Starting to think Dr. Jack Van Impe Needs to Rethink His End Times Interpretations

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Senior Member
Feb 11, 2013
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#1
He used to make a lot of sense to me, but not really anymore. He is insisting that the Land of Magog is Russia and the cities of Tubal, Meshech, etc. are in Russia, and that is who will invade Israel.

I've been following Joel Richardson and I am thinking he may have it right (among many other modern scholars in Bible prophesy). Most of all modern day biblical atlases have the Land of Gog in Turkey.

I wonder if Dr. Van Impe would ever rethink his stance on this. He seems very dogmatic to me, though.
here are the maps:

Where is Magog, Meshech and Tubal?
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#2
Well, never was impressed with Dr. Van Impe, but it is interesting to note that in Daniel the BEAR nation which is already raised on one side is commanded to Rise and devour much flesh by the three ribs that are in its mouth...Persia (Iran), Turkey and Egypt!
 
B

biscuit

Guest
#3
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[TD="width: 593, align: left"][h=1]Does the Bible say anything about Russia in relation to the end times?[/h]
Question: "Does the Bible say anything about Russia in relation to the end times?"

Answer:
With Russia back in the news in a big way, many people are wondering if recent events in eastern Europe have anything to do with end-times prophecy—and, if so, how? Much of the discussion has to do with an ancient prophecy from Ezekiel: “The word of the Lord came to me: ‘Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshek and Tubal; prophesy against him and say: “This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I am against you, Gog, chief prince of Meshek and Tubal”’” (Ezekiel 38:1–3). The identities of “Gog,” “Magog,” “Meshek,” and “Tubal” are the key to fully understanding the prophecy.

Gog is a person. Whoever Gog is, he is from the land of Magog and is the leader of Tubal and Meshek (some translations add “Rosh” to the list) and a confederacy of other nations: Persia, Cush, Put, Gomer, and Beth Togarmah (Ezekiel 38:5–6). And, whoever he is, he will have plans to “attack a peaceful and unsuspecting people,” viz., Israel (verses 11, 14, and 18). But, regardless of Gog’s plans, the Lord God is against him and will defeat him soundly (Ezekiel 38:4, 19–23; 39:3–5).

Magog is a land “in the far north,” from Israel’s point of view (Ezekiel 38:15; 39:2). Most Bible commentators interpret “Magog” as Russia—and, indeed, Russia is straight north of Israel, all the way up to the Arctic Circle. According to this view, “Rosh” is a reference to Russia, “Meshek” is either Moscow or the people north of the Black Sea (the area of southern Russia and Ukraine), and “Tubal,” which is always listed with Meshek in Scripture, is identified as a city in Siberia or an area in central Turkey.

Others see “Magog” as a general term used in Ezekiel’s day to identify barbarians living near the Black and Caspian Seas. Regardless of the exact locations of Magog, Tubal, and Meshek, there is no doubt that the general area includes portions of Russia and the former Soviet Union, and possibly some Arab countries.

So, yes, the Bible does mention Russia, although not by that name, in connection with the end times. Ezekiel 38—39 definitely refer to a nation coming from northern Asia to attack Israel. After the Cold War, Russia lost its superpower status, making the fulfillment of Ezekiel’s prophecy seem unlikely in some people’s eyes. However, recent events have shown that Russia is gaining strength, and many believe that the invasion of Crimea is just a first step in Russia’s plan to restore its dominance in that hemisphere. It is also interesting to note that, in the Soviet era, Moscow was solidly aligned with several Muslim countries in opposition to Israel. Since the breakup of the Soviet Union, Russia has continued to make overtures to the Muslim world.

According to the Bible, there will come a time when Russia, in alliance with several other countries, will amass a huge army against Israel, with a view to plunder the Jews’ land. The nations aligned with Russia for this military endeavor are Persia (modern-day Iran), Put (modern-day Sudan), Cush (modern-day Libya), Gomer (part of modern-day Turkey), and Beth Togarmah (another portion of modern-day Turkey or possibly Syria). Most of these nations are currently militant Islamic states with an express hatred of Israel. Ezekiel says that, when the aggressors move against Israel, a few other nations (“Sheba and Dedan and the merchants of Tarshish”) will remonstrate, as will “all her villages”—possibly colonies (Ezekiel 38:13). Sheba and Dedan are associated with areas of northern Africa. Tarshish could be a reference to Spain (which colonized much of South America), Britain (which colonized the United States), or somewhere in eastern Africa. The objections to Magog’s aggression will fall on deaf ears, however, and the invasion will continue.

Some commentators believe this war is one of the events leading up to beginning of thetribulation. Others believe it will occur close to the midpoint of the tribulation, since Israel will be “dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates” (Ezekiel 38:11)—in other words, Israel will feel secure at that time, possibly because of the covenant they have signed with the Antichrist (Daniel 9:27). Either way, this battle is distinct from the Battle of Armageddon, which occurs at the end of the tribulation.

God promises to destroy Gog’s army: “I will execute judgment on him with plague and bloodshed; I will pour down torrents of rain, hailstones and burning sulfur on him and on his troops and on the many nations with him” (Ezekiel 38:22). The bodies of the fallen army of Magog will be buried, but it will take over seven months to complete the macabre task (Ezekiel 39:12, 14). This supernatural judgment will have the effect of preserving Israel and turning many hearts to God: “And so I will show my greatness and my holiness, and I will make myself known in the sight of many nations. Then they will know that I am the Lord” (Ezekiel 38:23). Many will be saved during the tribulation (Revelation 7), and the fulfillment of Ezekiel 38—39 will be one means by which God will bring people to a knowledge of Himself.

There is much we do not know for certain about Ezekiel’s prophecy, including the timing of these events. However, it is clear that Russia will be involved and will in fact lead an end-times league of nations to seize Israel’s land. The prophet Ezekiel comforts Israel in much the same way as Moses had centuries ago: “The LORD your God is the one who goes with you to fight for you against your enemies to give you victory” (Deuteronomy 20:4).

Recommended Resources: Understanding End Times Prophecy by Paul Benware andLogos Bible Software.

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B

biscuit

Guest
#4
He used to make a lot of sense to me, but not really anymore. He is insisting that the Land of Magog is Russia and the cities of Tubal, Meshech, etc. are in Russia, and that is who will invade Israel.

I've been following Joel Richardson and I am thinking he may have it right (among many other modern scholars in Bible prophesy). Most of all modern day biblical atlases have the Land of Gog in Turkey.

I wonder if Dr. Van Impe would ever rethink his stance on this. He seems very dogmatic to me, though.
here are the maps:

Where is Magog, Meshech and Tubal?
IMHO, I believe Dr. Jack van Impe to be one of the top experts on bible prophecies in the world.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Oct 24, 2014
595
14
0
#5
It is best to never listen to those guys and their "end times" futurism religion. Go not after what they say, nor follow them. They have no clue. Their ideas are no more than picking lint out of their belly button and everyone else going, "ah ha..."

We have the Word of God instead. It is in that Word where we are told that the Gospel of the Coming of the Lord Came, and continues to Come into Faithful believers, who believe by Faith in that which is always impossible to observe in a worldly fashion. It is all NOW folks. And it is all about Receiving Jesus Come in your flesh. Inhabiting you. Dwelling in You. Forever.

Receive Jesus Now, and He will Come to you NOW in fulfillment of all the Words of the Law and Prophets just as He has been for 2000 years :) And He will remain with you always and Never leave or forsake you. And then you will never wonder about those brain bending "end times" fables of the jews.

Hosanna in the Highest!

(Rom 13:11)
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
(2Co 6:2)
(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

Let us not be as those Pharisees who were blind, thinking that the Kingdom of God is a physical futuristic world observed event;

(Luk 17:20)
And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
(Luk 17:21)
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
(Luk 17:22)

RECEIVE JESUS INTO YOU :) WOOHOO! That's the good news for everybody right there!

And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.
(Luk 17:23)
And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.

(Luk 17:20)
And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
(Luk 17:21)
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
(Luk 17:22)





(Heb 13:5)
Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.


(Joh 7:38)
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.




(Joh 7:39)
(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)






(Joh 14:26)
But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


(Joh 14:3)
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.





(Joh 14:18)
I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.


(Act 2:38)




(Act 2:2)
And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.




(Act 2:3)
And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.




(Act 2:4)
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.






(Mat 28:20)
teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have enjoined you. And behold, *I* am with you all the days, until the completion of the age. (Darby)

Praise Jesus!



 
 
Oct 24, 2014
595
14
0
#6
It is best to never listen to those guys and their "end times" futurism religion. Go not after what they say, nor follow them. They have no clue. Their ideas are no more than picking lint out of their belly button and everyone else going, "ah ha..."

We have the Word of God instead. It is in that Word where we are told that the Gospel of the Coming of the Lord Came, and continues to Come into Faithful believers, who believe by Faith in that which is always impossible to observe in a worldly fashion. It is all NOW folks. Christians see it. The world doesn't. And it is all about Receiving Jesus Come in your flesh. Inhabiting you. Dwelling in You. Forever. THAT is the "Coming of the Lord".

(2Jn 1:7)
For many deceivers have gone out into the world, they who do not confess Jesus Christ coming in flesh--this is the deceiver and the antichrist.

Has He Come in YOUR FLESH?



Receive Jesus Now, and He will Come to you NOW in fulfillment of all the Words of the Law and Prophets just as He has been for 2000 years :) And He will remain with you always and Never leave or forsake you. And then you will never wonder about those brain bending "end times" fables of the jews.

Hosanna in the Highest!

(Rom 13:11)
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
(2Co 6:2)
(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

Let us not be as those Pharisees who were blind, thinking that the Kingdom of God is a physical futuristic world observed event;

(Tit 1:14)
not turning their minds to Jewish fables and commandments of men turning away from the truth.

(Luk 17:20)
And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
(Luk 17:21)
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
(Luk 17:22)

RECEIVE JESUS INTO YOU :) WOOHOO! That's the good news for everybody right there!

And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.
(Luk 17:23)
And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.



(Heb 13:5)
Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.


(Joh 7:38)
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.




(Joh 7:39)
(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)






(Joh 14:26)
But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


(Joh 14:3)
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.




(Eph 2:6)
and has raised us up together, and has made us sit down together in the heavenlies in Christ Jesus,



(Joh 14:18)
I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.





(Act 2:38)
And Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptised, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, for remission of sins, and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.






(Act 2:2)
And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.




(Act 2:3)
And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.




(Act 2:4)
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


(Gal 2:20)
I am crucified with Christ, and no longer live, *I*, but Christ lives in me; but in that I now live in flesh, I live by faith, the faith of the Son of God, who has loved me and given himself for me.


(2Co 6:16)
and what agreement of God's temple with idols? for *ye* are the living God's temple; according as God has said, I will dwell among them, and walk among them ; and I will be their God, and they shall be to me a people.


(Heb 8:10)
Because this is the covenant that I will covenant to the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord: Giving my laws into their mind, I will write them also upon their hearts; and I will be to them for God, and *they* shall be to me for people.





(Mat 28:20)
teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have enjoined you. And behold, *I* am with you all the days, until the completion of the age. (Darby)

All Fulfilled! Nothing left to figure out :) Just rest in Him now until He Comes into the final remaining brothers and sisters for us, until when this planet is soon destroyed.
Praise Jesus!