Jesus, all the Grace we need

Grace777x70 · Jul 30, 2016

A very big factor in looking at scripture is the "lens" you use to view the scripture.

In the Old Covenant " you had to do or else"..If you do this..then I God will do that.." = conditional on the person performing

New Covenant = Jesus has done it for you which empowers you to "do"

Let's take a look at a common scripture with these 2 mindsets.

Jesus said.." If you love Me, you will keep My commandments"

Old Covenant mindset = conditional on the person "doing"..

So they would read it this way.."IF you love Me you will keep My commandments"..in their mind it's saying.."Keep My commandment and you will prove you love Me."

New Covenant mindset = it's a description of who you are in Christ.

They would see this "Jesus' love is in me so I keep His commandments"..it stems out of relationship and it is not conditional but descriptive of the believer.

1 John 4:18-19 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.

[SUP]19 [/SUP] We love, because He first loved us.

Then there is more..lol..there seems to be more sometimes eh?..just what are His commandments anyway?..Be perfect as My Father in heaven is perfect?...can we possibly do that?..of course not..that is Moses 2.0

Ahhh..found His commandments in 1 John 3.

1 John 3:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.

...the "lens" that we view scriptures greatly affects us. We try to mix the Old Covenant ( before the cross and resurrection ) with the New Covenant and we get a religious mess.

Religious traditions of men, philosophies of men, ..what we were told all our lives in church or in the world etc. ..all influence how we view scripture. Sometimes some of our "sacred cows" can get sacrificed and it's painful.

Colossians 2:8 (NASB)
[SUP]8[/SUP] See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.

bikerchaz · Jul 30, 2016

Well that took some reading, LOL I found this bit interesting, I cant remember which post it was;

Firstly there seems to be a full recognition of receiving grace just by being, this is through v 9. Then it all goes awry in v 10 because it puts restrictions by doing what is right and loving those in the faith. It does not stop there though because John goes on to describe this love we are to have :

Then John says how we are to know the Spirits presence within us, he starts with;

Then he gets stuck in with;

followjesus · Jul 30, 2016

bikerchaz said:

amen. we have to see whats being said to understand it. not take 1 verse, twist its meaning and make a doctrine and then search anything that supports the false doctrine. a false doctrine is " wrong belief" just like eve. God told He the truth of life and death, then along comes the serpent to twist her thinking, opposing the truth. it is no different now, above all things the church has to have correct doctrine, and teach it as it is, because what we believe is what we will do

followjesus · Jul 30, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

read the last scripture bruce. he is talking about hollow and deceptive thinking, that is not in accordance with Christs teaching. that's what according to Christ, if you don't understand, Jesus is the Christ. so everything needs to be in line with His doctrine. He is the Lord, anything He said is what all the apostles believed and taught. none of them were trying to revolutionize the gospel and remove the name Jesus. they were doing as the Lord commanded them, they were spreading HIS gospel. and it has everything to do with His words, actions and resurrection. according to Jesus Christ bruce everything is according to Him, He is the truth, he spoke the truth about it all.

after all the discussions with you, I still really don't even understand what you do believe the gospel is. I THINK you think it is only His death and resurrection. and He somehow doesn't have authority anymore or what he said that makes you responsible for now following the Lords way just only applies to other groups and not the church. you go back to " look at who he was speaking to" He says " all nations everywhere teach them to obey me."

that's what correct doctrine will say, it will always agree with JKesus who is Christianity. there is no gospel apart from His. and His gospel is of Grace and also truth that we are to accept and follow after. the work he did on the cross forgave you, the resurrection proved who Jesus is and His authority, His commission makes clear what to go teach other people all nations everywhere. if He had said in the commission, don't worry about obeying my teachings, just go tell people grace grace. it would be very different, but its not what The Lord said......its not how we view the word, its about what it actually is saying.

everything not according to Jesus and His sound teachings, would be the hollow and deceptive philosophy. just like paul says in timothy, just like john writes in 2 john, just like peter makes clear, Just like Jesus says, Just like God says listen to Jesus He is the one, he will never lead a person in the wrong direction. it doesn't mean we look away from His words and imagine were being led by the spirit, the spirit will always be in line with everything He taught. always and forever. it is his spirit

galatians 4:6 "Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit OF HIS SON into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father."

My words are full of the spirit and they are life. " you are born again through the Word of God. Jesus is the word, He spoke the words of eternal life. all of them are true and relevant for eternity. He is the Lord.

Kosie · Jul 30, 2016

followjesus I will try to show you that REBIRTH happens only AFTER the old man died. You talk as if a reborn child of God has to FOLLOW Jesus, but that cannot be, because if you are reborn it means the old man ALREADY DIED!

How can the NEW man live in the vessel if the old has not passed? Nope you understand wrong or were taught by twisted truth. God says if a seed does not fall to the ground and DIE it cannot produce fruit.

It is the OLD MAN that follows the lead of Christ. And look what Jesus said, if a man does not pick up HIS CROSS and follow me... We as the old man pick up crosses, to NAIL THE OLD ON THE CROSS, UNTIL HE IS DEAD! Only then JESUS RESURRECT the NEW MAN... And he is FILLED with Jesus. Now the Holy Spirit will DRIVE or MOVE the vessel. Jesus does not lead no more but DRIVE or MOVE. Jesus are now IN THE MAN not leading no more!

Rebirth comes at the END of sanctification and justification. Rebirth is the FINAL step God use to save a man.... GLORIFICATION God calls it. ALL 100% Truth and provable by Scripture. Those that ENDURETH to the end.... THEY shall be saved... the end of what? The end of crucifying the old man.... Many are called few are chosen. Not all who start to follow Jesus endureth to the end. Some are misled that they do not have to endure until the whole old man are dead!

followjesus · Jul 31, 2016

well id have to say I disagree that I have twisted truth lol but umm yeah be blessed, there is nothing and no one that will ever pull me away from Jesus Christ my risen Lord and savior. I will follow Him for the next billion years my friend as will any who accept Him in truth, and I will take that now and always as a full obligation to God. Jesus suffered and died and taught me all ill ever need to Know because of that I will serve Him with every fiber of who I am, new man or not, He is the Lord I belong to Him, I am not my own He paid the price for ownership of my feeble and worthless life and has and is continually making it something of worth in the eyes of Go, ill press on in obedience to my Lord and encourage any Christian to do the same from the heart that Knows all that He is and has done for us, he is my Lord.

peace to you in the name of Jesus the Christ and Lord

bikerchaz · Jul 31, 2016

Kosie said:

So have you stopped picking up your cross? Are you sinless? is it impossible for you to get anything wrong? There is no difference to God about sin, all sin is worthy of death. from a lie (even a small white one) to mass murder it is all sin.

If your having a hard day (and we do all get them) and you come home and the key breaks in the door, two hours wait for the locksmith, then inside you find you house ransacked and everything of worth gone, another four hours at the police station giving statements, on your way home all the café's and quick food joints are closed because it is late, eventually you return home tired, hungry and not a little disgruntled, going in you kick of your shoes and go up stairs to bed and there on the pillow is cat pooh (because you didn't feed it).

I know this is not a real situation and I hold my hands up and can say I would have to repent for something that came out of my mouth, and the greater part of that repentance would be thankfulness. Thankfulness to Jesus because I know my sin is covered. With me this is all to evident because it seems to be never ending, But that's how Jesus imparts His life. I am ever growing by His grace and always being re-newed, the patch I use to cover my sin is also new "you can't put a new cloth patch into an old garment.

To be able to sit back and say "it is finished" means not moving forward. I take up my cross daily, not for the first week then leave it in the corner so I can look at it and think 'Wow glad that's over', this is a life thing. When Paul said he had finished his race the death sentence had been passed and he knew within literally days he would be with Jesus, he knew his finish line was that close. Like Paul, any of us being led from the cell to the gallows knows our time for running the race has finished, all that is left to do is cross the finish line, death.

Brother Kosie, your words portray your heart for Jesus, only you know your daily actions, it is the same for all of us. Jesus words are the only ones we have to live by, Jesus is "the word", He will not, even can not contradict Himself, and only by the "Word" of God can we live.

ukok102nak · Jul 31, 2016

:hrmm: as it is written
:read:
Mga Taga-Efeso: 6. 6. Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart;
7. With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men:

8. Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether he be bond or free.

followjesus · Jul 31, 2016

bikerchaz said:

So have you stopped picking up your cross? Are you sinless? is it impossible for you to get anything wrong? There is no difference to God about sin, all sin is worthy of death. from a lie (even a small white one) to mass murder it is all sin.

If your having a hard day (and we do all get them) and you come home and the key breaks in the door, two hours wait for the locksmith, then inside you find you house ransacked and everything of worth gone, another four hours at the police station giving statements, on your way home all the café's and quick food joints are closed because it is late, eventually you return home tired, hungry and not a little disgruntled, going in you kick of your shoes and go up stairs to bed and there on the pillow is cat pooh (because you didn't feed it).

I know this is not a real situation and I hold my hands up and can say I would have to repent for something that came out of my mouth, and the greater part of that repentance would be thankfulness. Thankfulness to Jesus because I know my sin is covered. With me this is all to evident because it seems to be never ending, But that's how Jesus imparts His life. I am ever growing by His grace and always being re-newed, the patch I use to cover my sin is also new "you can't put a new cloth patch into an old garment.

To be able to sit back and say "it is finished" means not moving forward. I take up my cross daily, not for the first week then leave it in the corner so I can look at it and think 'Wow glad that's over', this is a life thing. When Paul said he had finished his race the death sentence had been passed and he knew within literally days he would be with Jesus, he knew his finish line was that close. Like Paul, any of us being led from the cell to the gallows knows our time for running the race has finished, all that is left to do is cross the finish line, death.

Brother Kosie, your words portray your heart for Jesus, only you know your daily actions, it is the same for all of us. Jesus words are the only ones we have to live by, Jesus is "the word", He will not, even can not contradict Himself, and only by the "Word" of God can we live.

very well said bro God Loves you and may He increase you in all ways, in Jesus name

Kosie · Aug 1, 2016

Bikerchaz do you believe the Bible? Would you say God is bigger than ANY situation and he can keep His children holy no matter what? Well let us hear what God has to say about bad days....
2Pe_1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

Never fall, means never fall.... vessels unto honor, are declared honorable by God, will NEVER have spot or wrinkle. God only declares perfect people honorable. Perfect people CANNOT sin because God is the perfection in them. God cannot sin. Not in His Spirit form or in his adopted human form. Whether the Holy Spirit is God in heaven in all His glory, or Jesus on earth in his human glory, HE CANNOT SIN. and when he fills another human flesh HE STILL CANNOT sin.

The old man is DEAD, the NEW Man is Christ Jesus in the old man's body. BEHOLD ALL IS BECOME NEW! Behold means HOLD ON TO THE WORDS..... and believe it... ALL is made new. Godly new!

Even if the WHOLE world lieth in sin, God's children does NOT! they lieth IN HIM and IN HIM IS NO SIN!
1 Joh 5:18 / 19..1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. 1Jn 5:19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.

followjesus · Aug 1, 2016

Kosie said:

God only declares perfect people honorable? according to Jesus teachings what "perfects" us? Loving enemies, doing good to those who don't do good to you, the ONLY perfection in Christ is to forgive all offense and Love them anyways. sin is personal, the person has to know for themselves what is right, and then not do what they know is right. perfection in Chjrsit is found in forgiving those who nail you to the cross.

matthew 5:43-48 "You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

there is Grace in Jesus teachings, all the Grace we need is found in following Him to the cross through His commands. the only thing that makes us perfect is to have nothing against anyone else. Jesus makes several references to the importance of forgiving others, so that you can be forgiven. if He himself teaches this principle it is true.

mark 11:25 "And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive them, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins."

the verse before this says you will receive in prayer whatever you ask, and He says forgive, so that your sins can be forgiven. knowing the gospels, no one should think they are perfect, they should see the perfection in Christ Learn from Him and realize they are unworthy servants. Paul makes the same statement about Himself "

phillipians 3:12-14 "Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. rothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus"

the doctrine of being perfect according to the gospels principles and then God will honor you, is the other extreme just like grace requires nothing is to the extreme and incorrect, so is sinless perfection. that is our goal always, but never should a person think they have attained perfection, that will lead to a fall. the gospel perfects us by accepting Jesus , obeying Him with all our hearts, But God is very Good to forgive those imperfections in His beloved creation.

Kosie · Aug 1, 2016

There is only one standard of perfection... God's That is why Jesus said... Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Note the word EVEN... Only that level, no other.
Same as in Eph 4: 13... Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: You either are to the fulness of Christ or you are not. What Father declares perfect is all who are to the fulness of His Son, the FIRST of MANY!

Anything short of that is not the completed work of the Father, he only can make perfect those that HE SANCTIFY, JUSTIFY and GLORIFY.

One sin is all it takes to show God is not present, only ONE! If God saves he saves to the fulness of the SON, God says there will come FALSE teachings with their own righteousness.... God's righteousness is PERFECT AS HIMSELF!

Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Let us establish our own righteousness for CC and our own perfection, short of God, then we can do what we like and believe what we like, it is the only way we will fit into Rom 10, but then who wants something SHORT OF GOD? Not me!

Look how well God furnish.....With 100% holiness, righteousness and perfection.... 2Ti_3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
If GOD throughly furnish, it means the inside of the vessel is ALL GOD! The only perfection God will acknowledge as HIS COMPLETED WORK! WOW this is powerful, not this feeble .... through the blood of Jesus, God looks at us and he sees us perfect. (LIE!) .... Not in Scripture NOT TRUE! That means me and God is on opposite sides of the blood..... VERY DANGEROUS.... I have to PASS through Jesus to get to God, not stand on the other side of God, that is where sinners remain.

Jesus says HE is the way and the ONLY ones that gets to God is ...Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Joh 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

My friends on the other side of the DOOR is the Father, come through and be in complete holiness with the Son Father and Spirit. There is NO OTHER door or teachings!

May God bless us all with the PASS.

Grace777x70 · Aug 1, 2016

Trying to fit what Peter and Paul said in Acts 10 and 13 - in their word-for-word accounts of preaching the true gospel of the grace of Christ can "conflict" with some of our religious beliefs.

The truth is that they did not say. "you must forgive others before you can receive Christ's forgiveness - obtained by God's riches in grace which He purchased with His own blood for an eternal redemption and the complete forgiveness of sins"

There is no "conditional" forgiveness which is contingent on us forgiving first in the New Covenant which started after the Cross and Jesus fulfilled the law for us.

It's anti-the gospel. It is however 100% the law that we must forgive first in order to receive forgiveness in the law.

We forgive now because we are already forgiven in Christ. This is our new nature in Him in our inner man in Christ being expressed out to others.

Paul says in Eph. 4:22 to put on the new man in Christ - created in righteousness and holiness...then he shows us what this looks like in the next verses including this one below.

Ephesians 4:32 (NASB)
[SUP]32 [/SUP] Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also has forgiven you.

Grace777x70 · Aug 1, 2016

The Cross and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ changed things in the New Covenant.

Forgiveness is a done deal - either believe it or don't believe it.

On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

perfect = The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time. It is continuously happening in the present.

passive = voice = action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.

Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whomwe have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins

Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.

Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.

Th0mas · Aug 1, 2016

Matthew 5:19

Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:42

Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.

Matthew 18:15

"If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over.

Mark 12:

32 "Well said, teacher," the man replied. "You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him.
33 To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 22:32

But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

If there is a need to say, you may compare what is above with what is below.

Matthew 6:8

Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

Matthew 6:9

"This, then, is how you should pray:

John 6:39

And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.

Kosie · Aug 1, 2016

BEAUTIFUL God may thou will be done in us as it is done in heaven. Father NOT our will or WAY but YOURS. Amen

Thomas God is so rich in His Word and wonderful to quote.

ukok102nak · Aug 1, 2016

:haha: yeah thats it
WE BELIEVED IN ALL THE WORKS OF OUR LORD CHRIST JESUS
OUR SAVIOUR
THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
AND ALL THAT IS HOLY
NOW I REMEMBER HOW THE ELDERS PRAY . ...
YOUR NOT ONLY MENTIONING HIS NAME
BUT ALSO ALL THE GOOD WORKS THAT HIS DONE FOR THOSE HUMANS
FOR THAT IS THE WILL OF OUR LORD GOD THE FATHER ALMIGHTY
WHO IS GOOD AND CANNOT LIE

~;> I BET SOMEONE OR SOME PEOPLE HEARD THIS BEFORE AND
THEY LOST THEIR SALVATION BECAUSE THEY COULDNT KEEP UP
THE GOOD WORKS OF WHAT IS GOOD AND CANNOT LIE
THATS WHY
THEYVE BEEN EASILY CORRUPTED BY THOSE EVIL THINGS
SO THAT THEY MAY NOT ONLY TWIST THE WORDS
BUT ALSO CHANGE IT
HOPE THEY CHANGE NOW
UNTIL THE TIME COMES

Th0mas · Aug 1, 2016

Kosie said:

What may you think after comparing what you may look at below ?

Psalms 119:103 KJV

How sweet are thy words unto my taste! yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth!

Psalms 12:6 KJV

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

Psalms 119:114 KJV

Thou art my hiding place and my shield: I hope in thy word.

I'm not mocking you, if there is a need to say, you may compare the word "thou" to the word "you" which you may see is used in a KJV verse you may look at below. I judge there are times when it is right to use the word "thou". You may think the verse below is useful to a person who sincerely/seriously wants to obey God's commands perfectly.

James 1:5 KJV

If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

followjesus · Aug 1, 2016

Kosie said:

can I ask you, do you feel that you are perfect? if so, study the gospel. be perfect therefore, refers to what He is saying about loving enemies. I see that apparently your attitude is you have been made perfect, and I myself need to yet come through the door. but let me ask you honestly. have you sold your possessions and given to the poor? do ever retailiate? do you resist an evil person? if someone takes your "cloak" do you offer them your tunic as well? if someone askes you to go one mile with thwm. do you go 2 miles? do you have any form of lust, greed, PRIDE in your thoughts? do you hold any offense against anyone? do you bless those who speak evil and insult you and exclude you? have you transgressed the 400 plus laws in the law of moses? do you have plenty, and ever not help someone who has need? is your life spent truly loving others in action and truth? have you judged another ? have you ever been unmerciful? ....

this is a sample of the gospel, there is more but if you tell me you have and do keep all; of this perfectly, well go deeper into it. so by these standars also " do you pray like this " lord I thank you that I am not like other men, I'm righteous before you? so il let you read and respond, if you claim these teachings aren't there ill give you scripture and verse. so then, are you perfect according to the gospel?

followjesus · Aug 1, 2016

ive made it clear to you I believe jesus, not false doctrine. its simple ommital of Jesus words that deceives

Jesus, all the Grace we need

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