Believers really need to understand the Truth

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Jul 17, 2019
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My response will seem like a vicious attack and I promise that’s the furthest thing from the truth. It is from an extremely sad heart that I say this is one of the most heretical statements I’ve ever read. I felt my spirit pierced with grief upon reading the above words and am holding back tears as I write these words. I simply don’t know what else to say.
What do you do with all of the many dire warnings
-- by Jesus to everybody in the 4 gospels!
and
-- by John, Paul, Peter, James, Jude etc. to the churches in the epistles!

Answer: ignore them, reject them, etc.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Paul stated all of this BEFORE he got into his dire warnings!
Try Romans 6 and Romans 8 on for size!

Throughout the NT, one group of verses DO NOT cancel out another group of verses!
So, what about Rom 6 or 8? Before or after, do you think the Holy Spirit will contradict Himself?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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What many do not understand is that BOTH are required for salvation!
That makes for good Roman Catholic doctrine, but not biblical. Are you Roman Catholic?

Romans 3:28 (KJV) Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 3:28 (NASB) For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

You just can't mix our good works with the good works of Jesus. We are justified on account of His good works, not ours.

Paul already stated...Romans 3:9 (NASB) What then? Are we better than they? Not at all; for we have already charged that both Jews and Greeks are all under sin;
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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I am a born again believer of Jesus Christ and Him crucified,buried and resurrected and sitting at the right hand of the Father! My sins have been washed in His blood,removed,never to be remembered again! I have my name written in the book of life because I choose to ABIDE in Him the true vine! I CHOOSE,HE PRESENTED THE GIFT OF LIFE FROM SIN,I CHOSE TO BELIEVE! His LOVE held Him there,for me and whosoever will!💖💖💖
This post has more “I”s than a month old potato!
 
Jul 17, 2019
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So, what about Rom 6 or 8?
Before or after, do you think the Holy Spirit will contradict Himself?
Duz I hafta answer this?
Is it okay if Paul doesn't give dire warnings in Romans 5?
Duz he hafta give dire warnings in EVERY chapter?
Or, can he address different topics in different chapters?
I wish you had explained all of this to him before he died.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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That makes for good Roman Catholic doctrine, but not biblical. Are you Roman Catholic?
That could well be the case. Unfortunately the *doctors* and *scholars* of the RCC could not really understand justification. Check out the Catechism of the Catholic Church and discover some serious confusion.

"Justification is conferred in Baptism, the sacrament of faith. It conforms us to the righteousness of God, who makes us inwardly just by the power of his mercy."
From the CCC

The Council of Trent condemned the biblical doctrine of justification by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption.

CANON 9: "If any one saith, that by faith alone the impious is justified; in such wise as to mean, that nothing else is required to co-operate in order to the obtaining the grace of Justification, and that it is not in any way necessary, that he be prepared and disposed by the movement of his own will; let him be anathema."...
Canon 30: "If any one saith, that, after the grace of Justification has been received, to every penitent sinner the guilt is remitted, and the debt of eternal punishment is blotted out in such wise, that there remains not any debt of temporal punishment to be discharged either in this world, or in the next in Purgatory, before the entrance to the kingdom of heaven can be opened (to him); let him be anathema."
 

Smooth

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2019
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What do you do with all of the many dire warnings
-- by Jesus to everybody in the 4 gospels!
and
-- by John, Paul, Peter, James, Jude etc. to the churches in the epistles!

Answer: ignore them, reject them, etc.
Answer: Living out Psalm 31:5 “Into your hands Lord I commit my spirit.”

It’s all about having faith in Him, not yourself. Carry on, friend.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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That could well be the case. Unfortunately the *doctors* and *scholars* of the RCC could not really understand justification. Check out the Catechism of the Catholic Church and discover some serious confusion.

"Justification is conferred in Baptism, the sacrament of faith. It conforms us to the righteousness of God, who makes us inwardly just by the power of his mercy."
From the CCC

The Council of Trent condemned the biblical doctrine of justification by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption.

CANON 9: "If any one saith, that by faith alone the impious is justified; in such wise as to mean, that nothing else is required to co-operate in order to the obtaining the grace of Justification, and that it is not in any way necessary, that he be prepared and disposed by the movement of his own will; let him be anathema."...
Canon 30: "If any one saith, that, after the grace of Justification has been received, to every penitent sinner the guilt is remitted, and the debt of eternal punishment is blotted out in such wise, that there remains not any debt of temporal punishment to be discharged either in this world, or in the next in Purgatory, before the entrance to the kingdom of heaven can be opened (to him); let him be anathema."
Yes I know, for the RCCers one's justification is never complete and only comes to fruition after this life. (How else are they going to keep purgatory alive?)
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Duz I hafta answer this?
Is it okay if Paul doesn't give dire warnings in Romans 5?
Duz he hafta give dire warnings in EVERY chapter?
Or, can he address different topics in different chapters?
I wish you had explained all of this to him before he died.
Again, Paul finishes his discourse on justification in Romans 4. He touches on sanctification after that in 5-8. Like I said, you are desperately trying to mix justification in with our works. NO-CAN-DO.
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
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Many don't understand that God's grace is only the beginning.
It is God's beginning of giving certain people the opportunity of being saved.
The beginning is just an opportunity to use our free-will to God's satisfaction.
It is NOT God's work alone ... man has to co-operate to God's satisfaction.
Our salvation is a process, and the new covenant demands the co-operation of both parties!
The new covenant is NOT about robots (with no free will) being saved by God's grace.
The LORD does NOT want robots in heaven with Him ... Wake up. folks!
(Ref: not me, only the NT)
Agreed.

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:21-23

"And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
For many are called, but few are chosen." Matt 22:12-14
 

Leastamongmany

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2019
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Usa
This post has more “I”s than a month old potato!
You are not in the least funny Pennhead! I declared my declaration of FAITH in Him and it stands in the word! You can be nasty,maybe the Lord needs to set a watch on your tongue!🌞🌞🌞
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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You are not in the least funny Pennhead! I declared my declaration of FAITH in Him and it stands in the word! You can be nasty,maybe the Lord needs to set a watch on your tongue!🌞🌞🌞
Lighten up Lawhana! If you're gonna wade into the BDF deep end you have to grow a little thicker skin, and be able to take a jab. Or just stay in the shallow end. We brothers and sisters like to wrestle. There's no intent to hurt each other. If you feel someone's intent is to hurt you, then you should ignore them. I have done that with several bitter, hurtful people here. But I see them as broken. I just don't want to right now deal with their bitter, brokenness.

There's not a person here who agrees exactly with every other poster. You have to be able to take criticism of your positions. Your post IMO definitely displays a lot of trust in yourself to maintain Salvation. I disagree with that, or ANYTHING else that doesn't give total credit to Jesus for saving and keeping us saved. DON'T TAKE EVERYTHING TO HEART! And recognize the possibility that you are wrong on some stuff, just like EVERYONE is wrong on SOME stuff.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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Tennessee
No one led me astray. :) I had meant to put a disagree all along, I just hit the wrong one due to not being fully awake, and not having my coffee yet.

The part I disagree with is, that you choose to abide with Him, when it's actually the opposite. HE keeps us abiding in Him by giving us His love. :) With such perfect love being offered, why would we ever want to leave?

That doesn't mean we don't still sin. We do, but we repent and are forgiven.
I get the not fully awake part. :)
 

Leastamongmany

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2019
3,270
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Lighten up Lawhana! If you're gonna wade into the BDF deep end you have to grow a little thicker skin, and be able to take a jab. Or just stay in the shallow end. We brothers and sisters like to wrestle. There's no intent to hurt each other. If you feel someone's intent is to hurt you, then you should ignore them. I have done that with several bitter, hurtful people here. But I see them as broken. I just don't want to right now deal with their bitter, brokenness.

There's not a person here who agrees exactly with every other poster. You have to be able to take criticism of your positions. Your post IMO definitely displays a lot of trust in yourself to maintain Salvation. I disagree with that, or ANYTHING else that doesn't give total credit to Jesus for saving and keeping us saved. DON'T TAKE EVERYTHING TO HEART! And recognize the possibility that you are wrong on some stuff, just like EVERYONE is wrong on SOME stuff.
You might be right,only in that I need to lighten up! I put "NO" trust in myself to even keep my clock set right! I know that I have "NO" power, only weaknesses! The intent certainly appears to be there when nasty remarks are made! Maybe NOT so much to hurt but to convince others that the "I SAYS"are always right! I see no learning in such rigid stances! Does ANY of this theological differences matter in the end! I came here seeking loving fellowship from the family of God! A healthy debate is one thing,it stirs our consciousness to more awareness! I see arguing! How do you all think God see cc? I am sorry I called you a Pennhead,you know my name is yours Ed? I really don't believe anyone here doesn't know about how to be saved! I am slowing learning some of you but it's like pulling teeth from a worm! I do thank you for the kindness in this rebuke,but I too can get heated like dc. I do try to temper it with love,but I haven't reached perfection yet! Again I am sorry! Bkessings. BTW I can receive correction. Thank you again!😣😣😣
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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You might be right,only in that I need to lighten up! I put "NO" trust in myself to even keep my clock set right! I know that I have "NO" power, only weaknesses! The intent certainly appears to be there when nasty remarks are made! Maybe NOT so much to hurt but to convince others that the "I SAYS"are always right! I see no learning in such rigid stances! Does ANY of this theological differences matter in the end! I came here seeking loving fellowship from the family of God! A healthy debate is one thing,it stirs our consciousness to more awareness! I see arguing! How do you all think God see cc? I am sorry I called you a Pennhead,you know my name is yours Ed? I really don't believe anyone here doesn't know about how to be saved! I am slowing learning some of you but it's like pulling teeth from a worm! I do thank you for the kindness in this rebuke,but I too can get heated like dc. I do try to temper it with love,but I haven't reached perfection yet! Again I am sorry! Bkessings. BTW I can receive correction. Thank you again!😣😣😣
No worries! Be blessed sister.
 
S

SpoonJuly

Guest
You might be right,only in that I need to lighten up! I put "NO" trust in myself to even keep my clock set right! I know that I have "NO" power, only weaknesses! The intent certainly appears to be there when nasty remarks are made! Maybe NOT so much to hurt but to convince others that the "I SAYS"are always right! I see no learning in such rigid stances! Does ANY of this theological differences matter in the end! I came here seeking loving fellowship from the family of God! A healthy debate is one thing,it stirs our consciousness to more awareness! I see arguing! How do you all think God see cc? I am sorry I called you a Pennhead,you know my name is yours Ed? I really don't believe anyone here doesn't know about how to be saved! I am slowing learning some of you but it's like pulling teeth from a worm! I do thank you for the kindness in this rebuke,but I too can get heated like dc. I do try to temper it with love,but I haven't reached perfection yet! Again I am sorry! Bkessings. BTW I can receive correction. Thank you again!😣😣😣
There are two things you said I would like to address.
First, you asked "Does any of this theological differenced really matter?"
Secondly, you said 'I really don't believe anyone here doesn't know about how to be saved."

There are some on this site that offer many different paths to salvation when the Scripture speaks on only one.
If one's theology on the way of salvation is wrong, than they may very well not be saved.
They also are leading others down the wrong path that may lead to eternal Hell.

So it is my belief that proper theology is of the upmost importance.
And if one is on the wrong path to salvation, that is the greatest tragedy of all.
It breaks my heart, but it seems that some may be lost, based on what they say they are trusting in for eternal life.

I make no claim to having all the answers, but truth is truth, right is right, wrong is wrong, and there is no almost when it comes to the Scripture.
 
Jul 20, 2019
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Let me help with a parable of my own. A young couple go to a mega church, say a prayer, declare Jesus is there lord and saviour, then that afternoon, they go to Las Vegas for the week, fornicate, get drunk, gamble most of their savings, snort some cocaine then return home Saturday. Sunday they are back at church worshipping God and declaring Jesus lord and savour. Are they saved? Hell no!