Carry your cross, follow Jesus, die to self -- for eternal life

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#21
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#21
Stephen63 said:
Wow..... And I thought I was harsh the past couple of days.:(
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Look, you guys can claim the truth is harsh and my statements are harsh all the day long....

Paul was clear....the bible is clear and there is no contradictions....

Those who claim salvation is based upon faith and then embellished by works preach a false gospel of a different kind with no power to save...it is not unbiblical and or wrong for me to identify it is heresy....a working for salvation is contrary to the truth.....everything I said in that post is factual based upon the word of God, the definitions of words and context bro........

Oh foolish Galatians, who has BEWITCHED YOU...having begun in faith are you now made perfect by the flesh (works) and the answer is NO.....
 
InSpiritInTruth

InSpiritInTruth

Banned
#22
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
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#22
dcontroversal said:
Paul was clear.....

King James Version
I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
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And now the rest of the story....
Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. :)
 
Stephen63

Stephen63

Banned
#23
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
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#23
dcontroversal said:
Look, you guys can claim the truth is harsh and my statements are harsh all the day long....

Paul was clear....the bible is clear and there is no contradictions....

Those who claim salvation is based upon faith and then embellished by works preach a false gospel of a different kind with no power to save...it is not unbiblical and or wrong for me to identify it is heresy....a working for salvation is contrary to the truth.....everything I said in that post is factual based upon the word of God, the definitions of words and context bro........

Oh foolish Galatians, who has BEWITCHED YOU...having begun in faith are you now made perfect by the flesh (works) and the answer is NO.....
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The Galatian problem was they went back to the OT Law..... not personal works.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#24
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#24
InSpiritInTruth said:
And now the rest of the story....
Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. :)
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Both statements are applied unto Paul......

With his mind he served the law of God and with his flesh the law of sin.....nice try.....That which is born is SPIRIT is SPIRIT and that which is born of the FLESH IS (still) FLESH.........did PAUL die in the flesh.......yep when he got his head whacked off........
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#25
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#25
Stephen63 said:
The Galatian problem was they went back to the OT Law..... not personal works.
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Think about what you just said....IF MIXING FAITH WITH the KEEPING of OT LAW and the WORKS of OT LAW does not SAVE and is considered a false gospel with no power to save and is double cursed...how can PERSONAL WORKS be any better?

If you would just ponder that and be honest Stephen.......if the works of the LAW wont save me or keep me saved or help me stay saved how in the world could any personal works do any better.........? ESPECIALLY since our RIGHTEOUSNESSESS are as filthy rags in light of the righteousness of Christ........
 
InSpiritInTruth

InSpiritInTruth

Banned
#26
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
78
0
#26
dcontroversal said:
Both statements are applied unto Paul......

With his mind he served the law of God and with his flesh the law of sin.....nice try.....That which is born is SPIRIT is SPIRIT and that which is born of the FLESH IS (still) FLESH.........did PAUL die in the flesh.......yep when he got his head whacked off........
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Nope, Paul explained in Romans 6 why he was speaking that way, as he was speaking to their carnal condition....

Romans 6:19
I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

Also you do not understand what the word flesh means there, it's not the fleshy body but the sin nature working in the old man of flesh....

That which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the flesh [SUP]G4561[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] flesh; [SUP]G4561[/SUP] and [SUP]G2532[/SUP] that which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the Spirit [SUP]G4151[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] spirit. [SUP]G4151[/SUP]

G4561.......Bible usage.....the sensuous nature of man, "the animal nature"

      1. without any suggestion of depravity
      2. the animal nature with cravings which incite to sin
      3. the physical nature of man as subject to suffering
  2. a living creature (because possessed of a body of flesh) whether man or beast
  3. the flesh, denotes mere human nature, the earthly nature of man apart from divine influence, and therefore prone to sin and opposed to God

So your dual nature theology is false. :)
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#27
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#27
InSpiritInTruth said:
Nope, Paul explained in Romans 6 why he was speaking that way, as he was speaking to their carnal condition....

Romans 6:19
I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

Also you do not understand what the word flesh means there, it's not the fleshy body but the sin nature working in the old man of flesh....

That which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the flesh [SUP]G4561[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] flesh; [SUP]G4561[/SUP] and [SUP]G2532[/SUP] that which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the Spirit [SUP]G4151[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] spirit. [SUP]G4151[/SUP]

G4561.......Bible usage.....the sensuous nature of man, "the animal nature"

      1. without any suggestion of depravity
      2. the animal nature with cravings which incite to sin
      3. the physical nature of man as subject to suffering
  2. a living creature (because possessed of a body of flesh) whether man or beast
  3. the flesh, denotes mere human nature, the earthly nature of man apart from divine influence, and therefore prone to sin and opposed to God

So your dual nature theology is false. :)
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Nice try but no cigar....flesh is synonymous with our fallen nature, sin, sinful flesh etc..........and the dual nature if found through the whole bible....and you just called Jesus a liar and false.....

Jesus to his saved immersed disciples.....The spirit is indeed willing, but the flesh is weak....it is your view that is false....and you will find out soon enough pal!
 
InSpiritInTruth

InSpiritInTruth

Banned
#28
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
78
0
#28
dcontroversal said:
Nice try but no cigar....flesh is synonymous with our fallen nature, sin, sinful flesh etc..........and the dual nature if found through the whole bible....and you just called Jesus a liar and false.....

Jesus to his saved immersed disciples.....The spirit is indeed willing, but the flesh is weak....it is your view that is false....and you will find out soon enough pal!
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I just proved you wrong by scripture again, and you say I call Jesus a liar? How childish. Jesus also said the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak in the garden before the apostles were born again of the Spirit and empowered from on high, so that don't fly either. Anyone who is born again of the Holy Spirit would know that we do not have a dual nature and the confusion of a "disassociated identity" crisis as you phonies believe. LOL

You reprobates believe your spirit is perfect BUT you are still trapped in a sinful body, which is why you say you cannot stop sinning. You guys are not sealed by the Holy Spirit, and so you are WIDE OPEN for attack. Good luck wit dat. :)
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#29
#29
InSpiritInTruth said:
I just proved you wrong by scripture again, and you say I call Jesus a liar? How childish. Jesus also said the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak in the garden before the apostles were born again of the Spirit and empowered from on high, so that don't fly either. Anyone who is born again of the Holy Spirit would know that we do not have a dual nature and the confusion of a "disassociated identity" crisis as you phonies believe. LOL

You reprobates believe your spirit is perfect BUT you are still trapped in a sinful body, which is why you say you cannot stop sinning. You guys are not sealed by the Holy Spirit, and so you are WIDE OPEN for attack. Good luck wit dat. :)
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And the name calling begins again.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#30
#30
Blain said:
In my view when I became saved I lost nothing because at that point my life and everything I owned was trash in my eyes, in coming to Christ I lost nothing but gained everything. Losing ones self is an ongoing process in fact it's normal for a believer to have been saved 40 years and yet still is losing himself and some are more keen to being humble and about others far before themselves than others we all have strengths and weaknesses.

But there is one thing for sure God has to be first and number in our lives and hearts. For some faith is a way of living or a hobby for others it's a fiery passion
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Can you elaborate on your last statement? I agree with most of your post but don't understand the difference you seem to make. For me faith affects my way of life and sometimes God makes my faith burn like a fire...sometimes it's brighter than others, but faith is more than a feeling or a rule book to follow. It is a gift from God,
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#31
#31
InSpiritInTruth said:
Nope, Paul explained in Romans 6 why he was speaking that way, as he was speaking to their carnal condition....

Romans 6:19
I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

Also you do not understand what the word flesh means there, it's not the fleshy body but the sin nature working in the old man of flesh....

That which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the flesh [SUP]G4561[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] flesh; [SUP]G4561[/SUP] and [SUP]G2532[/SUP] that which is born [SUP]G1080[/SUP] of [SUP]G1537[/SUP] the Spirit [SUP]G4151[/SUP] is [SUP]G2076[/SUP] spirit. [SUP]G4151[/SUP]

G4561.......Bible usage.....the sensuous nature of man, "the animal nature"

      1. without any suggestion of depravity
      2. the animal nature with cravings which incite to sin
      3. the physical nature of man as subject to suffering
  2. a living creature (because possessed of a body of flesh) whether man or beast
  3. the flesh, denotes mere human nature, the earthly nature of man apart from divine influence, and therefore prone to sin and opposed to God

So your dual nature theology is false. :)
Click to expand...
Not sure I understand your distinction between the carnal nature and the human physical body?

If you are going against the Gnostic teaching that all flesh is innately evil, then I agree. Our bodies are fallen and will die. However, God made Adam and Eve and said they were good.

Our bodies have good within and are not evil.,(main proof is that Jesus had a human body and he knows no evil.) however sin and the world has corrupted our hearts and minds. We need to continually look to God to get rid of the lies. To tear down the spiritual strongholds and know truth from deceptions.

We also need to learn to tame our tongues and not curse when we should pray and speak in gentleness and love. For wisdom from above is spoken in love.
 
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InSpiritInTruth

InSpiritInTruth

Banned
#32
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
78
0
#32
Persuaded said:
And the name calling begins again.
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And you are pretty good at it too! Remember this one.....

Persuaded said:
I will add that he is a liar, a false teacher, an agent of Satan, has the spirit of anti-christ, and shows no sign of salvation.
Now if you want to ban me for speaking the truth, do so.
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Nice huh? :)
 
InSpiritInTruth

InSpiritInTruth

Banned
#33
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
78
0
#33
Ariel82 said:
Not sure I understand your distinction between the carnal nature and the human physical body?

If you are going against the Gnostic teaching that all flesh is innately evil, then I agree. Our bodies are fallen and will die. However, God made Adam and Eve and said they were good.

Our bodies have good within and are not evil.,(main proof is that Jesus had a human body and he knows no evil.) however sin and the world has corrupted our hearts and minds. We need to continually look to God to get rid of the lies. To tear down the spiritual strongholds and know truth from deceptions.

We also need to learn to tame our tongues and not curse when we should pray and speak in gentleness and love. For wisdom from above is spoken in love.
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Yes their false doctrine is based in Gnosticism. And I tend to get a bit upset when someone says I am calling Jesus a liar, and also having to endure almost 2 years of their constant lies, false accusations, rude comments, and all the evil ways this pack of reprobates work and manage to have good christian people banned, while somehow they still remain in this forum. So you'll have to excuse me when I do not come in the spirit of meekness, but with a big rod of correction. Have a nice evening. :)
 
S

samuel23

Banned
#34
Dec 2, 2016
1,652
26
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#34
Faith vs works...the problem is there can be a thin line sometimes in this area between faith(grace) vs works. Here are my thoughts. We are saved entirely by grace through faith in the sense that I committed to God and asked Jesus to be my Savior(my faith) and God responded to my faith by forgiving my sins and giving me His Spirit(grace). If I had died within that hour I would have went to be with God even though I had done no works at all. So we are saved by the grace of God. Most people live past one hour and some over a half century, also during that time Satan will attempt to cause the believer to cease in their commitment to God. If Satan can break our resolve and we lose interest in our commitment to God then we can lose our way. OK, any person who has committed to God through Christ will practice righteous acts that Jesus and the church fathers taught us to practice. The continued practice of Godly acts are evidence that we are remaining in our faith in Christ. A stopping of the practice of Godly acts are evidence that we are not remaining in our faith in Christ. Now, there is one other part of the equation, there are folks who see Christians practice good works and knowing that this defines a Christian they begin to do good works with the belief that God will accept the good works and accept them as saved. Not so, the practice of good works themselves cannot save a person. Also there are Christians who become so caught up in good works so that their faith removes from God and goes to the good works, this is very dangerous because the person is not really practicing faith in God.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#35
#35
InSpiritInTruth said:
Yes their false doctrine is based in Gnosticism. And I tend to get a bit upset when someone says I am calling Jesus a liar, and also having to endure almost 2 years of their constant lies, false accusations, rude comments, and all the evil ways this pack of reprobates work and manage to have good christian people banned, while somehow they still remain in this forum. So you'll have to excuse me when I do not come in the spirit of meekness, but with a big rod of correction. Have a nice evening. :)
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Do you have any siblings?

What happens when you tried to punish your siblings for their wrong doing instead of allowing your parents to correct them?

The only person that should wield the rod of correction are those entrusted by the Father with His authority to do so.

God calls us to humbleness. To speak in love and truth so even those who oppose us might be ashamed and can find no fault in our behavior even if they don't understand or agree with our doctrine.

It's 10:36pm, but I had a lovely evening with my kids. Thanks.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#36
#36
InSpiritInTruth said:
And you are pretty good at it too! Remember this one.....



Nice huh? :)
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Give no place to the devil.

Y'all both need to forgive each other and place one another on ignore if you can't see each other as brothers.

God says to not give place to the devil and by both of your post, you both are holding a grudge.

Yeah I probably will get blasted for saying anything so I will simply post a Bible verse that I hope you will pray and ask God about.

Ephesians 4
“Be angry, and do not sin”: do not let the sun go down on your wrath, nor give place to the deviI.

It's not a sin to be angry, but it is one not to give it to God and forgive the hurts dealt upon you by others. Turn the other cheek. Go the extra mile. Bless those who revile you,bless not curse.

God's way is very different than the world's.
 
Z

ZacharyB

Banned
#37
Oct 10, 2015
544
6
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#37
Persuaded said:
I do not have to "maintain" my salvation, I am kept by the one who saved me.
I strive daily to serve my Lord and Savior.
Some times I fail, sometimes I succeed.
But regardless of my success or failure my salvation is secure in Jesus.
I working/striving is because I am saved not to keep me saved.
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When you fail, do you sincerely repent? ... as in 1 John 1:7-9

You have been horrendously deceived about a guaranteed salvation!
Multitudes of dire warnings are in the NT for a purpose.

Just one example, okay? ...

About 10 NT verses warn us that ...
The believer must endure in his/her faith until the end of life to receive eternal life!

Do you desire to see these verses?
Answer: No, thank you anyway.

The TESTS of your faith are soon upon you:
1) severe Christian persecution
2) severe pressure to take the mark of the beast

The NT warns: If you fail either of these tests, you lose eternal life.
 
Z

ZacharyB

Banned
#38
Oct 10, 2015
544
6
0
#38
Blain said:
I see no reason to (maintain) my salvation by works I don't do this for my salvation I do it because of my salvation. I do it for rewards but the rewards I seek is to know more of him and I also do it because I love but I do it even more so because I truly admire and adore who he is everything about him fascinates me and I want to be just like him because of how much he baffles me simply because of who he is.

His way of seeing his way of thinking his way of being every detail about who he is amazes and fascinates me and so I very much want to be just like him in that way. This is why everyday I continue to try to lose myself so I can gain him
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Well, this is all fantastic!
IMO, you have the correct heart attitude towards the Lord ... and you will make it.

However, I'm not preaching to you ...
but to those "believers" who think they are A-OK by living in habitual sin.
They MUST repent of this ... because they are on their way to Hell.
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#39
#39
ZacharyB said:
When you fail, do you sincerely repent? ... as in 1 John 1:7-9

You have been horrendously deceived about a guaranteed salvation!
Multitudes of dire warnings are in the NT for a purpose.

Just one example, okay? ...

About 10 NT verses warn us that ...
The believer must endure in his/her faith until the end of life to receive eternal life!

Do you desire to see these verses?
Answer: No, thank you anyway.

The TESTS of your faith are soon upon you:
1) severe Christian persecution
2) severe pressure to take the mark of the beast

The NT warns: If you fail either of these tests, you lose eternal life.
Click to expand...
No, like Abraham I believe God.
My faith is in God.
You are basing your salvation on what you are doing.
Therefore your faith, hope, and belief is in self.
 
Z

ZacharyB

Banned
#40
Oct 10, 2015
544
6
0
#40
Stephen63 said:
"Dying" to self is a real work of faith. There are days it seems to take everything God has given us to beat the 'ole boy into submission. Dying hurts. It grieves our flesh. But God gives us favor & ability to perform what He requires.:)
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To go along with this ...
Jesus said we MUST suffer the grief, suffering, tribulation, etc. that He did.
Even a martyr's death like He did ... for some of His followers.

A WHOLE LOT is required of us ... to be found "approved" of Him who is the LORD.

Don't forget, W. E. Vine said that Christ "knowing" us (n Matthew 7:21) means "approving of us"!

He doesn't approve of anyone who trusts in free-grace OSAS w/o responsibility!

Obedience to Him is just expected ... it is NOT works.
 
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