Choosing a Denomination

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Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,958
113
#81
Angela, not trying to be argumentative, but it sounds as if you are talking about what is known as the "Boston movement".... especially with the being baptized into their church, and the works for salvation doctrine. That cult of people that CALL themselves "Church of Christ" is no closer to the mainstream churches of Christ than the Westboro Baptists are to the mainstream southern Baptists. Night and day.
I know for a fact that mainstream CofC DEFINITELY doesn't believe you are baptized into their church... in fact, that's one of the bigger "disagreements" they have had with the Baptist church over the years. "You don't get baptized into a church, you get baptized into Christ and His body".... I've had that hammered into me all my life.
Works salvation is not taught, either... at least no more than any other denomination, or group of Christians. There are always some misguided folks that seem to think that the more they DO, the better "chance" they have for salvation. It's human nature to think we have to "earn" our way in. It's WRONG, but it's human.
There ARE a lot of CofC foks that believe you aren't saved until you are baptized... there are several scriptures that indicate that. There are also a lot of scriptures that say you are saved by faith. I believe that it is a combination of both.. your salvation is a free gift, no works required, but baptism is the normal and correct response to your acceptance of that free gift. I don't think it's an option. It's sort of like a baby being born... being brought forth from the womb is a free gift.. the baby doesn't have to "do" anything... but to continue enjoying the free gift, the baby has to breathe. It's the natural, correct, and necessary response to the free gift of birth. Baptism is similar to that.
If you AREN'T baptized, are you NOT saved? I'm glad I'm not the one to decide that. That's strictly up to our Father. Some scriptures seem to say that, which is why the CofC's say "it's necessary".

And their stance on instrumental music is certainly not "unbiblical". At worst, it is misguided, perhaps, in the sense that too much emphasis is placed on it, but it is absolutely biblically based. There are no scriptures that indicate the first century church used instruments in their house worship meetings. The closest you can find are OT scriptures referring to David playing the lyre, etc.. thing like that.
Well, I've gone on too long as it is... just wanted to clarify a few things...
Well, I got my information first hand from an American from Wyoming who was raised in CoC, who went to my Baptist church, and had repudiated the CoC doctrines, and a Canadian couple who also attended that same Baptist church, who still believed in a lot of the doctrine. In fact the husband declined to be a deacon, because he disagreed with so much of the Baptist statements of faith, especially the issue of baptism.

I also have read quite a bit about it, and seen the posts by CoC people here, who said exactly what I did about doctrine. You may have gone to a church that was not mainstream, which is good for you, for sure. Here are some quotes from Gotanswers.org

"One “minor” issue is the Church of Christ policy of not allowing musical instruments in their church services. While we entirely agree that a church is well within the freedom God gives to not use musical instruments in worship, the problem is that some within the Church of Christ are fanatically against musical instruments. Some are fanatical to the point of declaring any church that uses musical instruments as not being a true, biblical, or godly church. Such dogmatism on a clearly non-essential issue is often the mark of a cult, not the mark of a good biblical church.

A second issue is the fact that some in the Church of Christ claim to be “the one true church,” outside of which there is no salvation. By no means do all Church of Christ members believe this, but it is prevalent enough to warrant concern. Some go so far as to argue that since the name is “Church of Christ,” that indicates that the church / denomination is the one and only true Church of the Lord Jesus. This is completely unbiblical. There is no one church or denomination that encompasses the entire Body of Christ. The “one true church of Christ” is comprised of all those who have, by grace through faith, personally received Jesus Christ as Savior. The Church is composed of true believers everywhere, no matter the local church or denominational affiliation. The claim of exclusive access to salvation is another common identification of a cult, not the teaching of a good biblical church.

A third and very important issue is the Church of Christ’s emphasis on baptism as being necessary for salvation. Church of Christ advocates point to Scriptures such as Acts 2:38, John 3:5, Mark 16:16, 1 Peter 3:21, and Acts 22:16as biblical evidence that baptism is required for salvation. There is no denying that baptism is very important. Baptism is intended to be an initial act of obedience to Christ, an illustration of Christ’s death and resurrection, a public declaration of faith in Christ, a step of identification with Him, and a proclamation of desire to follow Him. In the minds of the apostles and early Christians, baptism was so inextricably linked with salvation that the two were viewed as inseparable. The idea that a person could receive Christ as Savior and not be baptized was completely foreign to the early church.

With that said, however, baptism is not required for salvation. There are biblically plausible and contextually valid interpretations of each of the above Scriptures that do not indicate baptism as being necessary for salvation. There are many Scriptures that declare salvation to be received by faith / believing, with no mention of baptism or any other requirement (John 3:16; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8-9). If baptism is necessary for salvation, these Scriptures are in error and the Bible is contradictory.

Church of Christ advocates argue that when the Bible speaks of salvation “by faith,” it is speaking of a living faith, a faith that produces works of obedience, such as baptism and confession (Romans 10:9-10). They do not claim that baptism is a work that earns salvation, or in any sense makes a person worthy of salvation. Rather, the Church of Christ teaches that baptism is a work that God requires before He grants salvation. For the Church of Christ, baptism and confession are no different from faith and repentance—they are what God requires before He grants salvation to a person. The problem with this is that, while it may seem to be a subtle difference from the biblical doctrine of salvation by grace through faith, it is in fact a crucially important difference."

Is the Church of Christ a good biblical church?
 

hornetguy

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2016
7,548
2,027
113
#82
In the minds of the apostles and early Christians, baptism was so inextricably linked with salvation that the two were viewed as inseparable. The idea that a person could receive Christ as Savior and not be baptized was completely foreign to the early church.

With that said, however, baptism is not required for salvation.
So, even though the apostles, (who should know EXACTLY what was intended, since they were sent out by none other than Jesus Christ) taught and believed that baptism and salvation were linked, the author decides on his own that he knows better than them? HE'S decided that baptism is not required? If it came down to who I believed, who do you think it would be? Apostles that spent Jesus' whole ministry in close contact with him, or some dude 2000 years later? Even if I was a little "uncertain", I would certainly err on the side of caution, and go with what the apostles taught.
And, again, the CofC is not the only church that believes they are the one true church. I don't think that makes them a cult at all.. misguided on that point, but not a cult. Honestly, what would you call the church at Corinth, for all the crazy things they were doing and espousing? Cultists? Heretics? Hell-bound? The apostle Paul called them brothers.
The worst thing I can say about the CofC is that some of them are incredibly narrow-minded about some things, but they are still brothers in Christ.
Being fanatical about no musical instruments? Other churches are just as fanatical about HAVING instruments. Which is right? What scripture can you find to support the use of instruments in first century churches? There is at least one scripture that seems to indicate worship is better without them. So, following your scriptural beliefs makes you fanatical?
That article seems to smack of "you don't believe the same way I do, so you are CRAZY" Where's the love? Where's the understanding?
 
M

MsKy

Guest
#83
We are all the body, however, church "shopping" is so difficult!

I was in a NT class and my professor said, "The "enter denomination here" is like Noah's Ark, it's stinks sometimes but it's the best thing afloat".

All denominations have unhealthy and healthy churches. I'd look for a discipleship program. If they don't have some sort of new converts class I would wonder why they don't have new converts? If we aren't sharing Jesus then we are just a country club without beer and better food.

I will put your in my prayer journal this week. I'm asking God to give your wisdom and guidance.
 
S

sparkman

Guest
#84
I grew up going to Sunday school (Baptist then Methodist) but then as a teenager I majorly rebelled against going to church and finally my mom stopped taking me. Now, in my 30s, I believe I'm undergoing a spiritual rebirth that has gradually yet profoundly been changing me for the past 1-2 years, which started when I opened the Bible and began reading.

I'm trying to decide what denomination to devote myself to. I have studied them fairly intensively over the past two years but just can't settle on one. I seem to come back to Episcopal/Lutheran/Methodist, but none seem to be a "perfect" fit, and I like aspects of most denominations ranging from Eastern Orthodox to Southern Baptist to the silent worship of the Quakers.

If I had to state a few things I always come back to it is: a) the practice of humility in worship, b) liturgy is nice as I feel it relates to humility, but I am not interested in Catholicism, c) some of the things I see churchgoers doing makes me wonder if they ever read Matthew 6:5-6 on refraining from prayer as a way to gain attention from others.

Thanks for your guidance.
I was part of a cult as a younger person, and as a result I am very picky about my church fellowship.

I have had great experiences with Christian and Missionary Alliance churches (www.cmalliance.org), Evangelical Free Churches of American (www.efca.org) and 9marks churches (www.9marks.com).

Each of those have church finders on their sites. I would place EFCA first, Christian and Missionary Alliance second, and 9 Marks churches third.

Evangelical Free churches focus on essentials...unity in essentials, charity or love in nonessentials...so they do not judge other churches who have different opinions on non-essentials.

Dress is usually casual or nice casual at these places, with contemporary music but it would vary depending on the specific congregation. And, they are not denominations; they are associations.

If you want, check out my profile. I make a lot of comments about church attendance. This forum has a lot of individuals who are anti-church membership or attendance. I am strongly against this attitude. I think it rejects the truth that God has given the gift of teaching to church leadership, and that the church is meant for spiritual maturity. This forum is not a substitute for local fellowship involvement.