What's a circus without elephants?

[Viligant_Warrior]

Ringling Bros. eliminating iconic elephant acts from performances

The Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus will phase out the show's iconic elephants from its performances by 2018, telling The Associated Press exclusively that growing public concern about how the animals are treated led to the decision.

Executives from Feld Entertainment, Ringling's parent company, said the decision to end the circus's century-old tradition of showcasing elephants was difficult and debated at length. Elephants have often been featured on Ringling's posters over the decades. The decision is being announced Thursday.

"There's been somewhat of a mood shift among our consumers," said Alana Feld, the company's executive vice president. "A lot of people aren't comfortable with us touring with our elephants."

My question is, what constitutes "a lot of people"? Did the circus get inundated with letters, email, phone calls? Did half the crowd at every venue come to the circus administration offices on-site and complain, "You shouldn't be using elephants!"?

Or is this just more weak-kneed surrender to the irrational noise made by idiot organizations like PETA, whose primary claim to fame is wanting to erect a memorial alongside a Tennessee highway to remember the several hundred dead turkeys killed in a livestock truck crash in the Great Smoky Mtns. a few years go?

I'll vote the last as the catalyst.

 

[Desdichado]

"A lot of people" in cases like this generally means a small number of people who have starving lawyers willing to pursue anyone and anything.

 

[Desdichado]

The Big Tent Circus act otherwise known as the American legal system can make anything look illegal or legal. Constitutional or unconstitutional.

See Obamacare.

 

[GodIsSalvation]

Actually this is good news. Not a fan of circuses in the first place, nor do I like PETA and I usually give the benefit of the doubt to humans over animals in such instances, but it ain't cool how they treat them elephants. It's not just regular training or punishments. It's pretty stark stuff. It's not new stuff either, this been an issue for a while. I won't post any, but there's plenty of video that you can see for yourself just by searching "circus elephant abuse" on youtube.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Actually this is good news. Not a fan of circuses in the first place, nor do I like PETA and I usually give the benefit of the doubt to humans over animals in such instances, but it ain't cool how they treat them elephants. It's not just regular training or punishments. It's pretty stark stuff. It's not new stuff either, this been an issue for a while. I won't post any, but there's plenty of video that you can see for yourself just by searching "circus elephant abuse" on youtube.

Given the choice of articles published by PETA, or the circus, I'll take the circus' version every time. PETA represents the type of organization that tries and convicts RBBBC in the court of public opinion without any real proof except for nonsense like "Former Ringling Brothers employee speaks out on abuse of animals," which showed up in liberal rags of newspapers a couple years ago, and on the Internet.

After all the hew and cry, the hand-wringing and "Oh, those terrible circus people!" b/s rose up and died down, it turned out this "former employee" was a local hire in Cleveland, and worked for the circus for a whole six days. Yeah, real valuable insight there.

Check this out. I know it is a RBBBC website, but no one has seen fit to contradict it, either.

Animal Care FAQ

 

[GodIsSalvation]

Given the choice of articles published by PETA, or the circus, I'll take the circus' version every time. PETA represents the type of organization that tries and convicts RBBBC in the court of public opinion without any real proof except for nonsense like "Former Ringling Brothers employee speaks out on abuse of animals," which showed up in liberal rags of newspapers a couple years ago, and on the Internet.

After all the hew and cry, the hand-wringing and "Oh, those terrible circus people!" b/s rose up and died down, it turned out this "former employee" was a local hire in Cleveland, and worked for the circus for a whole six days. Yeah, real valuable insight there.

Check this out. I know it is a RBBBC website, but no one has seen fit to contradict it, either.

Animal Care FAQ

Man go to youtube and search "circus elephant abuse" watch a few videos. You don't need to listen to PETA, almost no one listens to PETA anyways.

I ain't saying we need to do nothing bad to circus folk, not even the people doing the stuff. If they decided to stop using elephants in their act and remove them back to the wild or to a safe place then that is fair enough in my opinion. Ain't about punishing no one, it's just about ending a problem.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

I ain't saying we need to do nothing bad to circus folk, not even the people doing the stuff. If they decided to stop using elephants in their act and remove them back to the wild or to a safe place then that is fair enough in my opinion. Ain't about punishing no one, it's just about ending a problem.

The elephants are raised at RBBBC's elephant farm in Florida, so they aren't wild animals in the sense of ever having lived in the wild. But they are nonetheless wild animals, and just as farm and ranch livestock is born wild and need to be "broken" in order to be useful, so do elephants need to be "broken" to be safe around human beings, as well as learn the tricks they do in performance. It's a domestication process similar to what livestock goes through to be safe and of use on the farm.

Watch a few horses being broken, watch how cows are taught to be docile when being milked, and you will probably think that's inhumane, too. So, are we supposed to stop using horses on the farms and ranches? Stop milking cows? A few will respond "yes," not realizing that on bigger operations, horses are often the only method of getting through terrain to check fences, inspect feeder stock on the range, and do other tasks necessary to the success of a farm or ranch. Not realizing that the milk in their refrigerator and the cheese on their balogne sandwich started out inside a cow's udder.

To modern sensibilities, these methods look inhumane. The fact is, given the impossibility of returning any of this stock to the jungle or the African plains makes the treatment necessary. Otherwise the animals will grow up rogue, kill someone, and then have to be destroyed. Which is worse?

 

[GodIsSalvation]

The elephants are raised at RBBBC's elephant farm in Florida, so they aren't wild animals in the sense of ever having lived in the wild. But they are nonetheless wild animals, and just as farm and ranch livestock is born wild and need to be "broken" in order to be useful, so do elephants need to be "broken" to be safe around human beings, as well as learn the tricks they do in performance. It's a domestication process similar to what livestock goes through to be safe and of use on the farm.

Watch a few horses being broken, watch how cows are taught to be docile when being milked, and you will probably think that's inhumane, too. So, are we supposed to stop using horses on the farms and ranches? Stop milking cows? A few will respond "yes," not realizing that on bigger operations, horses are often the only method of getting through terrain to check fences, inspect feeder stock on the range, and do other tasks necessary to the success of a farm or ranch. Not realizing that the milk in their refrigerator and the cheese on their balogne sandwich started out inside a cow's udder.

To modern sensibilities, these methods look inhumane. The fact is, given the impossibility of returning any of this stock to the jungle or the African plains makes the treatment necessary. Otherwise the animals will grow up rogue, kill someone, and then have to be destroyed. Which is worse?

Man cows are another animal and another matter. You're gonna kill them and I'm going to eat them anyways.

It's not just their training techniques man, there's more to it. You ain't milking those elephants me thinks.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Man cows are another animal and another matter. You're gonna kill them and I'm going to eat them anyways.

It's not just their training techniques man, there's more to it. You ain't milking those elephants me thinks.

No, I don't think the elephant would let me.

And I ain't killin' or milkin' anyway. My brother's running the farm these days. I'm too busy sitting in a cushy office talking to addicts, codependents, and broken families, and playin' on CCF a couple hours or so a day. Sounds exciting by comparison, don't it? And my brother prefers the farm, can you imagine??

Anyway, 'nuf silliness. There are similarities in the need to domesticate them, not use them for product. As I said, we can't send animals whose last connection to the jungle was their great-great-grandfather who last set foot on the veldt about 70 years ago, anyway. They'd die. So even if we don't use them in circus acts, we've got to keep them here, and that means making them safe around people.

 

[GodIsSalvation]

No, I don't think the elephant would let me.

And I ain't killin' or milkin' anyway. My brother's running the farm these days. I'm too busy sitting in a cushy office talking to addicts, codependents, and broken families, and playin' on CCF a couple hours or so a day. Sounds exciting by comparison, don't it? And my brother prefers the farm, can you imagine??

Anyway, 'nuf silliness. There are similarities in the need to domesticate them, not use them for product. As I said, we can't send animals whose last connection to the jungle was their great-great-grandfather who last set foot on the veldt about 70 years ago, anyway. They'd die. So even if we don't use them in circus acts, we've got to keep them here, and that means making them safe around people.

Don't know what will happen if you release them in the wild, not your or my problem at that point.

If you absolutely are set to keep the elephants and it is of no use to you, have you considerred a zoo?

 

[p_rehbein]

Better question is: What's an elephant without Circuses?

 

[Champa]

My question is, what constitutes "a lot of people"? Did the circus get inundated with letters, email, phone calls? Did half the crowd at every venue come to the circus administration offices on-site and complain, "You shouldn't be using elephants!"?

Or is this just more weak-kneed surrender to the irrational noise made by idiot organizations like PETA, whose primary claim to fame is wanting to erect a memorial alongside a Tennessee highway to remember the several hundred dead turkeys killed in a livestock truck crash in the Great Smoky Mtns. a few years go?

I'll vote the last as the catalyst.

It doesn't really matter. The animals get locked up on journeys and spend most of their days confined, when they aren't performing for punters. It's dangerous to keep elephants that have been rubbed up the wrong way around people anyway. It's cruel to keep them in cages or confines and it's below us as human beings to capture them, enslave them and make them do party tricks for our own entertainment.

 

[gb9]

well, I am surprised that this has not happened sooner, given the attitudes of the world we live in.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

It doesn't really matter. The animals get locked up on journeys and spend most of their days confined, when they aren't performing for punters. It's dangerous to keep elephants that have been rubbed up the wrong way around people anyway. It's cruel to keep them in cages or confines and it's below us as human beings to capture them, enslave them and make them do party tricks for our own entertainment.

Note to Champa: Your PETA membership is about to expire, and if you don't renew it soon, you'll lose your PR job with them.

Great post, if you like stuff straight out of PETA's propaganda manual.

 

[Champa]

Note to Champa: Your PETA membership is about to expire, and if you don't renew it soon, you'll lose your PR job with them. View attachment 100141

Great post, if you like stuff straight out of PETA's propaganda manual.

If you were an elephant, I think you'd much rather roam the plains of Africa or the jungles of India than be cooped up in some circus doing tricks for wailing women and children and men with brains the size of peanuts.

 

[Richie_2uk]

My question is, what constitutes "a lot of people"? Did the circus get inundated with letters, email, phone calls? Did half the crowd at every venue come to the circus administration offices on-site and complain, "You shouldn't be using elephants!"?

Or is this just more weak-kneed surrender to the irrational noise made by idiot organizations like PETA, whose primary claim to fame is wanting to erect a memorial alongside a Tennessee highway to remember the several hundred dead turkeys killed in a livestock truck crash in the Great Smoky Mtns. a few years go?

I'll vote the last as the catalyst.

You got to remember when circus first established, there was no animals in the beginning, it was a circus of actors and performing artist to entertain the audience of families. It got to the point that circuses was competing against each other. Until one day, someone thought to start using animals to perform tricks. of course everyone was amazed and it became a house hold name for the circus, But when the circus first born, there were no animals.

Then the cruelty and abuse side of things, people didnt really take notice till late 1970's, people were started noticing some cruelty to the animals because they weren't playing there part well. Then reports flooding in. Animals are not for party tricks or to perform tricks for the crowd. yes it is fascinating to watch, but the cruelty and the abuse behind it is not right at all. Its mainly all about money, and careless of the animals. But I thank God, there is no animals in circuses. At least the animals won't have cruelty, or abuse.

Now lets pray for the children of the world, and try stop cruelty and abuse to them.