another ? about baptism
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Hello my brother in Western XC,
We Greek Orthodox do practice Infant Baptism and his links provide a pretty good summary on why the Western Church performs infant baptisms. Here is something from a Father of the Church
At any rate, I'd like to share an article from the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. It is on infant baptism which includes scriptural and theological support for Infant Baptism. It also touches on Original Sin as well.
http://www.goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith7067
In ΙΣ ΧΣ,
ΙΟΑΝΝΗΣ
We Greek Orthodox do practice Infant Baptism and his links provide a pretty good summary on why the Western Church performs infant baptisms. Here is something from a Father of the Church
At any rate, I'd like to share an article from the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America. It is on infant baptism which includes scriptural and theological support for Infant Baptism. It also touches on Original Sin as well.
http://www.goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith7067
In ΙΣ ΧΣ,
ΙΟΑΝΝΗΣ
Infants do not need to be baptized,because repenting of your sins comes before you are baptized,in which a baby has no idea what repentance is,and they do not need to repent of anything.
When you come to the age that you realize you are doing wrong(God knows),then you repent of your sins and then you are baptized.Infants do not know to repent.
Also the angels behold the face of the Father for the infants,which means the infants are protected by angels spiritually,and are safe,and have no need to be baptized anyway.
A person must first repent of their sins before baptism,and if you were baptized of an infant not repenting of your sins,then you must be baptized later.
Jesus said you must be born of water and the Spirit to see the kingdom of God.
We must identify with Jesus by repenting,being baptized in water,and receiving the Holy Spirit.
The Bible says baptism does save us.
That infant baptism doctrine is a dangerous doctrine,and causes people who were baptized as an infant not to be baptized later on.
Matt
When you come to the age that you realize you are doing wrong(God knows),then you repent of your sins and then you are baptized.Infants do not know to repent.
Also the angels behold the face of the Father for the infants,which means the infants are protected by angels spiritually,and are safe,and have no need to be baptized anyway.
A person must first repent of their sins before baptism,and if you were baptized of an infant not repenting of your sins,then you must be baptized later.
Jesus said you must be born of water and the Spirit to see the kingdom of God.
We must identify with Jesus by repenting,being baptized in water,and receiving the Holy Spirit.
The Bible says baptism does save us.
That infant baptism doctrine is a dangerous doctrine,and causes people who were baptized as an infant not to be baptized later on.
Matt
Matt,
Where exactly does it say that infants are protected by angels spiritually and are safe and have no need to be baptized anyways?
In Acts and throughout the New Testament we see the Apostles baptizing households, the Greek word is οικος. Oikos includes children and infants. There is no evidence that supports those who claim that the word oikos would only refer to adults.
In the Old Testament, we saw many ways that parents brought their children into the Old Covenant. For example, circumcision. This was done to male infants who were eight years old. It can be considered the "old baptism."
It is widely accepted, if not true, that Moses did not leave the Jewish infants and children on the banks of the Red Sea to face the wrath of the Pharaoh because they could not comprehend or understand being baptized into Moses.
Faith and comprehension is not something that is limited to adults. This argument is profoundly a Western argument because the West has always been heavily influenced by reason and word. How can an infant possibly comprehend and understand faith? The New Testament did not see it that way. For example, in Luke when the ΠΑΝΑΓΙΑ, ΤΗΕΟΤΟΚΟΣ, approached Elizabeth John the Baptists jumped with joy at the sight of his saviour, ΙΕΣΥΣ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ.
Also in Mark.
Here is an excerpt from the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese website.
Where exactly does it say that infants are protected by angels spiritually and are safe and have no need to be baptized anyways?
In Acts and throughout the New Testament we see the Apostles baptizing households, the Greek word is οικος. Oikos includes children and infants. There is no evidence that supports those who claim that the word oikos would only refer to adults.
In the Old Testament, we saw many ways that parents brought their children into the Old Covenant. For example, circumcision. This was done to male infants who were eight years old. It can be considered the "old baptism."
It is widely accepted, if not true, that Moses did not leave the Jewish infants and children on the banks of the Red Sea to face the wrath of the Pharaoh because they could not comprehend or understand being baptized into Moses.
Faith and comprehension is not something that is limited to adults. This argument is profoundly a Western argument because the West has always been heavily influenced by reason and word. How can an infant possibly comprehend and understand faith? The New Testament did not see it that way. For example, in Luke when the ΠΑΝΑΓΙΑ, ΤΗΕΟΤΟΚΟΣ, approached Elizabeth John the Baptists jumped with joy at the sight of his saviour, ΙΕΣΥΣ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ.
Also in Mark.
Here is an excerpt from the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese website.
J
This is an interesting subject to me, as I had the same question about infant vs. adult baptism. I have not been baptized, and probably won't be for several more years. I do think that both are acceptable, although I have no biblical reasoning for this. I do think an adult has better understanding, but that comes with age. Without really knowing much about it, I would assume doing both would be good. Sorta like, "keeping your back covered".
Are you sure about that? You should include all versions of βαπτω.
βαπτο - Simply put, to dip. Not submerge. The root of the word Baptism
Βέβαμμαι - To have dipped. (John 13:26, Luke 16:24) ; and to dye ( Revalations 19.13)
ἐβαπτίσθην - Present Tense ; to dip, immerse, to cleanse or purify by washing, to administer the rite of baptism, to baptize, to undergo the rite of baptism. (Acts 22:16)
Βάπτισμα, ατος, τὀ - Present ; immersion, baptism, ordinance of baptism (Matthew 3:7 and Romans 6:4)
Βαπτισμὀς, οῡ, ὁ - An Act of dipping or immersion (Hebrews 6:2) ; an ablution (Mark 7:4,8 and Hebrews 9:10)
Your Eastern Brother in ΙΕΣΥΣ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ,
ΙΟΑΝΝΗΣ
βαπτο - Simply put, to dip. Not submerge. The root of the word Baptism
Βέβαμμαι - To have dipped. (John 13:26, Luke 16:24) ; and to dye ( Revalations 19.13)
ἐβαπτίσθην - Present Tense ; to dip, immerse, to cleanse or purify by washing, to administer the rite of baptism, to baptize, to undergo the rite of baptism. (Acts 22:16)
Βάπτισμα, ατος, τὀ - Present ; immersion, baptism, ordinance of baptism (Matthew 3:7 and Romans 6:4)
Βαπτισμὀς, οῡ, ὁ - An Act of dipping or immersion (Hebrews 6:2) ; an ablution (Mark 7:4,8 and Hebrews 9:10)
Your Eastern Brother in ΙΕΣΥΣ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ,
ΙΟΑΝΝΗΣ