will leave the right hand of God and come back to earth. "I will come again....that where I am there ye may be also". When he comes, wherever he will be, there will we be also.
Now some read these verses and then ask; where is Jesus now? When you answer he is in heaven now, the response is well! There is where we will be, because he said that where I am, there ye may be also. This reasoning is worth a query. The question should rather be; where will Jesus be when he comes again? The answer to this question is what we are searching for to find out whether heaven was promised to men or not.
O
The Lord is sitting at the right hand of the Father. When it is his time he will come down. In the clouds we will meet him. (this is like when you meet someone at an airport with the intention of coming back where you were. We will meet him in the air because the wicked will be destroyed with the brightness of his coming. Only with our eyes will we behold the destruction of the wicked. We will return to Earth together with our new glorified bodies where we will rule and reign with him for 1000years.
I agree wake up- Rev: 20:12 the dead great and small standing before the throne were judged.
Acts 17:31 He has set a day when he will judge the world
Matt: 16:27 The Son of man will come in all his glory w/angels he will reward each according
if a judgment day has been set in rev: first the dead in Christ then the living, 2nd resurrection after the 1000 yr.
so again if judgment has not been made yet how can one be in heaven or hell?
Acts 17:31 He has set a day when he will judge the world
Matt: 16:27 The Son of man will come in all his glory w/angels he will reward each according
if a judgment day has been set in rev: first the dead in Christ then the living, 2nd resurrection after the 1000 yr.
so again if judgment has not been made yet how can one be in heaven or hell?
You missed this part...
Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.
Oh yeah, and I forgot to add...
Zec 14:4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
Now tell me, where is He when He returns?
Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.
Oh yeah, and I forgot to add...
Zec 14:4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
Now tell me, where is He when He returns?
L
Our Father, which art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy will be done in earth,
As it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
As we forgive them that trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
But deliver us from evil.
For thine is the kingdom,
The power, and the glory,
For ever and ever.
Amen.
Hallowed be thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy will be done in earth,
As it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
As we forgive them that trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
But deliver us from evil.
For thine is the kingdom,
The power, and the glory,
For ever and ever.
Amen.
L
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.[h=4]This is how much God loves us; read John 3:16 We all here need to love each other. God loves us all and this saddens him to see us all beckering when we should be praying for more understanding of truth and his love for us.[/h]